Quote from: SHARK on September 07, 2021, 11:29:49 PM
The sobbing SJW crybabies of course don't like it. It shows them under the sunlight, for everyone to see. And, of course, the SJW's don't control the list, which grinds them to no end.

See, I don't see sobbing. Can you provide some example of sobbing.

It seriously looks like that kid who makes some lame "insult," gets ignored or gets laughed AT instead of with, and then claims "DUde, I SOOoooo burned you."

KEEP control of the list, KEEP publishing it, KEEP documenting companies that support values that align with each other. I see them appreciate it. 

You and RPG Pundit and others claim that it's somehow something that's painful to them, but ... uh, nope.  I know a lot of these guys, they're laughing it up.

You're basically praising them for things they hold as values.

Quote
As far as "Tactics" go--whatever. This isn't a Chess game. You play to win, to crush your fucking enemies utterly. Make them cry and get on their fucking knees and beg.  Crush them relentlessly. That is what brings victory.

"But the left keeps lists."  "They're willing to do anything for their cause."

Yeah, see, clean hands, sir. You do the things that you claim your opponents are filthy for having done, your opponents aren't the ones who judge you. You judge yourself.

Your opponents already thought you to be dirty, but ... You know what you've done.

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Who gives a fuck if the SJW Libtards don't like it? That's too bad. The faster and harder they are ruthlessly crushed the better off our entire culture will be. Every area needs to be fought. the SJW's need to be resisted at every opportunity.

Are you serious with this? heh.

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:31:02 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:17:24 PM
       Who cares?  I am not quite getting what you are trying to say.  If you are an SJW, I could care less.   I also think you may not quite get what the term means coming from the right.  It is usually a zealous person who can, and will do all they can to end people's professional lives for political beliefs.  If you are the sort of person to do that sort of thing, and feel proud about it... well you do you.

This is a moving goalpost thing. You claim SJW is only people who campaign to ruin another person's job, another person will call me one because I speak out on behalf of neurodivergent players, on behalf of LGBTQ players, on behalf of women and minority players.

I'm an organizer for a group of gamers, I'll speak up just as readily for the kid who wore a Trump shirt to the game, or the "liberal tears" mug to the game. We don't talk politics at the table. We only have the rules "safe, friendly, fun." Otherwise, play D&D today and we'll see you next week if you want. (and I SPECIFICALLY stopped an anti-Trump discussion when the kid was at the table, he was quiet because it's tough to express an opinion when 5 other people who are like 10-20 years older than you bag on a guy you like.  "Dudes, we don't know everyone's politics, we're not here to talk about politics, we're here to roll dice.")

But you talk about the SJW wanting to get folks fired, but much later the kid with the Trump shirt is the one that tried to get me "fired" from my job as an organizer.  (Joke was on him, I'm not an employee, receive no money from anyone, and literally just decided that I would help make sure that anyone who wanted to play D&D would get to play D&D on our established days... The store just decided that they'd start pointing newcomers to me.)

His reason, by the way, is that I wouldn't force people to let him play at a table where he said offensive things, they felt that he was being transphobic because he was consistently and intentionally using the wrong pronouns and names, even after being asked to stop. You don't get to crybully your way back to the table that asked you to leave.

I've had others that have tried to cancel me. Cancel culture is not solely a thing from the left, the right has always done it, they just never use that term.

But we have a ton of conservative members that pitch in and help out, just as we have liberal ones. I'm pretty sure that the things that I do are apolitical, but the fact that I didn't kick out a trans player, that was claimed to be political. It's not, in my opinion, and I won't bend the knee, as I've seen folks say, to the cancel culture of the right.

And the folks that "my character is an ass, so I hit on the women at the table." Yeah, he doesn't get to do that, even in character.  Sorry, I'm not "bending the knee" to the feminists that are ruining the game, I'm maintaining a certain level of respect to other players, and that's not political.  Especially when the conservative members are just as disgusted with the guy.

We've got plenty of examples.  Really, "don't be an ass" shouldn't be considered political, but for some reason, it's been thrown in my face as proof that I'm SJW.

The categories of people don't need your protection, white savior. They are human beings with their own wills who are perfectly capable of having their own opinions and forming groups and friendships with like minded people, including with us if they agree with us (which a lot of them do). Nobody cares if you have trans players.

And conservatives have done some cancelling but not nearly as much as the left who started this in the first place. This is a situation the left created and now they are reaping what they have sown. I don't agree with Tenkar in taking down the ACAB rpg but unlike you I don't think I can control the actions of other people.

