Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam. Allow me to disagree.
1st Argument: It's a bunch of people wanting to make money...
And? What's wrong with making money? Or is it because it hurts WotC bottom line?
Also
Scam: a dishonest scheme; a fraud.
"an insurance scam"
Fraud: wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
"he was convicted of fraud"
a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
"mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds"
Can you prove the OSR is doing any of those things? If so please do fill a legal complaint, Since it involves delivery thru mail I'm sure it could also get the mail fraud charge thrown in.
Once upon a time, people could just walk by a product they didn't want. Now a portion of society has decided it has to be illegal and/or immoral to produce something "they" don't 100% approve of. It must be very frustrating to move through life like that.
Quote from: Almost_Useless on October 03, 2021, 07:28:44 PM
Once upon a time, people could just walk by a product they didn't want. Now a portion of society has decided it has to be illegal and/or immoral to produce something "they" don't 100% approve of. It must be very frustrating to move through life like that.
I mean, I'm sure there's plenty of VALID criticisms to throw at the OSR, but a scam?
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam.
I thought that everything that I disagree with is a scam and or lying grifter? ;D
More seriously though, if you get a book of OSR rules for your money is that a scam? My feeling is not a scam even if I dont like it.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam. Allow me to disagree.
1st Argument: It's a bunch of people wanting to make money...
And? What's wrong with making money? Or is it because it hurts WotC bottom line?
Also
Scam: a dishonest scheme; a fraud.
"an insurance scam"
Fraud: wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
"he was convicted of fraud"
a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
"mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds"
Can you prove the OSR is doing any of those things? If so please do fill a legal complaint, Since it involves delivery thru mail I'm sure it could also get the mail fraud charge thrown in.
Please link to the video for full context.
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 07:42:21 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam. Allow me to disagree.
1st Argument: It's a bunch of people wanting to make money...
And? What's wrong with making money? Or is it because it hurts WotC bottom line?
Also
Scam: a dishonest scheme; a fraud.
"an insurance scam"
Fraud: wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
"he was convicted of fraud"
a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
"mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds"
Can you prove the OSR is doing any of those things? If so please do fill a legal complaint, Since it involves delivery thru mail I'm sure it could also get the mail fraud charge thrown in.
Please link to the video for full context.
No, feel free to use google tho.
Quote from: Shasarak on October 03, 2021, 07:41:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam.
I thought that everything that I disagree with is a scam and or lying grifter? ;D
More seriously though, if you get a book of OSR rules for your money is that a scam? My feeling is not a scam even if I dont like it.
Well you see, according to the guy you should go buy AD&D1e or 2e from DT and since the OSR products aren't D&D therefore...
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:48:28 PM
Quote from: Shasarak on October 03, 2021, 07:41:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam.
I thought that everything that I disagree with is a scam and or lying grifter? ;D
More seriously though, if you get a book of OSR rules for your money is that a scam? My feeling is not a scam even if I dont like it.
Well you see, according to the guy you should go buy AD&D1e or 2e from DT and since the OSR products aren't D&D therefore...
If that's what you want to play, then sure, buy the real thing over a clone, but I understand that many ORR games are more than just clones these days. Those offer new and different stuff yet are still OSR, so not a scam (assuming that's the whole message of the video that's a thorn in your ass).
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 07:57:12 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:48:28 PM
Quote from: Shasarak on October 03, 2021, 07:41:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam.
I thought that everything that I disagree with is a scam and or lying grifter? ;D
More seriously though, if you get a book of OSR rules for your money is that a scam? My feeling is not a scam even if I dont like it.
Well you see, according to the guy you should go buy AD&D1e or 2e from DT and since the OSR products aren't D&D therefore...
If that's what you want to play, then sure, buy the real thing over a clone, but I understand that many ORR games are more than just clones these days. Those offer new and different stuff yet are still OSR, so not a scam (assuming that's the whole message of the video that's a thorn in your ass).
Quote@GeekyBugle It is good to know what someones intention is(making money, or they wouldn't be here). Also pushing something that only leads to confusing people(The OSR), I don't see that being a benefit to anyone(other than people who want to make money).
Those who lack the common sense to understand that the OSR only exist(currently) to help people get paid, or they lack any real intelligence and because of their ignorance they degrade what I have pointed out, those people are not really worth listening to in my opinion.
No where in what I said, am I saying lets make a law against people making money. I think the OSR draws a lot fake people, that preach politics(not because they care) and everything else to get paid. They don't care if they make a mess of things while they get paid. All about those views and the dollar bills yo.
You don't have to care, but you also don't have to walk around with your head in the sand.
You are not here to consider what I said in a fair way. Boring!
Now fuck off.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:59:51 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 07:57:12 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:48:28 PM
Quote from: Shasarak on October 03, 2021, 07:41:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam.
I thought that everything that I disagree with is a scam and or lying grifter? ;D
More seriously though, if you get a book of OSR rules for your money is that a scam? My feeling is not a scam even if I dont like it.
Well you see, according to the guy you should go buy AD&D1e or 2e from DT and since the OSR products aren't D&D therefore...
If that's what you want to play, then sure, buy the real thing over a clone, but I understand that many ORR games are more than just clones these days. Those offer new and different stuff yet are still OSR, so not a scam (assuming that's the whole message of the video that's a thorn in your ass).
Quote@GeekyBugle It is good to know what someones intention is(making money, or they wouldn't be here). Also pushing something that only leads to confusing people(The OSR), I don't see that being a benefit to anyone(other than people who want to make money).
Those who lack the common sense to understand that the OSR only exist(currently) to help people get paid, or they lack any real intelligence and because of their ignorance they degrade what I have pointed out, those people are not really worth listening to in my opinion.
No where in what I said, am I saying lets make a law against people making money. I think the OSR draws a lot fake people, that preach politics(not because they care) and everything else to get paid. They don't care if they make a mess of things while they get paid. All about those views and the dollar bills yo.
You don't have to care, but you also don't have to walk around with your head in the sand.
You are not here to consider what I said in a fair way. Boring!
Now fuck off.
You so butthurt because others don't like you. So sad.
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 08:18:38 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:59:51 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 07:57:12 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:48:28 PM
Quote from: Shasarak on October 03, 2021, 07:41:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam.
