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Pen & Paper Roleplaying Central => Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion => Topic started by: HappyDaze on July 30, 2018, 08:14:58 AM

Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on July 30, 2018, 08:14:58 AM
The WFRP4e early release pdf has been out for a few days. It has lots of little fixes that need to be done, and the lack of bookmarks is irritating, so I'm looking forward to when they replace the file with the finished version. Until then, this does show what looks to be a beautiful product and the system seems to be a fairly evolutionary step on the 1e-2e lines (not sure about magick yet, I haven't gotten that far).

I can already tell that this will cause me to permanently shelf Zweihander.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Gorilla Feet on July 30, 2018, 08:52:41 AM
"Permanently shelf Zweihander" has my interest piqued. I didn't much care for WFRP3 so I had not even given 4th a thought until now.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: The Exploited. on July 30, 2018, 10:25:43 AM
I'm still reading through it... I like it a lot so far. Thank Christ C7 dropped the horrific 3e concept and went back to the original roots of the game.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: AaronBrown99 on July 31, 2018, 12:09:15 AM
Not interested. I found a conversion for much of my 3e stuff to FFG's Genesys system.

The talent structure is a better way to handle career advancement than the cards.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Malleustein on July 31, 2018, 12:47:11 AM
I have only been able to glance at the book so far.  What I have seen I like.

I was initially put off by Resolve and Resilience.  I dislike expendable resources (willpower points, luck points, fate points, etc.) as they feel like rewinding time to succeed after failing rather than just dealing with the results and moving on.  But Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay has always had Fate points, so I will learn to live with them.

I approve of the character creation rules.  You can pick and point buy for your character or you can roll randomly.  The more you accept chaos (random rolls), the more experience you get for your starting career.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on July 31, 2018, 12:54:03 AM
Quote from: Malleustein;1050948
I approve of the character creation rules.  You can pick and point buy for your character or you can roll randomly.  The more you accept chaos (random rolls), the more experience you get for your starting career.
I like that elves are only 2% of the random rolls. If you want to play an elf, be prepared to forgo some of that bonus starting XP.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Malleustein on July 31, 2018, 01:29:33 AM
Quote from: HappyDaze;1050949
I like that elves are only 2% of the random rolls. If you want to play an elf, be prepared to forgo some of that bonus starting XP.

Yes, I do think the breakdown percentage of Humans and the non-Humans is good.  I always secretly disliked my players choosing Dwarves and Elves in previous editions.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on July 31, 2018, 03:54:09 AM
Quote from: Malleustein;1050951
Yes, I do think the breakdown percentage of Humans and the non-Humans is good.  I always secretly disliked my players choosing Dwarves and Elves in previous editions.

They still have the option to make that choice, but now there is a cost to making it unless the dice are very kind.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: RPGPundit on August 01, 2018, 01:26:12 PM
Sounds promising. Ultimately, it would need to be significantly more useful than 2e for me to consider it.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: danbuter on August 01, 2018, 04:11:20 PM
I'm definitely interested.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: KingCheops on August 01, 2018, 04:23:31 PM
I'm one of those few weirdos happy with 3e.  I'm holding out to see what C7 does with Age of Sigmar.  Love the setting.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: thedungeondelver on August 01, 2018, 05:06:27 PM
I think the important question here is can you die of typhus because someone hit you with a board full of rusty nails while having a knock-down brawl in an alleyway being used as a midden?

Because if the answer is "Yes!" then it's WHFRP enough for me.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on August 01, 2018, 06:27:38 PM
Quote from: KingCheops;1051148
I'm one of those few weirdos happy with 3e.  I'm holding out to see what C7 does with Age of Sigmar.  Love the setting.

Now you are twice-damned!
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 01, 2018, 10:04:29 PM
I am very, very interested.

I've never played WFR before. Watched a youtube series flicking through the PDF, and I liked what I saw: persistent injuries, madness, disease, unpredictable magic, critical hit locations and charts... I get the feeling the game is dangerous and gritty, with the Old World backdrop (which years ago I didnt like, but have come around to).

The only thing I dont like is the $30 for a PDF price tag. Sheesh! I guess it is colour though, and 350 or something pages, so it's big. I want to see some final reviews and play videos before getting it however.