And you're right that not being as ass is not political, but you are making it political by making ridiculous claims that "hitting on a woman" in a fantasy pretend game is being an ass. Go outside and touch grass.

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:38:57 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:35:33 PM
  I did not move any goalposts.  I told you what I see as an SJW.    You call yourself something because of what it means to you.  I told you what it means to me.  Do with that what you will.

That's your goalposts. I've seen plenty of others claim SJW for mere support of things like BLM and antifa and LBGTQ causes and so on.

The goalposts move depending on the person, and I've seen plenty of people just say "Soandso is an SJW moron" and others just sagely nod as if it's truth, when that person never tried to get anyone fired.

I really think that "get people fired" distinction is rather unique to you, too. I've seen it far more frequently used to classify people with opinions than people who have done a specific thing.

BLM have openly expressed that they are a Marxist organization, ran by Marxists, with the express purpose of overthrowing western civilization and culture as spoken by the people at the very top of it. Antifa goes around throwing IEDs at buildings and beating and (at this point) outright killing people on the streets while claiming "oh we're just anti-fascists" when using the same tactics my grandparents saw in kristallnacht. And the LGBTQ lobby has gone against the interests of actual LGB people to the point of harassing them and getting their lives ruined and causing a schism (hence TERFs).

In your case with the one person trying to get you fired, that was a single person, and yes it was shitty, but the constant barrage due to the cultural cess-pit of Twitter is far greater to the point of it being no comparison.

A note of advice, Ocule, there will be some "designers" whose products are practically unknown even in SJW circles, who are trying to get on this list so they can later complain very loudly about being on this list in the hopes of getting attention for themselves. Some of them may try to sockpuppet here and mention their products in the hopes of being added.

I would suggest that you only include entries on the Red List that are at least somewhat known.

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 07, 2021, 11:44:01 PM
This isn't a banlist. Unlike the left, who call for people to be censored, demonetized, or sometimes killed, this is just a guide to know what you're spending your money on.

That distinction wasn't something I had noted. I understand better, and thanks for the clarification.

You have intention to prevent it from being flavored as a "companies we want to go away" list, right?  Just a "these companies do not share our values."

Because it's not hard for the right wing to weaponize such lists, One Million Moms and other groups like that here in the US want to cancel a lot of the things that we both appreciate, and they're pretty firmly right wing groups.

The whole "the left is all about cancel culture" doesn't mesh with the reality where there are right wing church groups trying to cancel television shows for violence or sexuality or language, and bring us back to the 1950s. I know you're not in favor of that nonsense, but you have got to know that such people do exist.

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:49:26 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 07, 2021, 11:44:01 PM
This isn't a banlist. Unlike the left, who call for people to be censored, demonetized, or sometimes killed, this is just a guide to know what you're spending your money on.

That distinction wasn't something I had noted. I understand better, and thanks for the clarification.

You have intention to prevent it from being flavored as a "companies we want to go away" list, right?  Just a "these companies do not share our values."

Because it's not hard for the right wing to weaponize such lists, One Million Moms and other groups like that here in the US want to cancel a lot of the things that we both appreciate, and they're pretty firmly right wing groups.

The whole "the left is all about cancel culture" doesn't mesh with the reality where there are right wing church groups trying to cancel television shows for violence or sexuality or language, and bring us back to the 1950s. I know you're not in favor of that nonsense, but you have got to know that such people do exist.

  LMAO, if right wing church groups are trying to cancel tv shows for violence/sex/language they are doing a pretty terrible job.  Come on now, be serious.   Did you wake up and think it was 1987?

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 07, 2021, 11:47:11 PM
A note of advice, Ocule, there will be some "designers" whose products are practically unknown even in SJW circles, who are trying to get on this list so they can later complain very loudly about being on this list in the hopes of getting attention for themselves. Some of them may try to sockpuppet here and mention their products in the hopes of being added.

I would suggest that you only include entries on the Red List that are at least somewhat known.

Good call Pundit!

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:49:26 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 07, 2021, 11:44:01 PM
This isn't a banlist. Unlike the left, who call for people to be censored, demonetized, or sometimes killed, this is just a guide to know what you're spending your money on.

That distinction wasn't something I had noted. I understand better, and thanks for the clarification.

You have intention to prevent it from being flavored as a "companies we want to go away" list, right?  Just a "these companies do not share our values."

Because it's not hard for the right wing to weaponize such lists, One Million Moms and other groups like that here in the US want to cancel a lot of the things that we both appreciate, and they're pretty firmly right wing groups.

