>>>>The Hero System has a great untapped potential that has yet to be expressed. And that potential will never be realized without growth and change.

And   a resurrection. They shot themselves in the foot with 6th Ed, and bled out.

Quote from: Egyptoid;1107407And   a resurrection. They shot themselves in the foot with 6th Ed, and bled out.

And it's not going to happen with the current company ownership. That much is completely clear.

I don't have much hope for Champions Now. As it is currently being written and influenced by the same people who produced 6th Edition.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley;1107418And it's not going to happen with the current company ownership. That much is completely clear.

I don't think it's clear.  I think that's another unsubstantiated claim that isn't supported by the data you've provided.  

Logically and obviously someone who is sometimes invulnerable to bullets and sometimes has laser eyes is less powerful than someone that ALWAYS has invulnerability to bullets and laser eyes.  At best, your claim can only be that the specific costing is inaccurate relative to the potential benefits.

So did even one person familiar with the HERO system agree with the OP that multi-power is an issue? If they did I missed it.

Not that I noticed.

Apparently the silent majority of HERO fans who must agree with Darrin are still silent and everyone posting here is doing so solely to torture Darrin. :rolleyes:

Quote from: Toadmaster;1107566So did even one person familiar with the HERO system agree with the OP that multi-power is an issue? If they did I missed it.

Nope. And anyone who disagreed was "attacking him" and that gives DK the right to forever ignore anything said by that person.

Which probably explains why, in his mind, "everyone" agrees with his take on multi-powers... everyone who disagrees is memory-holed because disagreeing is an attack on him and that makes their disagreement illegitimate.

Not that he'll ever read this because I was first on his ignore list from this thread because I challenged his misrepresentation of my own statements.

Quote from: Darrin Kelley;1107418And it's not going to happen with the current company ownership. That much is completely clear.

I don't have much hope for Champions Now(CN). As it is currently being written and influenced by the same people who produced 6th Edition.

Actually, I have hope that CN will breathe new life into the game because the alternative is that the Hero System dies and I'll just move on to a new game. I happen to like the Mighty Protectors(unofficially V&V 3.0).

Hero System dying is not the only alternative. There's a fair chance it will stay as is, attracting new blood by word of mouth and the paltry amount of games ran here and there.

Quote from: CptPatriot;1107736Actually, I have hope that CN will breathe new life into the game because the alternative is that the Hero System dies and I'll just move on to a new game. I happen to like the Mighty Protectors(unofficially V&V 3.0).

Ron Edwards breathing new life into Hero? I can't think of a less likely candidate. Only one guy in my group of Hero grognards backed the KS, and that was out of charity.

Quote from: Aglondir;1107757Ron Edwards breathing new life into Hero? I can't think of a less likely candidate. Only one guy in my group of Hero grognards backed the KS, and that was out of charity.

Yeah, I couldn't even bring myself to for charity's sake, and I buy pretty much everything they put on their site anymore for just that reason. Most of it is worth what is charged, though some doesn't really fit with what I am doing. But, it's my favorite system, and I want it to survive, even if only as a anorexic survivor of a forgotten age. And really, that's what has happened with Hero. It will never be the "it" system again, and because they continue to support all the older versions on their site, even the fanbase is largely fractured. I have been playing it since 1982, so I am not about to chuck all the work I put into it over the years, but it has become almost impossible to find new players to invest the time that my group did back then. To me, it's increasingly odd that DK has such a vested interest in fighting over a system that basically is dead, and expecting Hero to retool it to his satisfaction. I don't know about now, but when I was young, we were happy to houserule anything and play it the way we wanted, and he could do the same, but the validation he is seeking isn't going to be found among the grognards, and we are the only ones really heavily invested in it anymore...

Really, it's hard to throw dollars at Hero Games even out of charity. Look at their onsite pdf store: no previews, and page counts of products not even listed. How many dollars has that shitshow of a "store" lost in sales due to those factors alone?

Honestly? My opinions of the Multipower have never effected when I was actually running Champions games. My setups tend to have been really basic and somewhat predictable and conservative for what they are. And I tended to give the players a lot of trust when conducting themselves with the game. Someone would probably say that I gave way too much. Given my history with players who acted in bad faith.

Recently, I sat down and had a long talk with a friend. Exposing and dealing with the personal demons that developed over my life in gaming. I got to deal with the root cause. Which is what I had been looking to do ever since the original incidents happened. I got some good advice that actually seems to be guiding me back to the GM's chair. That has resulted in my feeling secure enough to try again.

In my games? I have to be more assertive. I'm in control. I control the content and the expressions of the game rules. I choose the game system I am comfortable with. I'm in the driver's seat. I don't have to settle for a choice between bad players and no players at all. I have choices. And realizing that is very emotionally freeing.

Hero Games did not help the situation by taking way tl long to set-up their POD titles. The first volume of 6E  was out of print for many years and while one could get both in PDF, print was another matter. Which did not help sales.

As for bad players I agree that one should not run or play with them as long as they are legitimately bad players. Not bad players for simply refusing to bend over backwards to accommodate the DM. I have seen that too often in my years in the hobby.

I was a GM that usually bent over backward for the players. Because I believed showing trust was an important part of the foundation I was trying to build.

But that didn't account for players who were acting in bad faith. That's now changed. I'm far more particular with who I let play in the games I run. Instead of letting myself be a slave to desperation.

Changing game systems was a good start. To something, I view it as easier to manage. Something free of the game-specific frustrations I had in the past.

As a GM I am usually pretty easy-going. I have always tried to only place a minimum of ground rules so that the players had a lot of freedom of expression in character design. I didn't want to place unnecessary roadblocks in front of the players that would impede their imaginations or creativity.

But the era of me being naive is done. If I see clear abuse by a player, I will just show the player the door. No argument. No second chances. No more being a doormat.

On a more upbeat note (maybe I should have started a new thread) this was announced recently

Hall of Champions