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"Murder-hobos"

Started by RPGPundit, November 02, 2011, 02:00:31 PM

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two_fishes

#45
November 02, 2011, 09:33:27 PM
I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say murder-hobo, but I definitely enjoy playing characters who are morally-questionable, ruthless opportunists

Cranewings

#46
November 02, 2011, 10:36:07 PM
Quote from: Werekoala;487816Agreed - any time conflict can be resolved without combat (in D&D especially) is a memorable moment, and great gaming. I actually talked down a Beholder once. Oh, and my evil cleric made a deal with a large Green dragon, and sealed the deal with a DeathTouch handshake - DM failed the roll. Was pretty spectacular.

Nice. I've rarely seen negotiations with a dragon turn out ok (:

Elfdart

#47
November 02, 2011, 10:54:29 PM
Quote from: Melan;487779So, am I the only one here who has
  • not only played in games with murder hobo characters, but
  • enjoyed them and
  • doesn't find them a guilty pleasure?
Because I think you folks are missing out on something. Playing anti-social lowlives risking life and limb for a fistful of gold pieces in a dangerous, hostile and overpoweringly amoral world is liberating and legitimately entertaining.

Exactly.

But then, The Wild Bunch has always been more my style than Roy Rogers.
Jesus Fucking Christ, is this guy honestly that goddamned stupid? He can\'t understand the plot of a Star Wars film? We\'re not talking about "Rashomon" here, for fuck\'s sake. The plot is as linear as they come. If anything, the film tries too hard to fill in all the gaps. This guy must be a flaming retard.  --Mike Wong on Red Letter Moron\'s review of The Phantom Menace

kregmosier

#48
November 02, 2011, 11:12:37 PM Last Edit: November 02, 2011, 11:26:50 PM by kregmosier
i think "the game" can be played in any number of ways by any number of people; the possibilities are staggering.
there were no default assumptions back in the day, but we all pretty much knew we were heroes...the good guys.

probably more 'han solo'-good than 'king arthur'-good, but still...
-k
middle-school renaissance

i wrote the Dead; you can get it for free here.

Planet Algol

#49
November 02, 2011, 11:35:48 PM
I thought the whole point of being Good was that you did the Good thing because it is the Good thing to do and not for any mechanical benefits. Selflessness and all.

Hell, I have a Murder-Hobo character (6th lvl AD&D NE M-U), that occasionally does the "right thing" because he's not that evil he's just generally ruthless and opportunistic.

Anyways, the beauty of Murder Hobo play is that it can evoke this wonderful alchemy of Spaghetti Westerns; Crime movies & fiction; Thieves World; and Cohen brothers films that can make for exciting and compelling D&D play.
Yeah, but who gives a fuck? You? Jibba?

Well congrats. No one else gives a shit, so your arguments are a waste of breath.

kregmosier

#50
November 03, 2011, 12:02:27 AM
Quote from: Planet Algol;487847I thought the whole point of being Good was that you did the Good thing because it is the Good thing to do and not for any mechanical benefits. Selflessness and all.

Hell, I have a Murder-Hobo character (6th lvl AD&D NE M-U), that occasionally does the "right thing" because he's not that evil he's just generally ruthless and opportunistic.

Anyways, the beauty of Murder Hobo play is that it can evoke this wonderful alchemy of Spaghetti Westerns; Crime movies & fiction; Thieves World; and Cohen brothers films that can make for exciting and compelling D&D play.

amen. QFT and right on.
-k
middle-school renaissance

i wrote the Dead; you can get it for free here.

Peregrin

#51
November 03, 2011, 12:22:55 AM
Quote from: Planet Algol;487847I thought the whole point of being Good was that you did the Good thing because it is the Good thing to do and not for any mechanical benefits. Selflessness and all.

Well I mean the character isn't the player, so motivations don't always have to align (although it's usually good if they do in the sort of game D&D is).

Although it's not so much about rewarding good, specifically, as it is about rewarding other sorts of player behaviors.  Sometimes people construct campaigns where the reward "systems" aren't explicit, but certain types of player behavior are encouraged or reinforced anyway, and people just ignore the XP for gold thing.
"In a way, the Lands of Dream are far more brutal than the worlds of most mainstream games. All of the games set there have a bittersweetness that I find much harder to take than the ridiculous adolescent posturing of so-called \'grittily realistic\' games. So maybe one reason I like them as a setting is because they are far more like the real world: colourful, crazy, full of strange creatures and people, eternal and yet changing, deeply beautiful and sometimes profoundly bitter."

DKChannelBoredom

#52
November 03, 2011, 02:39:45 AM
One of the reasons why I kinda put my Warhammer Enemy Within campaign on hold, was due to one of the players being pretty much in constant Mu-Ho mode. I've never seen a squire-aiming-at-knight loot so much and and go through the pockets of so many disgusting mutants in search for a few silver pennies and constantly scan every battlefield for ANYTHING valuable. He was well more murder-hobo than the groups grave- and tomb robber.

It was sort of ok in the two first books, but man, I'm not sure I really want him pillaging through Middenheim.