The whole "the left is all about cancel culture" doesn't mesh with the reality where there are right wing church groups trying to cancel television shows for violence or sexuality or language, and bring us back to the 1950s. I know you're not in favor of that nonsense, but you have got to know that such people do exist.

Nobody ever said it was a "companies go away list." You asserted that. And nobody here supports what the "right-wing church groups" does. That isn't even the thing anymore. This isn't the 80s and 90s. We live in the modern day were its leftists cancelling people for not agreeing with their sentiments. Your assertion is the one that doesn't mesh with reality. A culture where a video game developer can be fired for simply saying they are pro-life is not a culture being run by "right wing churches."

Quote from: ArtemisWyrm on September 07, 2021, 11:45:32 PM
The categories of people don't need your protection, white savior. They are human beings with their own wills who are perfectly capable of having their own opinions and forming groups and friendships with like minded people, including with us if they agree with us (which a lot of them do). Nobody cares if you have trans players.

And conservatives have done some cancelling but not nearly as much as the left who started this in the first place. This is a situation the left created and now they are reaping what they have sown. I don't agree with Tenkar in taking down the ACAB rpg but unlike you I don't think I can control the actions of other people.

And you're right that not being as ass is not political, but you are making it political by making ridiculous claims that "hitting on a woman" in a fantasy pretend game is being an ass. Go outside and touch grass.

I'm glad you know my examples better than me. But let me inform you: A woman tells me, "I'm uncomfortable playing with _____ because he hits on the women at the game every single time." They've already told him to cut it out, they've just been ignored.

I tell him, "People have expressed that you don't listen to boundaries."

I hope the problem is solved after letting him know what he's done wrong, but if I have further complaints, I let him know that he can't sign up for my events anymore.

He's welcome to do whatever he wants with his own time, I just won't seat him at my events. My free events.  My free events that require nothing more than just show up and sign up on a sheet of paper and I'll find you and the sixty or so other people a table.

I have some experience at keeping the community safe, and I find that I have to act like a kindergarten teacher. What's marvelous about it is that it wasn't until I got to a certain level of attendance that I did have to, prior to that it was pretty self-operating. I was just a DM that helped other DMs meet up with players. But in a group that large, there's always a couple of folks that require a bit of kindergarten lessons.

Originally it was just "if you don't want to sit with someone, let me know, I'll move things around."  But, I do learn some things about people along the way.

They're welcome to go do their own thing in a corner of the store, it's not my store, they can organize their own game, they can do whatever the heck they want.

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:52:52 PM

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:49:26 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 07, 2021, 11:44:01 PM
This isn't a banlist. Unlike the left, who call for people to be censored, demonetized, or sometimes killed, this is just a guide to know what you're spending your money on.

That distinction wasn't something I had noted. I understand better, and thanks for the clarification.

You have intention to prevent it from being flavored as a "companies we want to go away" list, right?  Just a "these companies do not share our values."

Because it's not hard for the right wing to weaponize such lists, One Million Moms and other groups like that here in the US want to cancel a lot of the things that we both appreciate, and they're pretty firmly right wing groups.

The whole "the left is all about cancel culture" doesn't mesh with the reality where there are right wing church groups trying to cancel television shows for violence or sexuality or language, and bring us back to the 1950s. I know you're not in favor of that nonsense, but you have got to know that such people do exist.

  LMAO, if right wing church groups are trying to cancel tv shows for violence/sex/language they are doing a pretty terrible job.  Come on now, be serious.   Did you wake up and think it was 1987?

lol aside from like the ultra small church groups that are quite literally a single family, I don't think this has really been a thing since at least the mid-90s 

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:54:06 PM

Quote from: ArtemisWyrm on September 07, 2021, 11:45:32 PM
The categories of people don't need your protection, white savior. They are human beings with their own wills who are perfectly capable of having their own opinions and forming groups and friendships with like minded people, including with us if they agree with us (which a lot of them do). Nobody cares if you have trans players.

And conservatives have done some cancelling but not nearly as much as the left who started this in the first place. This is a situation the left created and now they are reaping what they have sown. I don't agree with Tenkar in taking down the ACAB rpg but unlike you I don't think I can control the actions of other people.

And you're right that not being as ass is not political, but you are making it political by making ridiculous claims that "hitting on a woman" in a fantasy pretend game is being an ass. Go outside and touch grass.

I'm glad you know my examples better than me. But let me inform you: A woman tells me, "I'm uncomfortable playing with _____ because he hits on the women at the game every single time." They've already told him to cut it out, they've just been ignored.

I tell him, "People have expressed that you don't listen to boundaries."

