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Author Topic: Lamentations of the Flame Princess  (Read 19694 times)

Voros

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Lamentations of the Flame Princess
« on: September 19, 2017, 03:59:11 AM »
Rather surprised to find that LotFP didn't have its own thread.

So I'm creating this one to let y'all know that there is a LotFP bundle up on Bundle of Holding, so you can find out how these artfags and metalgeeks are ruining the OSR for yourselves.

Some of the best LotFP stuff is missing here, Hite's Qelong and Zak's Red and Pleasant Land and unfortunately Kowolski is represented with a merely okay module instead of his much better work for LotFP. But Death Frost Doom is still pretty great, way better than anything else I've read from Raggi and Stuart's Veins of the Earth is packed with terrific, imaginative content. I find the ruleset merely okay, just another B/X with houserules variant.

But I can now check out Chenier's Blood in Chocolate and Brockie's Tower Two, as well as find out if Carcosa is worth the controversy or just a shitty too-random hex crawl.

The Exploited.

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Lamentations of the Flame Princess
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2017, 06:55:01 AM »
Quote from: Voros;993789
Rather surprised to find that LotFP didn't have its own thread.

So I'm creating this one to let y'all know that there is a LotFP bundle up on Bundle of Holding, so you can find out how these artfags and metalgeeks are ruining the OSR for yourselves.

Some of the best LotFP stuff is missing here, Hite's Qelong and Zak's Red and Pleasant Land and unfortunately Kowolski is represented with a merely okay module instead of his much better work for LotFP. But Death Frost Doom is still pretty great, way better than anything else I've read from Raggi and Stuart's Veins of the Earth is packed with terrific, imaginative content. I find the ruleset merely okay, just another B/X with houserules variant.

But I can now check out Chenier's Blood in Chocolate and Brockie's Tower Two, as well as find out if Carcosa is worth the controversy or just a shitty too-random hex crawl.

Great deal overall...

I agree ith you though, I thought the house rules did the job but were nothing special. I'd prefer something like Beyond The Wall.

DFD is very good indeed and pays a nice little homage to EDII. Although, I fear for the player's safety in that one ;). But the overall vibe is really cool. Red and Plesant Land is great and one of the most original takes on something that I've ever heard.

I quite liked Carcosa... But I didn't really get the whole 'controversy' tbh. But even if you didn't play as is, and you like your Lovecraft, there are some great ideas to be had.

Great bundle tho'!!
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Just Another Snake Cult

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« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2017, 05:09:13 PM »
Broodmother Skyfortress is a fucking masterpiece. A smart, fun, and wildly original re-imagining of Against the Giants that blows the original out of the water while still having affection and respect for it.  Get it, you won't regret it.
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Psikerlord

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« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2017, 07:31:22 PM »
Quote from: Just Another Snake Cult;994039
Broodmother Skyfortress is a fucking masterpiece. A smart, fun, and wildly original re-imagining of Against the Giants that blows the original out of the water while still having affection and respect for it.  Get it, you won't regret it.

I already like the name of it! Shall check it out
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jux

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« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2017, 06:11:46 AM »
I was not impressed with LotFP. I know better OSR games out there. The core-i death-metal artwork is out of context - no resemblance of actual game, mechanics or text. Just there to shock you. More like WTF.
If it wants to be dark fantasy game - there should be some kind of sanity, corruption system - but there is none.
I am a fan of an idea of strip-down minimalistic systems - but yet there is the Specialist class with it's very narrow focused skills. Totally out of place imho. Architecture? Seriously?

I do like what has done with the Magic. It rocks!
Also the print book is beautiful. Nice layout and art. The core is just not necessary.

But I ignore this game completely. To me LotFP is all about the dark fantasy adventures. Small hardcover books - just top quality. Something I always have room in my collection for more.

DKChannelBoredom

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« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2017, 08:07:36 AM »
Some ok stuff in there but Dungeon of the Unknown is terrible. Were Ken Hites Quelong and Kelvin Greens Forgive Us in the first bundle? If not, they are missing here - good books, both of them.

As a whole I've grown pretty bored with LotFP - especially that James stills hasn't bothered putting out the new version of the Ref Book - crowdfunded in f*cking 2013 and at that time was super urgent so the The Rules and Magic book wouldn't stand useless and alone or as the Indigogo campaign said "the new version of the game as a whole cannot yet go into the retail chain where it attracts new fans."

Bah. James should just admit that he is more interested in/making more money from scenarios and settings than his own system and admit the book is never going to happen - embarrasing as it is.
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Voros

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« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2017, 03:17:02 PM »
Quote from: jux;994212
I was not impressed with LotFP. I know better OSR games out there. The core-i death-metal artwork is out of context - no resemblance of actual game, mechanics or text. Just there to shock you. More like WTF.
If it wants to be dark fantasy game - there should be some kind of sanity, corruption system - but there is none.
I am a fan of an idea of strip-down minimalistic systems - but yet there is the Specialist class with it's very narrow focused skills. Totally out of place imho. Architecture? Seriously?

I do like what has done with the Magic. It rocks!
Also the print book is beautiful. Nice layout and art. The core is just not necessary.

But I ignore this game completely. To me LotFP is all about the dark fantasy adventures. Small hardcover books - just top quality. Something I always have room in my collection for more.