I thought that everything that I disagree with is a scam and or lying grifter? ;D
More seriously though, if you get a book of OSR rules for your money is that a scam? My feeling is not a scam even if I dont like it.
Well you see, according to the guy you should go buy AD&D1e or 2e from DT and since the OSR products aren't D&D therefore...
If that's what you want to play, then sure, buy the real thing over a clone, but I understand that many ORR games are more than just clones these days. Those offer new and different stuff yet are still OSR, so not a scam (assuming that's the whole message of the video that's a thorn in your ass).
Quote@GeekyBugle It is good to know what someones intention is(making money, or they wouldn't be here). Also pushing something that only leads to confusing people(The OSR), I don't see that being a benefit to anyone(other than people who want to make money).
Those who lack the common sense to understand that the OSR only exist(currently) to help people get paid, or they lack any real intelligence and because of their ignorance they degrade what I have pointed out, those people are not really worth listening to in my opinion.
No where in what I said, am I saying lets make a law against people making money. I think the OSR draws a lot fake people, that preach politics(not because they care) and everything else to get paid. They don't care if they make a mess of things while they get paid. All about those views and the dollar bills yo.
You don't have to care, but you also don't have to walk around with your head in the sand.
You are not here to consider what I said in a fair way. Boring!
Now fuck off.
You so butthurt because others don't like you. So sad.
Yeah HappyDerp, that's exactly it.
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 07:42:21 PM
Please link to the video for full context.
CondorDM did the series at his youtube channel.
Quote from: Snowman0147 on October 03, 2021, 08:25:12 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 07:42:21 PM
Please link to the video for full context.
CondorDM did the series at his youtube channel.
Thank you. That will help narrow the search down.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:38:29 PM
I mean, I'm sure there's plenty of VALID criticisms to throw at the OSR, but a scam?
Quote from: Almost_Useless on October 03, 2021, 07:28:44 PM
Once upon a time, people could just walk by a product they didn't want. Now a portion of society has decided it has to be illegal and/or immoral to produce something "they" don't 100% approve of. It must be very frustrating to move through life like that.
RPG Product critiques:
SJW Gamer:"This is an evil racist scam ripping WotC and official D&D off. There are no gay NPCs or combat wheelchairs in this game so it was obviously made by literal Nazis.
We need to boycott, ban, and de-platform not only this game, but its creators, and all their friends.
Why?
Because FUCK Nazi's! That's why.
*runs to twitter to gin up the outrage mob*RPGSite Gamer: "Meh, doesn't do it for me. The lore is a bit over my woke limit, and that whole wheel chair thing is such nonsense. Plus they don't want me to buy their game if I don't agree with their politics! WTF, that's nuts. I don't think I'm gonna give money to people who hate me."
*Starts thread making fun of the game and its creators on the RPGSite*Smart-Boy fence-sitter: *Sees thread mocking stupid SJW gamers and their new hotness woke game* Well, I read the game, and nothing I saw in it was a Big Deal. Why can't you guys just ignore it!? What's wrong with you? Why can't you RPGSite Gamers see that you are doing the
Exact Same Thing as the SJWs!
Just thought I'd get this out of the way...
Quote from: Jaeger on October 03, 2021, 08:27:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:38:29 PM
I mean, I'm sure there's plenty of VALID criticisms to throw at the OSR, but a scam?
Quote from: Almost_Useless on October 03, 2021, 07:28:44 PM
Once upon a time, people could just walk by a product they didn't want. Now a portion of society has decided it has to be illegal and/or immoral to produce something "they" don't 100% approve of. It must be very frustrating to move through life like that.
RPG Product critiques:
SJW Gamer:"This is an evil racist scam ripping WotC and official D&D off. There are no gay NPCs or combat wheelchairs in this game so it was obviously made by literal Nazis.
We need to boycott, ban, and de-platform not only this game, but its creators, and all their friends.
Why?
Because FUCK Nazi's! That's why.
*runs to twitter to gin up the outrage mob*
RPGSite Gamer: "Meh, doesn't do it for me. The lore is a bit over my woke limit, and that whole wheel chair thing is such nonsense. Plus they don't want me to buy their game if I don't agree with their politics! WTF, that's nuts. I don't think I'm gonna give money to people who hate me."
*Starts thread making fun of the game and its creators on the RPGSite*
Smart-Boy fence-sitter: *Sees thread mocking stupid SJW gamers and their new hotness woke game*
Well, I read the game, and nothing I saw in it was a Big Deal. Why can't you guys just ignore it!? What's wrong with you? Why can't you RPGSite Gamers see that you are doing the Exact Same Thing as the SJWs!
Just thought I'd get this out of the way...
You forgot the bit where the sjw rips up the fence and shoves it up the ass of the fence sitter board by board.
Quote from: Jaeger on October 03, 2021, 08:27:09 PM
RPG Product critiques:
SJW Gamer:"This is an evil racist scam ripping WotC and official D&D off.
I love it when SJWs forget about the OGL because it happened more then 7 years ago.
Quote from: Snowman0147 on October 03, 2021, 08:30:35 PM
..
You forgot the bit where the sjw rips up the fence and shoves it up the ass of the fence sitter board by board.
I'd quibble and say it'll be more like:
Smart-Boy fence-sitter: "You know, both sides make good points, and I really think that the only way to move past this silly ideological divide is for both sides to start actually talking to each other!"
SJW Gamer: "Hold on, you said a Nazis made good points!?"
*contacts twitter outrage mob*"Hey, we got ourselves a bona-fide
Nazi lover over here!"
Maybe its just my own ignorance but I always thought that OSR meant different things to different people and was quite a loose concept.
So to pro-WotC crowd, OSR represents a threat, to others a beacon of hope or a way to make some cash etc.
To me at least OSR is just something loosely based on earlier versions of D&D that uses the OGL.
The new Into the Odd Remaster on KS fits my standard for OSR, but also feels like a scam to me in that its asking for 28 quid for sauced up public domain art with lots of empty white space claimed as "better layout." To others it might not be a scam or even OSR, maybe best product ever, award winner, quality remake or whatever else.