I hope the problem is solved, if I have further complaints, I let him know that he can't sign up for my events anymore.

He's welcome to do whatever he wants with his own time, I just won't seat him at my events. My free events.  My free events that require nothing more than just show up and sign up on a sheet of paper and I'll find you and the sixty or so other people a table.

I have some experience at keeping the community safe, and I find that I have to act like a kindergarten teacher. What's marvelous about it is that it wasn't until I got to a certain level of attendance that I did have to, prior to that it was pretty self-operating. I was just a DM that helped other DMs meet up with players. But in a group that large, there's always a couple of folks that require a bit of kindergarten lessons.

Originally it was just "if you don't want to sit with someone, let me know, I'll move things around."  But, I do learn some things about people along the way.

They're welcome to go do their own thing in a corner of the store, it's not my store, they can organize their own game, they can do whatever the heck they want.

Id tell her "its a game and if you don't like it let him know." You can run your tables like a kindergarten. I like to run mine like I'm dealing with adults.

Quote from: PonchoGoblin on September 07, 2021, 11:56:10 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:52:52 PM

  LMAO, if right wing church groups are trying to cancel tv shows for violence/sex/language they are doing a pretty terrible job.  Come on now, be serious.   Did you wake up and think it was 1987?

lol aside from like the ultra small church groups that are quite literally a single family, I don't think this has really been a thing since at least the mid-90s 

There's a few groups that are quite organized and don't get as much traction as they used to. But they still exist and they still try and get things cancelled to a lot less success than they used to.

https://onemillionmoms.com/

When they were much larger movements, they would look like these HUUUUUGE movements, but it was a group that knew how to game the system to gain an overly large influence over things.

And you'll still see them weigh in on things and make nervous producers pull things that might attract their attention.

Quote from: ArtemisWyrm on September 07, 2021, 11:57:48 PM
Id tell her "its a game and if you don't like it let him know." You can run your tables like a kindergarten. I like to run mine like I'm dealing with adults.

Does your table get a rotating cast of players every week?  Where the DM is seated with five people that they didn't expect, and the players sometimes come solo, sometimes come in groups, but almost always get one or two players that they didn't pick ahead of time.

We've got a unique situation. It's exhausting for me, to try and fit the puzzle together.

When I run a home game, I don't worry so much. I just pick people and run my game...

But I run public games for drop in players. We have to guard against things that you don't have to worry about.

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:58:31 PM

Quote from: PonchoGoblin on September 07, 2021, 11:56:10 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:52:52 PM

  LMAO, if right wing church groups are trying to cancel tv shows for violence/sex/language they are doing a pretty terrible job.  Come on now, be serious.   Did you wake up and think it was 1987?

lol aside from like the ultra small church groups that are quite literally a single family, I don't think this has really been a thing since at least the mid-90s 

There's a few groups that are quite organized and don't get as much traction as they used to. But they still exist and they still try and get things cancelled to a lot less success than they used to.

https://onemillionmoms.com/

When they were much larger movements, they would look like these HUUUUUGE movements, but it was a group that knew how to game the system to gain an overly large influence over things.

And you'll still see them weigh in on things and make nervous producers pull things that might attract their attention.

  Phone rang
  It was Tipper Gore calling from the early 90's, said it was for you.

Quote from: hoshisabi on September 07, 2021, 11:58:31 PM

Quote from: PonchoGoblin on September 07, 2021, 11:56:10 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:52:52 PM

  LMAO, if right wing church groups are trying to cancel tv shows for violence/sex/language they are doing a pretty terrible job.  Come on now, be serious.   Did you wake up and think it was 1987?

lol aside from like the ultra small church groups that are quite literally a single family, I don't think this has really been a thing since at least the mid-90s 

There's a few groups that are quite organized and don't get as much traction as they used to. But they still exist and they still try and get things cancelled to a lot less success than they used to.

https://onemillionmoms.com/

When they were much larger movements, they would look like these HUUUUUGE movements, but it was a group that knew how to game the system to gain an overly large influence over things.

And you'll still see them weigh in on things and make nervous producers pull things that might attract their attention.

And they are a continually smaller and smaller influence that are driving towards irrelevance. Getting impatient that they're not all gone already? Wanna load them up in box cars and send them to the camps?

Meanwhile expressing the mere thought that you don't want to kill babies gets you immediately fired from your position:
https://boundingintocomics.com/2021/09/07/babylon-bee-ceo-shares-open-letter-to-tripwire-games-after-president-steps-down-after-supporting-texas-new-pro-life-law/

Much quicker and much more effectively than any church group today.