I am keen to know.... (i) how easy/quick healing is, and (ii) whether there are "improvised" actions/stunts in combat. Can anyone shed any light on these?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Abraxus on August 02, 2018, 09:03:39 AM
Does anyone know if they fixed or lessened the whiff factor of combat. I'm not looking forward to more " I swing and I miss" in combat. .
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Manic Modron on August 02, 2018, 10:12:21 AM
Quote from: sureshot;1051178
Does anyone know if they fixed or lessened the whiff factor of combat. I'm not looking forward to more " I swing and I miss" in combat. .


Combat is now an opposed roll.  If you miss it is only because the other person rolled better than you for their defense.   Figuring it out is a bit more math than before, but just simple subtraction.  I may not explain this very well since I'm on my way out to work and sort of rushing the post, but I'll give it a shot.

The tens digit for your characteristic or skill is an important number.  When you make a Dramatic or Opposed Test you subtract the tens digit of your roll from the tens of your characteristic or skill.  That gives you a Success Level.

The attacker rolls Weapon Proficiency  to hit and the defender rolls the same to Parry or Dodge to dodge.  Whoever gets the better Success Level wins and builds up Advantage.  Advantage gives you an increasing +10% to your rolls until you get damaged, then you lose it all.  

Damage is based on your Success Level.   So if the attacker has a Hand Weapon and Strength 30, the base damage is 7.  

Say our combatants have 40 for their Weapon Skills.  The attacker rolls 60 and the defender rolls 90.  The SLs are -2 and -5, so the attacker wins, but the SL is -2 for the attack so the incoming damage is 5 wounds.

Take the same set up, but the attacker has a 60 for their weapon skill. The SLs are +0 and -5, so the attacker wins again with the full 7 wounds.  

Crappy fighters aren't going to just sit there swinging at the air for an endless series of wiffs, but their blows aren't going to be as good as skilled fighters.  Still, with Advantage in the mix, even a crappy fighter might be able to beat an opponent into a corner and land a telling blow.

Also, even if Toughness + Armor is more than the incoming damage, the target still takes one wound.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: crkrueger on August 02, 2018, 10:23:31 AM
Quote from: thedungeondelver;1051149
I think the important question here is can you die of typhus because someone hit you with a board full of rusty nails while having a knock-down brawl in an alleyway being used as a midden?

Because if the answer is "Yes!" then it's WHFRP enough for me.


Well, they got the Black Plague, Blood Rot, Bloody Flux, Galloping Trots, Itching Pox, Packer's Pox, and Ratte Fever.

They also have a "build your own disease" from a list of 12 different ailments.

So yep, I'd say you're covered.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: thedungeondelver on August 02, 2018, 10:54:57 AM
Quote from: CRKrueger;1051181
Well, they got the Black Plague, Blood Rot, Bloody Flux, Galloping Trots, Itching Pox, Packer's Pox, and Ratte Fever.

They also have a "build your own disease" from a list of 12 different ailments.

So yep, I'd say you're covered.

HOT DAMN ETHYL

where do I get a copy!
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: KingCheops on August 02, 2018, 01:24:13 PM
Quote from: HappyDaze;1051151
Now you are twice-damned!

Thrice actually.  I unabashedly love D&D 4e.

Truly I was sent directly by The Everchosen himself to prepare the way.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: crkrueger on August 02, 2018, 02:21:54 PM
Quote from: KingCheops;1051197
Thrice actually.  I unabashedly love D&D 4e.

Truly I was sent directly by The Everchosen himself to prepare the way.

So you like WFRP3 and D&D4...that's no big deal.  No one plays RPGs all the time. :D
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: KingCheops on August 02, 2018, 02:29:09 PM
Quote from: CRKrueger;1051202
So you like WFRP3 and D&D4...that's no big deal.  No one plays RPGs all the time. :D

I know right?  Gotta mix it up with them board games.

Has Cubicle 7 said anything about setting releases for The-World-That-Was?  That would pique my interest in their stuff a bit more.  You know, other than just chunks of it being repurposed into Sigmar's new Ghal Maraz.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: crkrueger on August 02, 2018, 02:36:05 PM
Quote from: KingCheops;1051203
I know right?  Gotta mix it up with them board games.

Has Cubicle 7 said anything about setting releases for The-World-That-Was?  That would pique my interest in their stuff a bit more.  You know, other than just chunks of it being repurposed into Sigmar's new Ghal Maraz.


They've said they have a whole line planned.  I expect a Magic Book, Chaos Book, God Book, just from the limited number of spells in the main book.  I have heard adventures.  I don't recall anything specific about Setting Books, but I'm sure we'll get some.

