The Origins event list is out.

There is 1 BASIC D&D game.
There are about 23 1st ed games.
There are 7 3.5 games.
There are 4 4e games.
There are 206 Pathfinder games.

D&D Next is imminent. It's just a matter of time, now, and the RPGA will follow.

Holly crap; I knew I was out of it when it comes to Pathfinder, but I didn't appreciate just how out of it I really am. When did the active D&D gaming community become 90 % Pathfinder? And only 4 sessions of 4E?

Quote from: Larsdangly;746997Holly crap; I knew I was out of it when it comes to Pathfinder, but I didn't appreciate just how out of it I really am. When did the active D&D gaming community become 90 % Pathfinder? And only 4 sessions of 4E?

When they stopped producing 4E 2 years ago. Once 5E is out then tell me the numbers. My guess is Pathfinder will be thinking of Pathfinder 2.0 by then.

It'll be interesting to see.

I haven't looked at Next recently enough to really say, but Pathfinder has such a strong build subgame that if people are really looking for that, will they be satisfied with Next, which seems (unscientific impression here) to be shying away from that a bit?

Quote from: Larsdangly;746997Holly crap; I knew I was out of it when it comes to Pathfinder, but I didn't appreciate just how out of it I really am. When did the active D&D gaming community become 90 % Pathfinder? And only 4 sessions of 4E?

4e is a dead game.  I mean, deader than 1e AD&D, deader than 3e, deader than Basic, etc.

Pathfinder is so huge I'd wager because it is 3e with a new coat of paint and These Go To 11 installed, so it's what people want.

Unlike any previous edition, WotC has all but apologized for 4e and has rolled back so much of it, the next game looks to basically ignore it.  Kinda like the Madonna introduction for the 1987 season of Saturday Night Live: "The producers would like to inform the audience that the previous season was a bad dream, please ignore it."

I'm sure a 4venger or two would leap in here and tell us all that 4e was objectively the best D&D EVER, but the proof says otherwise.

So anyway, yeah, 4e has been defenestrated, 3e (in Pathfinder clothes) rides tall in the saddle, and otherwise classic gaming takes up the rest of the slack.

Quote from: thedungeondelver;7470144e is a dead game.  I mean, deader than 1e AD&D, deader than 3e, deader than Basic, etc.

Pathfinder is so huge I'd wager because it is 3e with a new coat of paint and These Go To 11 installed, so it's what people want.

Unlike any previous edition, WotC has all but apologized for 4e and has rolled back so much of it, the next game looks to basically ignore it.  Kinda like the Madonna introduction for the 1987 season of Saturday Night Live: "The producers would like to inform the audience that the previous season was a bad dream, please ignore it."

I'm sure a 4venger or two would leap in here and tell us all that 4e was objectively the best D&D EVER, but the proof says otherwise.

So anyway, yeah, 4e has been defenestrated, 3e (in Pathfinder clothes) rides tall in the saddle, and otherwise classic gaming takes up the rest of the slack.

I know of a couple of 4vengers --none that post here or over at RPG.net, mind you-- who are weeping for all the "disastrous mistakes" being made with Next.

I just smile and nod, and ignore their pronouncements of doom.

That said, there's no guarantee whether D&D will get their mojo back from Pathfinder. The split might be too much to overcome.

QuoteThat said, there's no guarantee whether D&D will get their mojo back from Pathfinder. The split might be too much to overcome.

I think you're partially correct because Pathfinder has a lock on the 3E market but 5E isn't really looking to directly compete with that segment anyway. I think they're trying to grow the market and aim for lasped gamers and gamers looking for something a little less daunting than Pathfinder. More like 2E modernized and supported in a way the OSRIC crowd can't do.

I don't really follow the 5E/Next boards enough to have any idea what is really going on there, but I'm interested to see whether the upcoming round of competition between WoC and Paizo leads to an edition that is qualitatively different from 3E. The groundswell of OSR activity might suggest to them both that their customers (at least many of them) have a hankering for something that captures the spirit of exploration and quirky creativity that characterized the first few years of the hobby. I would love to see a product line that has the 'oomph' of a major player in the hobby really go that direction.

Quote from: Marleycat;747017I think you're partially correct because Pathfinder has a lock on the 3E market but 5E isn't really looking to directly compete with that segment anyway. I think they're trying to grow the market and aim for lasped gamers and gamers looking for something a little less daunting than Pathfinder. More like 2E modernized and supported in a way the OSRIC crowd can't do.

That's the impression I get as well.  And ceding the 3.x market to Paizo may be the best strategy.

It'll be interesting to see if the "modernized TSR-era D&D" market is actually there enough to put them on top again.

I don't know but Mearls mentioned that the core game would have the complexity of RC but modernized. That doesn't mean it couldn't be dailed up via other options/modules. If that's true it would hit a sweet spot for alot of gamers. I would definitely let Pathfinder trailblaze for 3E at some point they will have to put out Pathfinder 2.0 because the line is getting to that bloated stage.

Younger kids seem to like the bells and whistles. I don't know if it's gonna work.

Once you give somebody (in this case Paizo) an inch, they'll take a yard.

It'll be nice to see what they are actually coming out with when it's released.  Not the basic game, but these other things that Mearls makes reference to that could possibly happen.  A phone app where you drew a dungeon up and could stock it and have it keyed up?  That'd be pretty sweet.

Also, I think that 5th is going to do fine.

Quote from: flyerfan1991;747015I know of a couple of 4vengers --none that post here or over at RPG.net, mind you-- who are weeping for all the "disastrous mistakes" being made with Next.

I just smile and nod, and ignore their pronouncements of doom.

That said, there's no guarantee whether D&D will get their mojo back from Pathfinder. The split might be too much to overcome.

Yeah, something phenomenal is going to have to happen for D&D to ever be back in 1st place, I fear.