My point is I can see things from OP's point of view of fending off the WotC loyalists, but also can see some questionable practices inside the umbrella of OSR. Of course these are done by individuals and not "the OSR" as a whole, which means you can always vote with your wallet if it doesn't contain sufficient value for you as the buyer for the price. For me the specific line after which things become "scammy" is when major focus is placed on exorbitantly lavish editions, alt-covers, reprints, branding, hype and fomo-driven KS marketing. However, if its about OSR getting dogpiled for being an alternative to WotC then OSR over Hasbro any day.
And this is why I didn't link the video or mentioned the name of the individual.
I saw it too. I was hoping it was clickbait, but cringe was posted.
The reason I got excited about various OSR books is because they're advertised as a distillation of the original rules, with better editing and layout, and maybe some widely adopted house rules. To me (especially as someone new to the hobby), that's a much more appealing product than half-assed reprints from WotC.
Pretty much only thing that would make it a scam is if I bought an OSR book (in my case, FMAG) but got a reprint from scans of the original rules.
The thesis of the video is "The OSR is selling you the opportunity to get into old school D&D, but you can buy new copies of the original rules now, so it's a scam."
Except everyone who buys the 1:1 retroclones knows exactly what they're buying, and they want the OSR version in spite of the originals being available.
And the ones that aren't strictly retroclones aren't selling "old school D&D", they're usually selling "a game that feels like old school D&D, the way me and my friends play it".
Cowardly talking smack!
Come here and say that, internet tough guy.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:04:36 PM
And this is why I didn't link the video or mentioned the name of the individual.
Because the guy from the video was going to call you cowardly? Yeah...
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 10:32:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:04:36 PM
And this is why I didn't link the video or mentioned the name of the individual.
Because the guy from the video was going to call you cowardly? Yeah...
Yes HappyDerp that's it, you're getting to the point where I put you in ignore because you're dishonest and a troll.
Edit: It couldn't be because I wanted to talk about his "arguments" and not put him on blast, or send anyone to tell him off... no, it must be because I'm affraid of him saying words on the internet....
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 10:32:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:04:36 PM
And this is why I didn't link the video or mentioned the name of the individual.
Because the guy from the video was going to call you cowardly? Yeah...
Yes HappyDerp that's it, you're getting to the point where I put you in ignore because you're dishonest and a troll.
I don't advocate the "ignore" feature, nor do I advocate banning disruptors or disingenuous posters. However, they crave attention, and the best way to de-fang them is to simply not respond unless they make a relevant, good-faith response. In HD's case, he hardly ever contributes anything of value to the discussion, so just let him babble to himself. It's like training a dog. Only reward him when he does something productive. Granted, working with a dog is easier, since they tend to be more intelligent than HappyDerp...
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 10:32:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:04:36 PM
And this is why I didn't link the video or mentioned the name of the individual.
Because the guy from the video was going to call you cowardly? Yeah...
Yes HappyDerp that's it, you're getting to the point where I put you in ignore because you're dishonest and a troll.
Edit: It couldn't be because I wanted to talk about his "arguments" and not put him on blast, or send anyone to tell him off... no, it must be because I'm affraid of him saying words on the internet....
Must be. It's sad that you live in fear.
Quote from: Eirikrautha on October 03, 2021, 11:08:15 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 10:32:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:04:36 PM
And this is why I didn't link the video or mentioned the name of the individual.
Because the guy from the video was going to call you cowardly? Yeah...
Yes HappyDerp that's it, you're getting to the point where I put you in ignore because you're dishonest and a troll.
I don't advocate the "ignore" feature, nor do I advocate banning disruptors or disingenuous posters. However, they crave attention, and the best way to de-fang them is to simply not respond unless they make a relevant, good-faith response. In HD's case, he hardly ever contributes anything of value to the discussion, so just let him babble to himself. It's like training a dog. Only reward him when he does something productive. Granted, working with a dog is easier, since they tend to be more intelligent than HappyDerp...
Oh, come on now, you don't really think I give two shits about whether you respond or not, do you? My enjoyment is certainly not dependent up you replying to me directly.
Quote from: Eirikrautha on October 03, 2021, 11:08:15 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 10:32:09 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:04:36 PM
And this is why I didn't link the video or mentioned the name of the individual.
Because the guy from the video was going to call you cowardly? Yeah...
Yes HappyDerp that's it, you're getting to the point where I put you in ignore because you're dishonest and a troll.
I don't advocate the "ignore" feature, nor do I advocate banning disruptors or disingenuous posters. However, they crave attention, and the best way to de-fang them is to simply not respond unless they make a relevant, good-faith response. In HD's case, he hardly ever contributes anything of value to the discussion, so just let him babble to himself. It's like training a dog. Only reward him when he does something productive. Granted, working with a dog is easier, since they tend to be more intelligent than HappyDerp...
I don't advocate for banning people (with rare exceptions) but the ignore feature I do think it's a goot tool. I would wish for one where I didn't have to see he answers to me.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PMEdit: It couldn't be because I wanted to talk about his "arguments" and not put him on blast, or send anyone to tell him off... no, it must be because I'm affraid of him saying words on the internet....
I called CondorDM a little bitch all because I asked him a simple question which he gave me attitude. After showing how he wants to be treated CondorDM then deleted my post proving me right. Its in the comments of his second video.
Quote from: Snowman0147 on October 03, 2021, 11:29:07 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PMEdit: It couldn't be because I wanted to talk about his "arguments" and not put him on blast, or send anyone to tell him off... no, it must be because I'm affraid of him saying words on the internet....
I called CondorDM a little bitch all because I asked him a simple question which he gave me attitude. After showing how he wants to be treated CondorDM then deleted my post proving me right. Its in the comments of his second video.
He deleted his answers to me, mustn't be too sure of his position.
Quote from: Snowman0147 on October 03, 2021, 11:29:07 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PMEdit: It couldn't be because I wanted to talk about his "arguments" and not put him on blast, or send anyone to tell him off... no, it must be because I'm affraid of him saying words on the internet....
I called CondorDM a little bitch all because I asked him a simple question which he gave me attitude. After showing how he wants to be treated CondorDM then deleted my post proving me right. Its in the comments of his second video.
He gives attitude and you, naturally, respond by calling him a "little bitch" because? And then, gasp, he deletes your post "proving you right"(?). Where do you find these odd rules you live by?
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 11:42:26 PM
Quote from: Snowman0147 on October 03, 2021, 11:29:07 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 10:55:39 PMEdit: It couldn't be because I wanted to talk about his "arguments" and not put him on blast, or send anyone to tell him off... no, it must be because I'm affraid of him saying words on the internet....