The setting so far seems to include the Yeovil-verse (Jack Yeovil/Kim Newman) since the timeline states the campaign is just a couple years after the events of the novel Drachenfels and mentions Detlef Sierck.

There's also some references to Ubersreik in the timeline.  I recall hearing something about Ubersreik in the Dev comments, so possibly, like 3rd Edition, there will be adventures set in the Ubersreik area, perhaps dealing with the aftermath of Drachenfels or perhaps even an expedition to clear out/raze the castle of the Great Enchanter.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Manic Modron on August 02, 2018, 03:36:29 PM
There is certainly going to be an Empire Within campaign book for 4e.  I think that is the only concrete title so far.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: KingCheops on August 02, 2018, 04:30:12 PM
Any likelihood they do an End Times campaign book instead of a rehash of the Storm of Chaos?

Lots of fun stuff to explore in the End Times.  I might even be willing to allow those poncy High Elves in a game
SPOILER (Hover over section below to view.)

so we can play out Malekith's coronation and the civil war
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Manic Modron on August 02, 2018, 06:07:24 PM
I hope they do neither thing.  No Storm of Chaos.  No End Times.  No GW metaplot, or at least as much of it excised as possible.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: PrometheanVigil on August 03, 2018, 03:36:39 PM
Quote from: KingCheops;1051197
Thrice actually.  I unabashedly love D&D 4e.

Truly I was sent directly by The Everchosen himself to prepare the way.


Hah hah hah hah!
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 04, 2018, 05:53:15 PM
So I did a review: overall I like it a lot :) https://lowfantasygaming.com/2018/08/05/warhammer-4e-review/
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: The Exploited. on August 04, 2018, 06:43:20 PM
Quote from: Psikerlord;1051516
So I did a review: overall I like it a lot :) https://lowfantasygaming.com/2018/08/05/warhammer-4e-review/

Good review mate!
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: The Exploited. on August 04, 2018, 06:59:07 PM
I think 4e is very good so far. They've done what they had set out to do. Bring the best version of 1 and 2 together.

Love they way they have expanded 'tests' now, they are still easy but add a lot more depth (if needed). I also appreciate the extra options that they introduce to make the game play a little quicker or just add a different flavor (initiative springs to mind - as you've now got several options).

Art is class. The layout is nice even though the pdf is not 100% finished yet. Kept good flavor with the careers too.

Combat is still similar but again you've not got SL levels and lots of common sense considerations.

The only thing I'm not mad on so far, are the status mechanics. I find them a little convoluted and over worked.

I find the book's text a little... Well... 'Too down to earth'. This is obviously for the newbies, so I can understand why. It feels like WFRP so I'm happy.

Funny, when I heard that Warhammer was getting another edition I found it very amusing. I really thought it would be totally botched. But when I heard that C7 were doing it, and that they were going with the original game's sensibilities I was quite confident that they'd do a good job and they didn't disappoint!
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: PrometheanVigil on August 05, 2018, 02:53:15 AM
Quote from: psikerlord;1051516
so i did a review: Overall i like it a lot :) https://lowfantasygaming.com/2018/08/05/warhammer-4e-review/

whar 'ar tha' gunz?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 05, 2018, 03:16:38 AM
Quote from: The Exploited.;1051521
Good review mate!

Cheers TE :)
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 05, 2018, 03:18:54 AM
Quote from: The Exploited.;1051523
I think 4e is very good so far. They've done what they had set out to do. Bring the best version of 1 and 2 together.

Love they way they have expanded 'tests' now, they are still easy but add a lot more depth (if needed). I also appreciate the extra options that they introduce to make the game play a little quicker or just add a different flavor (initiative springs to mind - as you've now got several options).

Art is class. The layout is nice even though the pdf is not 100% finished yet. Kept good flavor with the careers too.

Combat is still similar but again you've not got SL levels and lots of common sense considerations.

The only thing I'm not mad on so far, are the status mechanics. I find them a little convoluted and over worked.

I find the book's text a little... Well... 'Too down to earth'. This is obviously for the newbies, so I can understand why. It feels like WFRP so I'm happy.

Funny, when I heard that Warhammer was getting another edition I found it very amusing. I really thought it would be totally botched. But when I heard that C7 were doing it, and that they were going with the original game's sensibilities I was quite confident that they'd do a good job and they didn't disappoint!

