This is a site for discussing roleplaying games. Have fun doing so, but there is one major rule: do not discuss political issues that aren't directly and uniquely related to the subject of the thread and about gaming. While this site is dedicated to free speech, the following will not be tolerated: devolving a thread into unrelated political discussion, sockpuppeting (using multiple and/or bogus accounts), disrupting topics without contributing to them, and posting images that could get someone fired in the workplace (an external link is OK, but clearly mark it as Not Safe For Work, or NSFW). If you receive a warning, please take it seriously and either move on to another topic or steer the discussion back to its original RPG-related theme.

Author Topic: ISO Space  (Read 1998 times)

Tyndale

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
ISO Space
« on: December 26, 2019, 06:45:15 PM »
I just came back from The Rise of Skywalker.  Leaving aside my personal quibbles and critique, I was nonetheless entertained and appreciated the wrapping up of the story line, especially the final scene and homage to Tatooine where things all started...I felt like I was seven again, and feeling again a "new hope".

Nostalgia aside, this has made me think of Space RPGs and my sadly limited experience with them.  I played in a brief Traveler campaign and thoroughly enjoyed it as short as it lasted.  So, I'd love to hear what systems others have used and recommend (or don't), and what specific attributes they provide (or are lacking).  Specifically, what suggestions there are for a space exploration (sandbox) campaign, but also a solid system for ship building and combat. My inner Han Solo is feeling has an itch that needs to be scratched.

Gratefully,

Mark
-The world grew old and the Dwarves failed and the days of Durin’s race were ended.

Thornhammer

  • Seen Your Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • T
  • Posts: 859
ISO Space
« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2019, 06:53:42 PM »
Quote from: Tyndale;1117451
I just came back from The Rise of Skywalker.  Leaving aside my personal quibbles and critique, I was nonetheless entertained and appreciated the wrapping up of the story line, especially the final scene and homage to Tatooine where things all started...I felt like I was seven again, and feeling again a "new hope".

Nostalgia aside, this has made me think of Space RPGs and my sadly limited experience with them.  I played in a brief Traveler campaign and thoroughly enjoyed it as short as it lasted.  So, I'd love to hear what systems others have used and recommend (or don't), and what specific attributes they provide (or are lacking).  Specifically, what suggestions there are for a space exploration (sandbox) campaign, but also a solid system for ship building and combat. My inner Han Solo is feeling has an itch that needs to be scratched.

Gratefully,

Mark

If your inner Han Solo has an itch, you can do far worse than looking at some of the actual Star Wars RPGs.

My personal favorite is the West End Games version, but I'm an old shit.  Fantasy Flight did a 30th anniversary reprint of it not long ago, core book and the Star Wars sourcebook.  If you like that, there is a friggin' TON of additional material.

Tyndale

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
ISO Space
« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2019, 07:08:06 PM »
Thanks, Thornhammer.  Checking it out!
-The world grew old and the Dwarves failed and the days of Durin’s race were ended.

Tyndale

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
ISO Space
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2019, 07:30:36 PM »
Followup after a quick search.  How does FFG's version differ from Womp Rat Press's "Revised Expanded Updated"?
-The world grew old and the Dwarves failed and the days of Durin’s race were ended.

Brad

  • Semper Qvantvm Potes
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3628
ISO Space
« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2019, 07:34:47 PM »
Quote from: Tyndale;1117456
Followup after a quick search.  How does FFG's version differ from Womp Rat Press's "Revised Expanded Updated"?


The reprint is just 1st Edition SW, which is the best version and my favorite RPG. The one floating around in direct violation of copyright (whatever!) is pretty close, but adds some stuff from later editions so it's not exactly the same. Close enough for horseshoes and hand grenades.

The new FFG game sucks ass, IDGAF what anyone else thinks. I shouldn't need tons of super special dice that cannot be used with any other game and all sorts of meta-game concepts to play an RPG.
It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance.

Robyo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • R
  • Posts: 154
ISO Space
« Reply #5 on: December 26, 2019, 10:05:07 PM »
Starfinder scratches the sci-fi itch for our group. It's D20 based, currently in print, and the game is far more gonzo than space opera. We just use what appeals and ignore the rest. Our games are far more like Shadowrun than Star Wars.

Omega

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • O
  • Posts: 17093
ISO Space
« Reply #6 on: December 26, 2019, 10:24:04 PM »
Some good SF games.