I called CondorDM a little bitch all because I asked him a simple question which he gave me attitude. After showing how he wants to be treated CondorDM then deleted my post proving me right. Its in the comments of his second video.
He deleted his answers to me, mustn't be too sure of his position.
Maybe he didn't want to scare you anymore.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 11:13:57 PM
I don't advocate for banning people (with rare exceptions) but the ignore feature I do think it's a goot tool. I would wish for one where I didn't have to see he answers to me.
It's all about signal to noise. Some folks, it's all noise, all the time. Any signal is apparently accidental.
I used to worry about the length of my ignore list. Then I started noticing that at any given time, 50% to 75% of it are posters that either are banned, about to deliberately provoke a ban, or wander off in a huff. Then I remember signal to noise ratio and don't sweat the exceptions whose apparent sole reason for being here is to create as much noise as possible.
On topic, any "group" that is really a lot of independent actors under a loose umbrella is going to display some bad behavior, get tarred by it by those with an agenda, and survive it because it is independent.
So I googled it. Listened to the two videos. Honestly, his argument doesn't really have any validity. Other than I agree that people can just be shitty no matter who they are. And also, he sounded a bit ... incoherent.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam. Allow me to disagree.
I saw a video where GeekyBugle flew down to Uruguay to play and film a session of Blue Rose with the RPGPundit and it turns out they both loved it as written.
Quote from: estar on October 04, 2021, 01:18:15 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam. Allow me to disagree.
I saw a video where GeekyBugle flew down to Uruguay to play and film a session of Blue Rose with the RPGPundit and it turns out they both loved it as written.
And the unedited film shows them adapting it into a LARP.
I haven't watched it, but I assume this is the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJJTvDTxMeY
On the general topic, I would agree with GeekyBugle. As far as I know, OSR products are delivering exactly what they advertise, so I wouldn't call them a "scam". If the concern is that they're not adding significant creativity and instead just riding on the content and creativity of old-school D&D, then one might call a product a "ripoff" or just overpriced and/or uncreative - but not a scam.
Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on October 04, 2021, 12:57:29 PM
So I googled it. Listened to the two videos. Honestly, his argument doesn't really have any validity.
I listened to the video and, while his argument wasn't the best, his main point was sound. If you want to play an old-school game then just play an old-school game. You don't need any luminaries to try to tell you what counts as an "old-school" game. And while people might like clones, the OSR isn't actually needed for clones to exists as you can plainly see by all the clones of non-OSR games.
GeekyBugle completely mischaracterized the video's main point.
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 01:25:41 PM
And the unedited film shows them adapting it into a LARP.
;D
Quote from: jhkim on October 04, 2021, 01:25:58 PM
I haven't watched it, but I assume this is the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJJTvDTxMeY
If it is that video here is the transscript. I tried to break up into logical paragraphs however it was hard to do for the last half due it being an extended criticism of various osr publishers being hucksters.
Quoteif you want to try old-school dungeons and dragons go purchase the first edition dungeons and dragons the first edition advanced dungeons dragons and the second edition advanced dungeons and dragons you can purchase these you can find these no problem check amazon check all kinds of places easy peasy to get this stuff i'd say do that instead of going to a thing called the osr
a very long infomercial ran by a bunch of cheap car salesmen that are out to make money the osr is a scam in my personal opinion it's not to push old-school gaming forward in a healthy way it's people that want to make money and they'll do whatever is necessary to do so there is a foothold into the hobby through the osr door but only if you give it to them in the osr
they make a thing called clones of the older dnd games which really just means it's a copy and paste with some new words added
now i'm not just degrading all their work down to that but all they're doing is remapping old dnd now in some cases the osr represents non-dungeons and dragons games but guess what you can simply just go research non-dnd games from the 80s 90s yourself and skip what they call the osr do your own purchasing that's how you want to go back and experience the old school don't you know pay attention to the osr don't go bother buying those products go get the original d d that's how you try old school dungeons and dragons
now after that if you want to keep playing these games maybe then go look at the osr right they're doing some different things not too many different things mostly scamming for money in my opinion not that i hate everybody there but it does seem like when you're watching many other videos especially guys that are selling products you know it just seems like it's a long commercial for their product right it's a constant sales pitch and even when they get on to say something other than selling their product like just say something about the the hobby you know how you game what you do you know they say it for a minute but it seems meaningless to them like they're just saying that so you don't blame them for only selling a product to you like they're you know they don't want you to see their videos at some you know commercial coming up just to sell the product they want to be able to put out videos and act like everybody else and then go hey but i'm selling a product to no big issue well let's be honest your main reason for being here is the product and the money and if the product and the money wasn't here would you be protesting negative things would you be part of the conversations would you have up you know you know live stream chats on youtube i don't think most of them would be here if they weren't making money i think that's the revival part it's not that people started playing the game again people started making money off the old game again anyway take care
Duplicate
Quote from: hedgehobbit on October 04, 2021, 01:28:32 PM
I listened to the video and, while his argument wasn't the best, his main point was sound. If you want to play an old-school game then just play an old-school game. You don't need any luminaries to try to tell you what counts as an "old-school" game. And while people might like clones, the OSR isn't actually needed for clones to exists as you can plainly see by all the clones of non-OSR games.
DriveThruRPG has print on demand options as well. $22 plus shipping for the standard color hardback.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17003/Players-Handbook-1e
D&D Rules Cyclopedia
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17171/DD-Rules-Cyclopedia-Basic?src=hottest_filtered
Quote from: estar on October 04, 2021, 02:19:38 PM
Quote from: hedgehobbit on October 04, 2021, 01:28:32 PM
I listened to the video and, while his argument wasn't the best, his main point was sound. If you want to play an old-school game then just play an old-school game. You don't need any luminaries to try to tell you what counts as an "old-school" game. And while people might like clones, the OSR isn't actually needed for clones to exists as you can plainly see by all the clones of non-OSR games.
DriveThruRPG has print on demand options as well. $22 plus shipping for the standard color hardback.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17003/Players-Handbook-1e
D&D Rules Cyclopedia
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17171/DD-Rules-Cyclopedia-Basic?src=hottest_filtered
I never played Basic beyond the second box. After that it was AD&D for my group. I've heard a lot of good things about the Basic RC, so I'm now thinking of picking it up. The DTRPG page makes me a little torn over the softcover vs. hardcover though. I normally always go for hardcover, but in this case, there are a lot of people noting problems/defects with the hardcover...