Yep I think they did a good job, and as I understand it, they've gone back to 1e and 2e style mechanics. I've never played WFRP at all, but I certainly want to give this version a spin. Vastly prefer it to D&D 5e.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: KingCheops on August 05, 2018, 11:51:46 AM
Quote from: Psikerlord;1051516
So I did a review: overall I like it a lot :) https://lowfantasygaming.com/2018/08/05/warhammer-4e-review/


Thanks for the review.  Except you are truly a servant of Slaanesh since you almost have me convinced to buy it.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 06, 2018, 12:14:16 AM
Quote from: KingCheops;1051617
Thanks for the review.  Except you are truly a servant of Slaanesh since you almost have me convinced to buy it.

One of us, one of us...
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: TJS on August 06, 2018, 02:10:50 AM
I'm liking what I'm seeing but there's no way I'm putting money down for anything but a physical product I can use to actually run a game.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: thedungeondelver on August 06, 2018, 02:24:25 AM
How does the magic system feel, and what about advanced careers and career exits.

I guess what I'm saying is, enough fol-de-rol, post the whole book in text form plz. :D
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Spinachcat on August 06, 2018, 04:35:48 AM
Quote from: Psikerlord;1051516
So I did a review: overall I like it a lot :) https://lowfantasygaming.com/2018/08/05/warhammer-4e-review/


Thanks for the review. It confirms my suspicions that my WFRP 1e tome continues to be the only Warhammer I need.

4e looks fine and good, just not seeing anything superior to the original.

Much of the "new rules" look like common house rule discussions over the decades.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Nerzenjäger on August 06, 2018, 04:52:45 AM
Quote from: Spinachcat;1051773
Much of the "new rules" look like common house rule discussions over the decades.

So it is superior to 1E?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: The Exploited. on August 06, 2018, 08:33:24 AM
Quote from: Nerzenjäger;1051782
So it is superior to 1E?

It is for sure.

I love 1e too, but this is an excellent refinement of the 1st and 2nd edition's rules. Exactly what was called for after the 3e debacle.

This doesn't negate the 1e's material as in the supplements which are still among the best ever written imo.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: The Exploited. on August 06, 2018, 08:35:29 AM
Double post.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Madprofessor on August 06, 2018, 02:20:56 PM
Quote from: RPGPundit;1051127
Sounds promising. Ultimately, it would need to be significantly more useful than 2e for me to consider it.


This. I am definitely interested. WFRP 2e is a top shelf game. I'm all over this game if it adds anything significant to 2e, but I don't want to buy a rehash that I don't need.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Madprofessor on August 06, 2018, 02:23:10 PM
Quote from: Manic Modron;1051180
Combat is now an opposed roll.  If you miss it is only because the other person rolled better than you for their defense.   Figuring it out is a bit more math than before, but just simple subtraction.  I may not explain this very well since I'm on my way out to work and sort of rushing the post, but I'll give it a shot.

The tens digit for your characteristic or skill is an important number.  When you make a Dramatic or Opposed Test you subtract the tens digit of your roll from the tens of your characteristic or skill.  That gives you a Success Level.

The attacker rolls Weapon Proficiency  to hit and the defender rolls the same to Parry or Dodge to dodge.  Whoever gets the better Success Level wins and builds up Advantage.  Advantage gives you an increasing +10% to your rolls until you get damaged, then you lose it all.  

Damage is based on your Success Level.   So if the attacker has a Hand Weapon and Strength 30, the base damage is 7.  

Say our combatants have 40 for their Weapon Skills.  The attacker rolls 60 and the defender rolls 90.  The SLs are -2 and -5, so the attacker wins, but the SL is -2 for the attack so the incoming damage is 5 wounds.

Take the same set up, but the attacker has a 60 for their weapon skill. The SLs are +0 and -5, so the attacker wins again with the full 7 wounds.  

Crappy fighters aren't going to just sit there swinging at the air for an endless series of wiffs, but their blows aren't going to be as good as skilled fighters.  Still, with Advantage in the mix, even a crappy fighter might be able to beat an opponent into a corner and land a telling blow.

Also, even if Toughness + Armor is more than the incoming damage, the target still takes one wound.


Crap!  This is brilliant.  It seems to completely address my largest complaint in 2e of wiff and ping factor.  I'm in!
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Manic Modron on August 06, 2018, 03:51:05 PM
Quote from: Madprofessor;1051826
Crap!  This is brilliant.  It seems to completely address my largest complaint in 2e of wiff and ping factor.  I'm in!