Personal favourite is Star Frontiers from TSR. This hits my general sweet spot for relatively hard SF with a little not so hard SF. Ships are towers since there is no anti gravity. There are energy weapons - but they chew through batteries. Ship combat is slow, each round comprising 10 minutes and in the thousands of miles range. Very few alien races. Rules for space exploration and even running businesses. The system is also adaptable enough they did a 2001 and 2010 module set with it.

Second personal favourite is Albedo. Aside from an extremely hazardous jump drive it is very hard on the hard sci-fi scale. Also a very lethal combat system.

Third personal favourite is SPI's Universe RPG. This came with a 3d map of space out to 20 ly from Earth and has a very robust star system gen system. I plug that into Star Frontiers.

Friend of mine has the Buck Rogers RPG from TSR. This is semi compatible with 2e D&D and 4e Gamma World. This is what the two SSI gold box games were based on. Sadly not as robust a system as Star Frontiers. But not a bad setting.

Others have heard of suggested but only had limited experience with.

Traveller: This tends to lean to the softer side of SF. But is a very robust system and adaptable to various approaches.
Starships & Spacemen: a really old Star Trek style RPG with a plug in board game for solo play. Recently saw both a reprint, which I have, and a new edition, which a friend of mine did an expansion for.
CP2020 Near Orbit and Deep Space: These two comprise some pretty good SF settings for CP2020.

GameDaddy
BANNED

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2931
ISO Space
« Reply #7 on: December 26, 2019, 11:00:27 PM »
Big Traveller fan here. Traveller matches up nicely with the hard sci-fi that was both prevalent and popular prior to the release of Star Wars that fits very well with the original Alien movie, Sean Connerys' sci-fi movie Outland, as well as the newer Expanse sci-fi series on Amazon Prime. That said, I also run Star Wars Saga edition games based on the WOTC ruleset which I like very much as it matches the homebrew Star Wars games very closely that we made up back in the 70's using the D&D rules. Also happen to like Metamorphosis Alpha / Gamma World too. Other Sci-Fi games I like very much include the Mindjammer RPG by Sarah Newton which is Transhuman Adventure in the Second Age of Space, and rounding out my top five is Starsiege which is the Sci-Fi variant of Castles and Crusades.

Another Sci-Fi game that is seeing alot of play right now is Starfinder, which is Paizo's Sci-Fi game, however I haven't even sat in on one game, and I really should, just to get a feel for the game.
Blackmoor grew from a single Castle to include, first, several adjacent Castles (with the forces of Evil lying just off the edge of the world to an entire Northern Province of the Castle and Crusade Society's Great Kingdom.

~ Dave Arneson

Aglondir

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • A
  • Posts: 1588
ISO Space
« Reply #8 on: December 26, 2019, 11:07:52 PM »
Quote from: Tyndale;1117451
So, I'd love to hear what systems others have used and recommend (or don't), and what specific attributes they provide (or are lacking).  Specifically, what suggestions there are for a space exploration (sandbox) campaign, but also a solid system for ship building and combat.


Stars Without Number.

Quote from: Sine Nomine Publishing
Try our free flagship product, Stars Without Number, a game of science-fiction adventure inspired by old-school gaming aesthetics. Quick and familiar game mechanics are supported by extensive tools, tables, and tips for creating unexplored stellar sectors, enigmatic aliens, ferocious xenomorphs, and scheming interstellar factions. Game masters can take advantage of one hundred sci-fi adventure seeds designed to interlock with a world generation system involving five dozen descriptive "world tags", each fleshed out with examples of friends, enemies, places, things, and complications appropriate to the tag. Resource tables for random generation of names, NPCs, religions, political parties, architectural styles, and room furnishings excel in generating the kind of fast, smooth content that sandbox gaming demands. Pick Stars Without Number up at DriveThruRPG; now also available in perfect-bound and hardback print versions.

jeff37923

  • Knight of Common Sense
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18318
ISO Space
« Reply #9 on: December 26, 2019, 11:08:53 PM »
Quote from: Tyndale;1117451
I just came back from The Rise of Skywalker.  Leaving aside my personal quibbles and critique, I was nonetheless entertained and appreciated the wrapping up of the story line, especially the final scene and homage to Tatooine where things all started...I felt like I was seven again, and feeling again a "new hope".

Nostalgia aside, this has made me think of Space RPGs and my sadly limited experience with them.  I played in a brief Traveler campaign and thoroughly enjoyed it as short as it lasted.  So, I'd love to hear what systems others have used and recommend (or don't), and what specific attributes they provide (or are lacking).  Specifically, what suggestions there are for a space exploration (sandbox) campaign, but also a solid system for ship building and combat. My inner Han Solo is feeling has an itch that needs to be scratched.