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 02:47:13 PM
...
I never played Basic beyond the second box. After that it was AD&D for my group. I've heard a lot of good things about the Basic RC, so I'm now thinking of picking it up. The DTRPG page makes me a little torn over the softcover vs. hardcover though. I normally always go for hardcover, but in this case, there are a lot of people noting problems/defects with the hardcover...
There are also those of us who don't want to give WotC our money.
OSR offerings are a viable alternative to avoid this.
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 02:47:13 PM
Quote from: estar on October 04, 2021, 02:19:38 PM
Quote from: hedgehobbit on October 04, 2021, 01:28:32 PM
I listened to the video and, while his argument wasn't the best, his main point was sound. If you want to play an old-school game then just play an old-school game. You don't need any luminaries to try to tell you what counts as an "old-school" game. And while people might like clones, the OSR isn't actually needed for clones to exists as you can plainly see by all the clones of non-OSR games.
DriveThruRPG has print on demand options as well. $22 plus shipping for the standard color hardback.
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17003/Players-Handbook-1e
D&D Rules Cyclopedia
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/17171/DD-Rules-Cyclopedia-Basic?src=hottest_filtered
I never played Basic beyond the second box. After that it was AD&D for my group. I've heard a lot of good things about the Basic RC, so I'm now thinking of picking it up. The DTRPG page makes me a little torn over the softcover vs. hardcover though. I normally always go for hardcover, but in this case, there are a lot of people noting problems/defects with the hardcover...
Mine's okay, but I've barely opened it (it's a backup), so that may not mean anything. I probably have the same printing as the commenter, because I too have multiple copies of Unearthed Arcana that they sent me before finally sending me a Rules Cyclopedia. They really screwed up that rollout.
Quote from: Jaeger on October 04, 2021, 04:19:22 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 02:47:13 PM
...
I never played Basic beyond the second box. After that it was AD&D for my group. I've heard a lot of good things about the Basic RC, so I'm now thinking of picking it up. The DTRPG page makes me a little torn over the softcover vs. hardcover though. I normally always go for hardcover, but in this case, there are a lot of people noting problems/defects with the hardcover...
There are also those of us who don't want to give WotC our money.
OSR offerings are a viable alternative to avoid this.
Yeah, but if what I want to drink is a Coke and I can get a Coke, I'm not going settle for a Sam's Cola. I'm OK with getting the real thing rather than a cheap knock-off...
And look, this circles back to the whole point of the video that prompted this thread.
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 05:37:43 PM
Yeah, but if what I want to drink is a Coke and I can get a Coke, I'm not going settle for a Sam's Cola. I'm OK with getting the real thing rather than a cheap knock-off...
The problem is that if I want to play 2e then I dont just need the official 2e books, I also need to get my extensive house rules folder that I used to cudgel the 2e rules into submission.
Quote from: Shasarak on October 04, 2021, 05:41:51 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 05:37:43 PM
Yeah, but if what I want to drink is a Coke and I can get a Coke, I'm not going settle for a Sam's Cola. I'm OK with getting the real thing rather than a cheap knock-off...
The problem is that if I want to play 2e then I dont just need the official 2e books, I also need to get my extensive house rules folder that I used to cudgel the 2e rules into submission.
Or you could just ignore the player's and DM's option books.
Quote from: Pat on October 04, 2021, 06:22:24 PM
Quote from: Shasarak on October 04, 2021, 05:41:51 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 05:37:43 PM
Yeah, but if what I want to drink is a Coke and I can get a Coke, I'm not going settle for a Sam's Cola. I'm OK with getting the real thing rather than a cheap knock-off...
The problem is that if I want to play 2e then I dont just need the official 2e books, I also need to get my extensive house rules folder that I used to cudgel the 2e rules into submission.
Or you could just ignore the player's and DM's option books.
I read that as the folder contained house rules to fix the core books.
Quote from: Pat on October 04, 2021, 06:22:24 PM
Quote from: Shasarak on October 04, 2021, 05:41:51 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 05:37:43 PM
Yeah, but if what I want to drink is a Coke and I can get a Coke, I'm not going settle for a Sam's Cola. I'm OK with getting the real thing rather than a cheap knock-off...
The problem is that if I want to play 2e then I dont just need the official 2e books, I also need to get my extensive house rules folder that I used to cudgel the 2e rules into submission.
Or you could just ignore the player's and DM's option books.
How does ignoring the Players and DM option books help to fix the official 2e books? ???
Quote from: estar on October 04, 2021, 01:18:15 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam. Allow me to disagree.
I saw a video where GeekyBugle flew down to Uruguay to play and film a session of Blue Rose with the RPGPundit and it turns out they both loved it as written.
You and HappyDerp don't understand not wanting to put the individual on blast right? It's okay, I'm an aspie and many times can't read social cues either.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 06:39:19 PM
It's okay, I'm an aspie and many times can't read social cues either.
Oh, you're not a native English speaker. Here, let me help you. I'm sure you meant to say you're "an asshole" rather than "an aspie," right?
Quote from: hedgehobbit on October 04, 2021, 01:28:32 PM
Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on October 04, 2021, 12:57:29 PM
So I googled it. Listened to the two videos. Honestly, his argument doesn't really have any validity.
I listened to the video and, while his argument wasn't the best, his main point was sound. If you want to play an old-school game then just play an old-school game. You don't need any luminaries to try to tell you what counts as an "old-school" game. And while people might like clones, the OSR isn't actually needed for clones to exists as you can plainly see by all the clones of non-OSR games.
GeekyBugle completely mischaracterized the video's main point.
Did I?
Quote
CondorDM
hace 1 día (editado)
I do see it as a scam now and I think I nailed it here.
Regardless if it did something good in the past, it remains only as a method to make money. The OSR is not well defined, even if 50% of the OSR accepts one definition, there is too much of a fracture among-st people in the OSR to decide what OSR stands for. The OSR has become a negative thorn in our sides that does nothing good in current year.
Quote
CondorDM
hace 2 horas
@Jaeger The OSR in 2021 is not pushing what we do forward, it is platform, a place to bring customers to make money off of them.
