What do you think about the power level of spells in the new D&D? Too powerful? Not powerful enough? Just right?

I'm not a fan of completely at-will, zero cost magic (with regard to D&D) just so spell casters always have something to PEW PEW with.

I'm OK with it.  The at-will stuff loses a lot of its luster at higher levels, as actual spells are preferred.

All it really does, IME, is get rid of the "I stand in the back and throw darts" scenario that was common in AD&D

*Edit*  I'll give an example.  The most common "combat" spell I've seen used that is at will is shocking grasp.  It does 1d8 dmg, and the target gets a DEX saving throw.  At level 5, the damage goes to 2d8.  At level 10, 3d8, and so on.

Ray of frost is another one, just at 50ft range.  It doesn't give a DEX saving throw, but you do need to make an attack roll.

Compared to all the other spells available when you're 5th or 10th level, it pretty much is more of a last resort type attack rather than a mage just slinging at-wills all over the place.

I've got a strong preference for wizards who wear robes and cast spells over wizards who wear leather armor and carry crossbows.  

Of all of 3e's failings that was the greatest.

I don't mind having at will cantrips. I think the biggest thing I'm hoping is the new concentration rules give more chance of failure or make unprotected mages a juicier target. From what little I played 3rd edition it seemed that spell failure from losing concentration or wearing armor wasn't really ever a risk for spellcasters at all.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;754013All it really does, IME, is get rid of the "I stand in the back and throw darts" scenario that was common in AD&D

Darts are resources that have to be managed. They run out and factor into encumbrance. At-will attack spells are a step away from one of the key elements of old-school D&D.

Quote from: aspiringlich;754023Darts are resources that have to be managed. They run out and factor into encumbrance. At-will attack spells are a step away from one of the key elements of old-school D&D.

Exactly.

I wouldn't mind cantrip-level magic that was a bit weaker than 1st level spells and had a lower resource cost. The key component of managing a resource vs the current need is missing when an ability is completely at will.

Don't encumber yourself with torches, we have free light.

Who needs a thief? Just send a PEW at anything suspicious to set off traps from a distance.

I don't like ubiquitous, easy attack spells in nearly any game. The only possible exception is Wizard/The Fantasy Trip, but only because they fit within a rich set of tactical options for spell casters — something I don't think exists in any version of D&D. In most games (including all editions of D&D), I think spells are best treated as something separate from and complementary to, rather than a replacement for, mundane combat options. Actually, the version of D&D magic I like the best is in Chainmail, where spell casters have access to a few spells, all of which are very powerful, but the act of spell casting is pretty uncertain, especially for high level magic. The game I think gets magic best of all is Call of Cthulhu — spells are not a tool for a profession, and you don't think of them as a set of golf clubs to choose among for some tactical situation. Spells are sort of like cultural artifacts, do strange and powerful things, and often have negative consequences that outweigh whatever good they might do you.

As I've stated elsewhere.

I initially was kinda "meh" about the magic system and spells.

Magic Missile, Fireball and Lightning Bolt were all now weaker in some way in a game where the monsters have been beefed up usually.

But over time I came to appreciate the systems "spell slots as magic points" mechanic.

I am still on the fence on the at-will cantrips.

On one hand they are essentially magical darts and staves as it were and do not impact game balance any.

On the other hand I rather liked my darts. :cool:

Quote from: Bionicspacejellyfish;754020... I think the biggest thing I'm hoping is the new concentration rules give more chance of failure or make unprotected mages a juicier target. From what little I played 3rd edition it seemed that spell failure from losing concentration or wearing armor wasn't really ever a risk for spellcasters at all.

It's a little hard to tell how this is going to work in play.

Some spells have a formal concentration component and some don't.

According to the last set of rules I read, certain attacks or effects can disrupt concentration, but these will supposedly be put in the description for the attack or effect itself, rather than in some abstract formula. So I'm not sure how prevalent these will be in monster, attack or item descriptions.

A DM can also call for ability checks in particularly adverse circumstances, but that's pretty discretionary and on a case-by case basis.      

It could be a pretty important issue since the mere act of spellcasting, when adjacent to an enemy doesn't trigger an opportunity attack. (Not that this ever worked very well anyway, since 90% of the time in 3.x, casters could just take a 5 foot step back and blast away.)

Quote from: Omega;754030As I've stated elsewhere.

I initially was kinda "meh" about the magic system and spells.

Magic Missile, Fireball and Lightning Bolt were all now weaker in some way in a game where the monsters have been beefed up usually.

But over time I came to appreciate the systems "spell slots as magic points" mechanic.

I am still on the fence on the at-will cantrips.

On one hand they are essentially magical darts and staves as it were and do not impact game balance any.

On the other hand I rather liked my darts. :cool:

The trouble a lot of people, myself included, have with them is nothing to do with the "game" side of things. It's not about game balance, it's about things like internal consistency and verisimilitude. What does it mean for the game world that someone can fire off beams of cold (or whatever) endlessly (or at least until exhaustion)? It's not about DPS, it's about what else this says about the implied setting.

I am not a fan of 4 spell slots total for 6-9th level spells it's not enough and smacks of AEDU. I'm going to have to experiment a little on that maybe an extra slot for 6-7th level spells. Also what is this no extra spell for Tradition mess?

Otherwise it seems about the right power level.

Quote from: Bobloblah;754032The trouble a lot of people, myself included, have with them is nothing to do with the "game" side of things. It's not about game balance, it's about things like internal consistency and verisimilitude. What does it mean for the game world that someone can fire off beams of cold (or whatever) endlessly (or at least until exhaustion)? It's not about DPS, it's about what else this about the implied setting.

Meh, plenty of books and stories have settings where wizards and sorcerers use minor magics at will.

Quote from: Exploderwizard;754027Exactly.

I wouldn't mind cantrip-level magic that was a bit weaker than 1st level spells and had a lower resource cost. The key component of managing a resource vs the current need is missing when an ability is completely at will.

Don't encumber yourself with torches, we have free light.

Who needs a thief? Just send a PEW at anything suspicious to set off traps from a distance.

Just become a Lumberjack. Who needs an axe when you can just cut trees down with Magic Missile

Quote from: Marleycat;754036Meh, plenty of books and stories have settings where wizards and sorcerers use minor magics at will.

Those are books and stories.

Not a game

And not Dungeons and Dragons...