I agree, I was looking through the rulebook again and the ultraviolent artwork was in no way reflected in the mechanics which is just B/X and Red Box to me. Some of the artwork is excellent though.

I do like the unique dark chaos spells and summoning rules, although the dice mechanic around summoning is far too convoluted. But there are really only a handful of those spells, the inclusion of something like Magic Missile seems like a failure of imagination or just a sop.

And upon review the claim it is a 'low magic' setting just because he removed Fireball doesn't hold up to me when stuff like Cloudkill and Powerword Kill and Timestop are still in there.

But as you say it is the adventures and settings that really matter.

Voros

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« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2017, 03:21:57 PM »
Quote from: DKChannelBoredom;994218
Bah. James should just admit that he is more interested in/making more money from scenarios and settings than his own system and admit the book is never going to happen - embarrasing as it is.

Raggi says he makes more money from the largely redundant rules set than he does from the adventures.

Who actually needs a Ref Book to play the game? No offense, but it sounds like those items play more to the OCD collector crowd than those at a table.

But of course if it was promised in a Crowdfunding campaign it should be delivered. Raggi seems to suffer from writer's block as he puts out other's stuff at a pretty steady pace.

jcfiala

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« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2017, 04:49:21 PM »
Quote from: DKChannelBoredom;994218
Some ok stuff in there but Dungeon of the Unknown is terrible. Were Ken Hites Quelong and Kelvin Greens Forgive Us in the first bundle? If not, they are missing here - good books, both of them.

Those were both in the original bundle, as well as Vornheim.
 

Vile

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« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2017, 11:29:03 PM »
Quote from: Voros;994308
Who actually needs a Ref Book to play the game?
LotFP Rules & Magic is a very handy package, more so than pretty much any other book in that vein (Delving Deeper comes close, but Lulu softcover can't compare to Raggi's awesome hardback quality). And I do need to refer to spells, prices, saving throws, and whatnot during a game. No spare brain capacity to store information I can look up in a book.

christopherkubasik

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« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2017, 11:38:13 PM »
I think the A5 format, the sturdy binding, the complete information in the book make the rules for LotFP perfect for me. It sits comfortable on the table, and I can hold it in one hand to reference it while picking up some dice to roll with my other hand. (Which is why I use it happily.)

Also, in a game like Basic D&D the spells in the game are going to be one of the key elements that really nail down the tone and feel of the game. Without doubt the original Referee book (which is a free download and still quiet usable with terrific advice) nails down the a lot more of what Raggi was going for with his type of play. But to dismiss the spells as "well the only weirdness is in the spells" is to really miss how specific both the spells and their descriptions are to nailing down an the most important element of what makes the game unique. It may not be unique enough to satisfy some... but the spells do make it unique.

Voros

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« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2017, 03:23:23 AM »
Quote from: Vile;994451
LotFP Rules & Magic is a very handy package, more so than pretty much any other book in that vein (Delving Deeper comes close, but Lulu softcover can't compare to Raggi's awesome hardback quality). And I do need to refer to spells, prices, saving throws, and whatnot during a game. No spare brain capacity to store information I can look up in a book.


Great explanation for the original rules set but not the need for a seperate Ref Sourcebook. And I am a bit mystified by the need for equipment and price lists this far into fantasy rpg history.

Voros

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« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2017, 03:25:30 AM »
Quote from: ChristopherKubasik;994455
I think the A5 format, the sturdy binding, the complete information in the book make the rules for LotFP perfect for me. It sits comfortable on the table, and I can hold it in one hand to reference it while picking up some dice to roll with my other hand. (Which is why I use it happily.)

Also, in a game like Basic D&D the spells in the game are going to be one of the key elements that really nail down the tone and feel of the game. Without doubt the original Referee book (which is a free download and still quiet usable with terrific advice) nails down the a lot more of what Raggi was going for with his type of play. But to dismiss the spells as "well the only weirdness is in the spells" is to really miss how specific both the spells and their descriptions are to nailing down an the most important element of what makes the game unique. It may not be unique enough to satisfy some... but the spells do make it unique.

Sorry not convinced. Most of the spells are boilerplate B/X or 1e spells. There are almost less than half a dozen unique spells of any significance.

I do like the book format and art though. Or the art that isn't trying too hard to be 'shocking' I should say.

DKChannelBoredom

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« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2017, 03:25:36 AM »
Quote from: Voros;994308
Raggi says he makes more money from the largely redundant rules set than he does from the adventures.

Really? That's really surprising. Whaddayouknow.

And shame if it is writer's block that is in the way - but really, he has got the rules written from the latest grindhouse edition and we've seen plenty of new art floating around. Just slap on the new cover (that is ready, if I remember correctly), fix the typos, and put in the new art - seriously, what needs to be rewritten/added is very little. Just get it out there and get a physical book out in the shops to stand next to the by now large range of good looking LotFP books that are out there. It is, by James' own 2013-logic, an amputated game he has out there and continually supports with the new material.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2017, 03:58:19 AM by DKChannelBoredom »
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Voros

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« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2017, 03:30:05 AM »
It is surprising to Raggi too. I don't understand the apparently bottomless appetite for minor variations on the D&D system myself.