You can be fine with that, but that is what it is
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 07:05:15 PM
Quote from: hedgehobbit on October 04, 2021, 01:28:32 PM
Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on October 04, 2021, 12:57:29 PM
So I googled it. Listened to the two videos. Honestly, his argument doesn't really have any validity.
I listened to the video and, while his argument wasn't the best, his main point was sound. If you want to play an old-school game then just play an old-school game. You don't need any luminaries to try to tell you what counts as an "old-school" game. And while people might like clones, the OSR isn't actually needed for clones to exists as you can plainly see by all the clones of non-OSR games.
GeekyBugle completely mischaracterized the video's main point.
Did I?
IMHO, you did not.
I find his venue choice a bit curious - he has an active account here. He has started posts containing YT links to his channel!
But for this one he makes us go to
His YT Channel comments...
Quote
CondorDM
hace 1 día (editado)
I do see it as a scam now and I think I nailed it here.
Regardless if it did something good in the past, it remains only as a method to make money. The OSR is not well defined, even if 50% of the OSR accepts one definition, there is too much of a fracture among-st people in the OSR to decide what OSR stands for. The OSR has become a negative thorn in our sides that does nothing good in current year.
I don't know what he is driving at here...
Quote
CondorDM
hace 2 horas
@Jaeger The OSR in 2021 is not pushing what we do forward, it is platform, a place to bring customers to make money off of them.
You can be fine with that, but that is what it is
He flat-out refused to clarify this.
I get this weird impression that unless you are the IP holder of one of the first games to introduce a particular mechanic or resolution system then any clone or OGL based game is a scam by the standard he seems to be holding to.
Nor does he address the fact that some people may not want to give WotC money. Or that the 2nd hand B/X AD&D1-2 in anything resembling good condition are increasingly expensive, and the clones do the same thing cheaper.
He also had no real response to Ocules point that the OSR has two branches: Straight up Clones. And the offshoots that innovate in play mechanics and genre. Which is the scam? Both?
IMHO he has an awful tough sell on this one.
Quote from: Jaeger on October 04, 2021, 07:33:41 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 07:05:15 PM
Quote from: hedgehobbit on October 04, 2021, 01:28:32 PM
Quote from: Thorn Drumheller on October 04, 2021, 12:57:29 PM
So I googled it. Listened to the two videos. Honestly, his argument doesn't really have any validity.
I listened to the video and, while his argument wasn't the best, his main point was sound. If you want to play an old-school game then just play an old-school game. You don't need any luminaries to try to tell you what counts as an "old-school" game. And while people might like clones, the OSR isn't actually needed for clones to exists as you can plainly see by all the clones of non-OSR games.
GeekyBugle completely mischaracterized the video's main point.
Did I?
IMHO, you did not.
I find his venue choice a bit curious - he has an active account here. He has started posts containing YT links to his channel!
But for this one he makes us go to His YT Channel comments...
Quote
CondorDM
hace 1 día (editado)
I do see it as a scam now and I think I nailed it here.
Regardless if it did something good in the past, it remains only as a method to make money. The OSR is not well defined, even if 50% of the OSR accepts one definition, there is too much of a fracture among-st people in the OSR to decide what OSR stands for. The OSR has become a negative thorn in our sides that does nothing good in current year.
I don't know what he is driving at here...
Quote
CondorDM
hace 2 horas
@Jaeger The OSR in 2021 is not pushing what we do forward, it is platform, a place to bring customers to make money off of them.
You can be fine with that, but that is what it is
He flat-out refused to clarify this.
I get this weird impression that unless you are the IP holder of one of the first games to introduce a particular mechanic or resolution system then any clone or OGL based game is a scam by the standard he seems to be holding to.
Nor does he address the fact that some people may not want to give WotC money. Or that the 2nd hand B/X AD&D1-2 in anything resembling good condition are increasingly expensive, and the clones do the same thing cheaper.
He also had no real response to Ocules point that the OSR has two branches: Straight up Clones. And the offshoots that innovate in play mechanics and genre. Which is the scam? Both?
IMHO he has an awful tough sell on this one.
IMHO it's clickbait.
But it could also be pennis envy, as in he wishes to be the one "scaming" people with some OSR product.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 06:39:19 PM
You and HappyDerp don't understand not wanting to put the individual on blast right? It's okay, I'm an aspie and many times can't read social cues either.
He posted on youtube, the equivalent of going downtown and shouting to all comers except his potential reach is international. If he wanted privacy that was not the way to accomplish that*.
In addition you made a post on a discussion forum presumably to discuss what this person said. Without posting the source the discussion is hamstrung. Also since this is the internet it was only matter a time before one of us found the video. So the exercise comes off rude and worse yet pointless.
*Incidentally I am well aware what I am doing here and other places like my blog is the equivalent of going downtown and posting my written thoughts on every telephone for all to read. Thus I act accordingly with that in mind.
Quote from: estar on October 04, 2021, 07:55:13 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 06:39:19 PM
You and HappyDerp don't understand not wanting to put the individual on blast right? It's okay, I'm an aspie and many times can't read social cues either.
He posted on youtube, the equivalent of going downtown and shouting to all comers except his potential reach is international. If he wanted privacy that was not the way to accomplish that*.
In addition you made a post on a discussion forum presumably to discuss what this person said. Without posting the source the discussion is hamstrung. Also since this is the internet it was only matter a time before one of us found the video. So the exercise comes off rude and worse yet pointless.
*Incidentally I am well aware what I am doing here and other places like my blog is the equivalent of going downtown and posting my written thoughts on every telephone for all to read. Thus I act accordingly with that in mind.
Yeah, and if said someone went and decided to tell off or make something like threatening the guy it would be all on him because I didn't provide the link.
Like you said, searching the video wasn't hard, so if you feel you need to do it go do it.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 07:59:37 PM
Yeah, and if said someone went and decided to tell off or make something like threatening the guy it would be all on him because I didn't provide the link.
If you think threats were a real possibility here then starting a discussion thread was ethically wrong.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 07:59:37 PM
Like you said, searching the video wasn't hard, so if you feel you need to do it go do it.
Actually it wasn't that easy. I didn't find it despite my skill at Google search and looking. There will too many non-RPG hits on youtube and google. Of course once I followed the link posted here now it pops up immediately on both google and youtube.