I'm really happy that I got the book.  There is going to be a finalized PDF sometime soon with a bunch of things cleaned up, but it has a lot of promise to be a great blend of 1st editiin lore, 2nd edition mechanical feel, and a few new innovations that I like the idea of very much.

Magic needs clarification and NPC/monsters might not mesh exactly with the new rules, but these are likely small problems that can be worked through.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 06, 2018, 05:19:29 PM
Quote from: Manic Modron;1051180
Combat is now an opposed roll.  If you miss it is only because the other person rolled better than you for their defense.   Figuring it out is a bit more math than before, but just simple subtraction.  I may not explain this very well since I'm on my way out to work and sort of rushing the post, but I'll give it a shot.

The tens digit for your characteristic or skill is an important number.  When you make a Dramatic or Opposed Test you subtract the tens digit of your roll from the tens of your characteristic or skill.  That gives you a Success Level.

The attacker rolls Weapon Proficiency  to hit and the defender rolls the same to Parry or Dodge to dodge.  Whoever gets the better Success Level wins and builds up Advantage.  Advantage gives you an increasing +10% to your rolls until you get damaged, then you lose it all.  

Damage is based on your Success Level.   So if the attacker has a Hand Weapon and Strength 30, the base damage is 7.  

Say our combatants have 40 for their Weapon Skills.  The attacker rolls 60 and the defender rolls 90.  The SLs are -2 and -5, so the attacker wins, but the SL is -2 for the attack so the incoming damage is 5 wounds.

Take the same set up, but the attacker has a 60 for their weapon skill. The SLs are +0 and -5, so the attacker wins again with the full 7 wounds.  

Crappy fighters aren't going to just sit there swinging at the air for an endless series of wiffs, but their blows aren't going to be as good as skilled fighters.  Still, with Advantage in the mix, even a crappy fighter might be able to beat an opponent into a corner and land a telling blow.

Also, even if Toughness + Armor is more than the incoming damage, the target still takes one wound.

Hmm I didnt understand it this way, but I might have misunderstood. I thought someone had to "hit", ie if both parties get -ve SLs, no-body hits. I don't actually like the idea of someone always hitting. That's a bit too far the other way I fear. Althooough, on reflection, shadowrun does melee this way and it works fine, really. Hmmm!

Edit: just re-read the attack section p.158 and 159, inc the example on 159. Only the attacker has a chance to hit. If the defender wins the opposed test, they get +1 Adv, but don't hit. But seems like yes you can hit on -ve SLs, if the defender rolls worse than you did. I think - edit: yes you can, p.259. That's good enough for me, there will still be some missing, but not nearly as much as in older editions (which I gather is a major complainant of the older game).
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Frey on August 06, 2018, 06:21:05 PM
Quote from: Nerzenjäger;1051782
So it is superior to 1E?

The game probably yes, but I still have to play it.

The book no way, WFRP1 had tons of background material that are absent here.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: RPGPundit on August 09, 2018, 05:55:58 AM
Today I saw one Spanish review, which said it was like 2e but had less stuff.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: The Exploited. on August 09, 2018, 07:04:27 AM
Quote from: RPGPundit;1052236
Today I saw one Spanish review, which said it was like 2e but had less stuff.

It has less lore alright but more rules and options... However, I suspect that C7 have done this deliberately to sell us more source books. Wish it was as complete as 1e was. That said, I really like 4e and I'm planning to be using all the old 1e material.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on August 09, 2018, 07:04:30 AM
Quote from: RPGPundit;1052236
Today I saw one Spanish review, which said it was like 2e but had less stuff.

Less stuff than the 2e core book, or less stuff than the entire 2e line? If they're arguing the former then I don't really agree. If they're arguing the latter then I don't really care.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: RPGPundit on August 15, 2018, 07:23:11 AM
Quote from: HappyDaze;1052250
Less stuff than the 2e core book, or less stuff than the entire 2e line? If they're arguing the former then I don't really agree. If they're arguing the latter then I don't really care.

Yeah, I don't know. That wasn't clear to me.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Spinachcat on August 16, 2018, 02:39:46 AM
Quote from: Nerzenjäger;1051782
So it is superior to 1E?