Gratefully,

Mark

A lot is going to depend on the style of play you are looking for.

If you want Star Wars that emulates what you see in the Star Wars universe media, you cannot go wrong with the WEG d6 SWRPG. No other version of Star Wars compares favorably. FFG is a narrativist mess that requires you to buy a few separate games and a bunch of gimmick dice instead of a single book if you want to play. The d20 version of SWRPG put out by WotC plays like D&D in Space (which is a problem best avoided IMHO, more on that later). For sandbox space exploration, it rocks (especially when supplemented by Wookiepedia and the Star Wars Galaxy Map). However, creating new starships is difficult, although there are a lot already made and modification of them is in the main rulebooks.

Now if you want a Space RPG that better emulates the written science fiction of the past 60 years, then your best bet would be Traveller or Cepheus Engine. Lots of support and advantages for those intertwined systems but the gameplay does not resemble the science fantasy of Star Wars unless you really break the system.

For cyberpunk, use Cyberpunk 2020. The Near Orbit and Deep Space books are good, but again it will not be Star Wars.

For anime or mecha, use Mekton II or Mekton Zeta. If you like giant robots and want your space opera to be more like Gundam or Macross, then this is the game system for you.

Now, there are a number of games out there that use the base D&D character generation and combat system in their body of rules. Avoid them. No D&D based combat system has come to terms with the lethality of modern weapons (except Traveller d20) and all of them have gameplay like D&D in Space (even to a degree, Traveller d20). If D&D in Space is your thing, more power to you, but eventually the campaign will fizzle because the people gaming will start wondering why they are playing this game and not just D&D.

Just my own two cents worth.....
"Meh."

Shawn Driscoll

  • Role-Play Purist
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2928
ISO Space
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2019, 12:31:45 AM »
Quote from: Tyndale;1117451
I just came back from The Rise of Skywalker.  Leaving aside my personal quibbles and critique, I was nonetheless entertained and appreciated the wrapping up of the story line, especially the final scene and homage to Tatooine where things all started...I felt like I was seven again, and feeling again a "new hope".

Nostalgia aside, this has made me think of Space RPGs and my sadly limited experience with them.  I played in a brief Traveler campaign and thoroughly enjoyed it as short as it lasted.  So, I'd love to hear what systems others have used and recommend (or don't), and what specific attributes they provide (or are lacking).  Specifically, what suggestions there are for a space exploration (sandbox) campaign, but also a solid system for ship building and combat. My inner Han Solo is feeling has an itch that needs to be scratched.

Gratefully,

Mark

Stick with a game mechanic you like for fantasy and find a syfy template for it.

Spinachcat

  • Toxic SocioCat
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • S
  • Posts: 14805
ISO Space
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2019, 03:08:40 AM »
Star Wars D6 is the best SW RPG, but if you're a D20 fan then Saga edition might be worth your attention.

But also poke around DriveThruRPG to see what the small press kids have been doing with space RPGs lately. There's many dozens worth a look.

Tyndale

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
ISO Space
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2019, 07:58:18 AM »
Holy shit ton of options, Batman (a good thing). Thanks all!  I ordered the 30th Anniversary Star Wars Box because is seems like a good place to start - and I am a sucker for boxed sets.  I also am reading the SWN Revised and Free version now.  Another question, is am seeing the term "hard" and "soft" upthread and feeling this has specific meaning.  Am I correct to infer that "hard" has to do with accuracy of technology/physics?
« Last Edit: December 27, 2019, 08:09:52 AM by Tyndale »
-The world grew old and the Dwarves failed and the days of Durin’s race were ended.

Tyndale

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
ISO Space
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2019, 08:21:16 AM »
Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;1117471
Stick with a game mechanic you like for fantasy and find a syfy template for it.

I'm mostly familiar with Burning Wheel, and not sure I want to run Burning Empires (a whole other conversation).
-The world grew old and the Dwarves failed and the days of Durin’s race were ended.

Lurkndog

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 823
ISO Space
« Reply #14 on: December 27, 2019, 09:33:21 AM »
Add me to the recommendations for WEG D6 Star Wars.

One big advantage of the D6 system is that it is very simple, and that makes it easy to get started with, and also very easy to adapt. I've used it for both Babylon 5, and an age of sail pirate campaign.

One disadvantage of D6 Star Wars is that it was written before the Prequel Trilogy. So the Jedi rules are basically aimed at making OT Luke Skywalker, an adventurer with some force abilities added. If you want the full-powered Jedi from the prequels and sequels, you may want to look at the newer systems.