Quote from: estar on October 04, 2021, 08:14:28 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 07:59:37 PM
Yeah, and if said someone went and decided to tell off or make something like threatening the guy it would be all on him because I didn't provide the link.
If you think threats were a real possibility here then starting a discussion thread was ethically wrong.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 04, 2021, 07:59:37 PM
Like you said, searching the video wasn't hard, so if you feel you need to do it go do it.
Actually it wasn't that easy. I didn't find it despite my skill at Google search and looking. There will too many non-RPG hits on youtube and google. Of course once I followed the link posted here now it pops up immediately on both google and youtube.
Right starting a discusion withot naming the individual is ethically wrong.
I'm not saying threats are a real possibility, I'm just saying if YOU went and called him names it's 100% on you because YOU had to go looking.
Keep trying, it's entertaining so far.
Greetings!
I think many people in the RPG hobby are jealous that some members of the hobby--in this case, members also of the OSR community--are reasonably successful writers and game designers and in addition to having fun pursuing their creative passions, have contributed commercially to the OSR hobby community, and manage to make some profit while doing so. ;D
Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
Quote from: SHARK on October 04, 2021, 11:19:46 PM
Greetings!
I think many people in the RPG hobby are jealous that some members of the hobby--in this case, members also of the OSR community--are reasonably successful writers and game designers and in addition to having fun pursuing their creative passions, have contributed commercially to the OSR hobby community, and manage to make some profit while doing so. ;D
Semper Fidelis,
SHARK
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
It does sound like he's a little jealous of those hwho manage to make a living writing RPGs, because those RPGs aren't D&D...
Seems crazy to me.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on October 03, 2021, 07:23:15 PM
Saw a video claiming the #OSR is a scam. Allow me to disagree.
CondorDM does makes some points. But calling OSR a scam?
I'd call it a religion. Ha!
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 05:37:43 PM
Yeah, but if what I want to drink is a Coke and I can get a Coke, I'm not going settle for a Sam's Cola. I'm OK with getting the real thing rather than a cheap knock-off...
And look, this circles back to the whole point of the video that prompted this thread.
Where's the cheap knock-off?
I mean, ACKS does the domain game and economics and varied race-as-class options far better than any TSR/WOTC offering. ASSH isn't to my taste as a ruleset but it's a lot more tailored to its world than any TSR/WOTC offering. Sine Nomine games have integrated procedural generation and random tables at least as good as any TSR/WOTC offering, and they work better for me personally than any Judges' Guild I've tried; where he's written world-tailored rulesets (Red Tide / Crimson Pandect), again, it's more tailored to the world than any TSR/WOTC offering, and that's not even touching on Wolves of God.
Despite Sturgeon's Law, OSR has plenty of non-crap content.
Quote from: Naburimannu on October 05, 2021, 05:13:32 AM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 04, 2021, 05:37:43 PM
Yeah, but if what I want to drink is a Coke and I can get a Coke, I'm not going settle for a Sam's Cola. I'm OK with getting the real thing rather than a cheap knock-off...
And look, this circles back to the whole point of the video that prompted this thread.
Where's the cheap knock-off?
I mean, ACKS does the domain game and economics and varied race-as-class options far better than any TSR/WOTC offering. ASSH isn't to my taste as a ruleset but it's a lot more tailored to its world than any TSR/WOTC offering. Sine Nomine games have integrated procedural generation and random tables at least as good as any TSR/WOTC offering, and they work better for me personally than any Judges' Guild I've tried; where he's written world-tailored rulesets (Red Tide / Crimson Pandect), again, it's more tailored to the world than any TSR/WOTC offering, and that's not even touching on Wolves of God.
Despite Sturgeon's Law, OSR has plenty of non-crap content.
Some people obviously like Sam's Cola. Good for them.
wotc, with their little scolding message about how it doesn't reflect their values, have made it clear that they don't really want to sell you a copy of the rules cyclopedia. They will take your filthy money (only because the alternative is rampant piracy), and it's a solid enough product that I'm happy to give them my money for it. But that message makes it clear that they are *never* going to support or do anything new with those rules. You have to go to the OSR for expansions of those rules.
Quote from: therealjcm on October 05, 2021, 11:03:45 AM
wotc, with their little scolding message about how it doesn't reflect their values, have made it clear that they don't really want to sell you a copy of the rules cyclopedia. They will take your filthy money (only because the alternative is rampant piracy), and it's a solid enough product that I'm happy to give them my money for it. But that message makes it clear that they are *never* going to support or do anything new with those rules. You have to go to the OSR for expansions of those rules.
Which is pretty silly. But then, it's WotC.
Quote from: Ghostmaker on October 05, 2021, 11:05:22 AM
Which is pretty silly. But then, it's WotC.
Little known fact: In the original Monty Python's Quest for the Holy Grail pass, they did a shot where the knights stop at a mage's tower on the shoreline. It was cut because the director said it would make the film too over the top. :P
Quote from: therealjcm on October 05, 2021, 11:03:45 AM
But that message makes it clear that they are *never* going to support or do anything new with those rules..
You needed that message to figure out that they were no longer going to "support or do anything new" with a ruleset that twilighted in 1991? You kept your hope alive far longer than any reasonable person would have.
Besides, the point is that there is already plenty of support material out for it and there isn't much need to do anything new to make it work. Further, if you were truly "old school" you'd take what they offered and then go forward yourself rather than buying up the homebrews of other jackholes.
Quote from: Steven Mitchell on October 05, 2021, 11:48:41 AM
Quote from: Ghostmaker on October 05, 2021, 11:05:22 AM
Which is pretty silly. But then, it's WotC.
Little known fact: In the original Monty Python's Quest for the Holy Grail pass, they did a shot where the knights stop at a mage's tower on the shoreline. It was cut because the director said it would make the film too over the top. :P
They could have done some hilarious stuff with the stylites.
" Ooh! It's one of those hermits what lives up on a stick and preaches to people! I didn't think there were many of you around anymore."
" Piss off....uh...in Christ my son. I meant piss off in Christ of course. Don't think I'm not blessing you or praying devoutly and humbly for your well being just because I can't stand you and your coconuts and want you all to leave as soon as possible!" (Throws a chunk of rock at them)
" There's nothing holier than a man who hates company and lives his whole life in prayerful meditation forty feet in the air exposed to the elements and covered in bird shit. That's real faith that is!"