So yes. I've met the murder hobo-type players recently.
Running: Call of Cthulhu
Playing: Mainly boardgames
Quote from: Cranewings;410955Cocain is more popular than rp so there is bound to be some crossover.

Melan

#53
November 03, 2011, 03:40:09 AM
Quote from: Elliot Wilen;487814As much as I've enjoyed reading TGD at times, I think the dominant mode of reasoning is often convergent and rather reductionist. This post may or may not have denigration as its intent, but it's still something that many D&D fans would object to--rather like the borderline Forgist view that accompanied 4e, in which D&D fans were encouraged to embrace hyper-gamism.
Well, one of those is a Frank Trollman post. I think we can safely consider him a fringe case when it comes to RPG morality or D&D.

Quote from: PseudoephedrineIn between adventures, my murderhobo PCs draw cards from a stack I made up describing what happens during the downtime. My baseline assumption when drawing up the cards is that the PCs are amoral thrill-seeking murderhobos who naturally gravitate to consorting with other amoral thrill-seeking murderhobos.
That's very good stuff.

Quote from: Elfdart;487839But then, The Wild Bunch has always been more my style than Roy Rogers.
My inspiration has been more The Man With No Name (who has a moral compass, although a well-hidden one), but good point.
Now with a Zine!
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B.T.

#54
November 03, 2011, 06:14:11 AM
Quote from: Elliot Wilen;487814As much as I've enjoyed reading TGD at times, I think the dominant mode of reasoning is often convergent and rather reductionist. This post may or may not have denigration as its intent, but it's still something that many D&D fans would object to--rather like the borderline Forgist view that accompanied 4e, in which D&D fans were encouraged to embrace hyper-gamism.

See also. Etc.
The reductionist mode of argumentation has been popularized by one of our mutual members and, for better and worse, spread by the people who want to emulate him.  This makes reading TGD both entertaining and frustrating because you're getting lots of cursing and invective mixed in with autistic logic.

Stay away from the political section, though.  It's a mess.
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So, that\'s something, I guess.

crkrueger

#55
November 03, 2011, 11:17:38 AM
Quote from: DKChannelBoredom;487861One of the reasons why I kinda put my Warhammer Enemy Within campaign on hold, was due to one of the players being pretty much in constant Mu-Ho mode. I've never seen a squire-aiming-at-knight loot so much and and go through the pockets of so many disgusting mutants in search for a few silver pennies and constantly scan every battlefield for ANYTHING valuable. He was well more murder-hobo than the groups grave- and tomb robber.

It was sort of ok in the two first books, but man, I'm not sure I really want him pillaging through Middenheim.

So yes. I've met the murder hobo-type players recently.

Middenheim Knights of the White Wolf are a great way to rid yourself of dishonorable Reiklander would-be-knights.  :D
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KenHR

#56
November 03, 2011, 11:59:21 AM
Quote from: Planet Algol;487847Anyways, the beauty of Murder Hobo play is that it can evoke this wonderful alchemy of Spaghetti Westerns; Crime movies & fiction; Thieves World; and Cohen brothers films that can make for exciting and compelling D&D play.

Hmm.  I never really associated that stuff with the "murder hobo" descriptor.  I always thought the term was more like the guy who just burned down the Village of Hommlet the first time we played AD&D, just because he was Chaotic Evil.

Something like Man With No Name or Coen Brothers or the other stuff you cite...yeah, that's good.  What's Kyle's sig say?  "High-minded hack?"  I like that style a lot.
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hexgrid

#57
November 03, 2011, 12:56:23 PM
Quote"Apparently, there's a few serious adventurers in town right now...quite unscrupulous grave robbers for the most part. Anything for gold and experience." - Perdido Street Station, China Mieville.

I always thought the murder-hobo thing was kind of like this- a sort of joking acknowledgement that D&D "heroes" often aren't really very heroic. Not an attack on D&D or anyone's play style.
 

Thalaba

#58
November 03, 2011, 01:30:55 PM
Quote from: Pseudoephedrine;487834In between adventures, my murderhobo PCs draw cards from a stack I made up describing what happens during the downtime. My baseline assumption when drawing up the cards is that the PCs are amoral thrill-seeking murderhobos who naturally gravitate to consorting with other amoral thrill-seeking murderhobos.


Ooh, I like those - very Lankhmaresque, and a nice way to expose setting and generate plot hooks. How many cards are in the stack, how many players draw them, and how often are they drawn?.
"I began with nothing, and I will end with nothing except the life I\'ve tasted." Blim the Weathermaker, in The Lions of Karthagar.
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Pseudoephedrine

#59
November 03, 2011, 01:59:10 PM
Quote from: Thalaba;487909Ooh, I like those - very Lankhmaresque, and a nice way to expose setting and generate plot hooks. How many cards are in the stack, how many players draw them, and how often are they drawn?.

There are currently 13 cards for six, soon to be seven, players, who each draw one. They draw them in between adventures, or whenever they spend a month or more of downtime. I draw up new cards whenever I feel like, usually in lots of 4 (since each one is a quarter of a sheet of paper). My PCs in this campaign are pretty new, so they're still getting the hang of the roleplaying side of gaming, and this helps them get ideas for personal goals.
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