This is very bizarre. Stay for the part at 5:17 where he makes a false equivalency between WOTC and the OSR, and the claim "the OSR will cancel you. The OSR will want to censor you."
BTW he's changed his screen name from CondorGM to "The OSR is a Scam."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tSjsONyXxY
Quote from: Aglondir on October 05, 2021, 10:47:50 PM
This is very bizarre. Stay for the part at 5:17 where he makes a false equivalency between WOTC and the OSR, and the claim "the OSR will cancel you. The OSR will want to censor you."
BTW he's changed his screen name from CondorGM to "The OSR is a Scam."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tSjsONyXxY
LOL, so if you don't drink his koolaid and dare to criticize his "points" you're censoring him?
This guy isn't playing with a full deck if you know what I mean.
Edit:
Quote
CondorDM
hace 11 horas (editado)
I have a feeling that ten OSR members are going to comment on this video asking me to provide evidence for my claim, or they will do whatever else they do to dismiss criticism. I have become immune to their BS.
Who are the big names in the OSR? Because this lunatic claims the OSR is driving people to give them money by being against SJWs.
Okay, the truth comes out, he's angry with Pundit for speaking against those who inject politics in the hobby on his videos.
Somehow this makes him a scammer.
Wait, when has any OSR game been injected with right wing politics?
He's taking a page from Pundit's book and saying inflammatory shit to drive clicks on his videos. YouTube doesn't give a shit about up or downvotes; it's all engagement to them and fuels their algorithm. Stop feeding the troll and watching his incoherent fucktardery.
Quote from: kreegan on October 05, 2021, 11:18:19 PM
*****Stop feeding the troll and watching his incoherent fucktardery.
Agreed
Oh the OSR's not a scam. Its an excuse to steal games under the pretext of "reviving the old ways" when the old ways were doing just fine.
Quote from: Omega on October 06, 2021, 04:06:28 PM
Oh the OSR's not a scam. Its an excuse to steal games under the pretext of "reviving the old ways" when the old ways were doing just fine.
How can you steal that which was put under an open license?
Edited to add: By your logic we have lots of stealing in the Linux ecosystem.
"You can totally release your game for free and the fans will still give you money!"
Welp, looks like the experiment has already been done... Spoliers: It didn't work.
https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/degenesisrebirth-rpg-has-ended/new/#new (https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/degenesisrebirth-rpg-has-ended/new/#new)
All right, I'm going to be old-fashioned here and try to apply a bit of logic.
Unless you are going to define "OSR" by one person and that one person HAS committed fraud- e.g. taking the money and returning nothing- then no, OSR is not a scam. I assume RPGPundit has been delivering his products.
Maybe OSR is cloning some older material- say, "Island of Dread"- under superficial cosmetic changes? No, clearly not. And Dungeons and Dragons could be accused of ripping off older wargaming if it comes to that.
So I'm assuming a more vague definition, that "OSR" is about taking money from suckers who believe it's about returning gaming to a golden age that never existed. In other words, the old "year zero" tactic. You are literally buying from someone who is selling something that doesn't exist because it never did.
Look, when you get "woke" politics crammed down your throat in games these days I can assure people while some political correctness was in gaming all along- Morgan Ironworlf the fighter (1977), it was never toxic, and nobody actually told you how to play. And quite frankly I can't help but wonder if what feminism there was was just an attempt to get more customers since by now it's obvious feminists were pretty gullible all along.
Therefore "OSR" is about putting the game ahead of anything else, like it used to be. This is where RPGPundit gets it wrong: there WAS a "golden age" of gaming precisely because there WAS room for innovation without the shackles of political correctness. Back then an all-male group of heroes could rescue the Silver Princess from a demonic demigod without anyone trying to ban the game, and the only reason they modified that module was simply because it was not considered appropriate for children due to the female captive scene- this was decades ago, remember.
So no, it is not a "scam," and any attack on it is really about attacking something that won't actively endorse the leftist mentality.
Quote from: Snowman0147 on October 03, 2021, 08:25:12 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze on October 03, 2021, 07:42:21 PM
Please link to the video for full context.
CondorDM did the series at his youtube channel.
It was pretty funny. He did a video saying he wanted to promote free speech and discussion within the roleplaying community. I responded to his video saying that the experience of many people on the right is that when someone says they want "open discussion" that really means they want to preach left wing propaganda and want the right wing people to shut up and listen. He said he would absolutely never do that and was insulted that I would even think such a thing.
He then did another video I think it was about OSR people being gatekeepers or some such thing, which I responded to saying I'd never seen any OSR people act in any way like he was accusing them of, and he deleted my comment. When I protested my comment being deleted he said that he would not stand for people disagreeing with him on his youtube channel.
It was such cognitive dissonance and hypocrisy that it was shocking to me. I haven't bothered going back since that incident. I can't believe a channel that can simultaneously claim to want open discussion while deleting comments that disagree can have anything of real benefit to add to the gaming community.
So this post isn't about a particular game but just a general warning that if you're interested in the OSR I would recommend against spending any time on Condor's channel. Your time would be better spent on any number of other gaming channels.
I use D6 fantasy-adventure-space and not anything that utilizes a d20, but osr products are still valuable for art and maps and ideas and info, I mean, I know how to map abilities over between systems, it's not like an osr adventure module's stat blocks are useless, because I can convert dnd stat blocks over to D6 like nothing.
If you wanted to do medieval authentic fantasy england, in any system, dark albion has already done the homework for you for example, you do get your moneys worth out of osr stuff, even rehashes of classic modules...imagine for example if someone wanted to rehash the classic ravenloft module but change it up to replace strahd with a cyborg necromancer, keeping the overall floor plans of the castle but altering everything just enough to make the castle a rocket ship...thats wild, thats old school, thats gonzo...and worth buying probably for the art work and reimagined techno-horror critters likely to be drawn and statted within.
Or I've had too much to drink. Either way.
I support the OSR. It isn't a scam.
The OSR games I have bought are some of my favorites. They bring me countless hours of joy. And I look forward to see what other OSR creators create.
I don't give a rip about the politics surrounding the OSR. I just care about good products. If it's a good product, it has my attention.