Only if your group can't make house rules to fix stuff we fixed 3 decades ago when we didn't even have high school diplomas yet.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: crkrueger on August 16, 2018, 10:41:48 AM
Quote from: Psikerlord;1051845
Hmm I didnt understand it this way, but I might have misunderstood. I thought someone had to "hit", ie if both parties get -ve SLs, no-body hits. I don't actually like the idea of someone always hitting. That's a bit too far the other way I fear. Althooough, on reflection, shadowrun does melee this way and it works fine, really. Hmmm!

Edit: just re-read the attack section p.158 and 159, inc the example on 159. Only the attacker has a chance to hit. If the defender wins the opposed test, they get +1 Adv, but don't hit. But seems like yes you can hit on -ve SLs, if the defender rolls worse than you did. I think - edit: yes you can, p.259. That's good enough for me, there will still be some missing, but not nearly as much as in older editions (which I gather is a major complainant of the older game).


In Shadowrun (at least FASA) either side can hit or do damage, no matter who is the attacker but you do need at least one success.  WFRP4 is like Hackmaster 5 in that it doesn't matter how low you roll as long as you beat the defender, you're good.  If he rolls a 2, you hit on a 3.  So in WFRP4 getting -4 Success Levels (a terrible result) still wins if the opponent gets -5 SL.

Essentially, there is no combat result where "nothing happens".  Even the most terrible rolls with everyone "missing", will still end up with someone gaining advantage even if no one is hit.

Could you have a combat where two opponents are failing to hit each other and are simply swapping Advantage back and forth?  Yes, it could happen, but it is unlikely.  Much more unlikely then a low-skill "whiff-fest" is in classic WFRP.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 17, 2018, 07:04:57 PM
Quote from: CRKrueger;1053113
In Shadowrun (at least FASA) either side can hit or do damage, no matter who is the attacker but you do need at least one success.  WFRP4 is like Hackmaster 5 in that it doesn't matter how low you roll as long as you beat the defender, you're good.  If he rolls a 2, you hit on a 3.  So in WFRP4 getting -4 Success Levels (a terrible result) still wins if the opponent gets -5 SL.

Essentially, there is no combat result where "nothing happens".  Even the most terrible rolls with everyone "missing", will still end up with someone gaining advantage even if no one is hit.

Could you have a combat where two opponents are failing to hit each other and are simply swapping Advantage back and forth?  Yes, it could happen, but it is unlikely.  Much more unlikely then a low-skill "whiff-fest" is in classic WFRP.

Bottom of p.158, if defender wins they get +1 adv, but they dont hit.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on August 25, 2018, 03:02:23 PM
The final version of the PDF--with bookmarks--is now available. This will make it much easier to navigate, and I'm looking forward to digging into now. Hopefully it will fill the hollow space of sheer disappointment that Wrath & Glory left behind.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Psikerlord on August 27, 2018, 02:24:59 AM
Quote from: HappyDaze;1054050
The final version of the PDF--with bookmarks--is now available. This will make it much easier to navigate, and I'm looking forward to digging into now. Hopefully it will fill the hollow space of sheer disappointment that Wrath & Glory left behind.

They fixed the advantage stacking with an optional rule capping it at Init Bonus or a flat number decided on by the table (eg 2 points, 4 points, whatever).
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on August 28, 2018, 05:05:23 AM
So I've heard that there is supposed to be an errata released when they send out the printed books. Anyone found/collected what might be in it?

The only one I know of is the correction to the Hunter career (sling in Trapper rank, bow in Hunter rank).

I'm still curious why the non-humans have their racial languages as something they can put points into when the language skill sections says everybody speaks Reikspiel and their native language automatically (without any skill ranks spent or recorded).
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Godfather Punk on November 16, 2018, 08:35:36 AM
I don't want to buy the Core Rules yet, but I might get the Starter Set first, to give the system a try.

Is there any news on the Starter Set box release? The website new says pdf in November, box in December. Has anyone seen this and cares to comment?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Lurtch on November 16, 2018, 09:39:31 AM
4E is great. We can tell how good it is based on how desperate the troll Daniel Fox has become and how much virtue he is signaling.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Manic Modron on November 16, 2018, 12:41:40 PM
Where is Daniel Fox doing this trolling?  I can imagine a lot of sour grapes over any thunder that 4e steals from Zweihander though.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Lurtch on November 16, 2018, 12:46:25 PM
Quote from: Manic Modron;1064874
Where is Daniel Fox doing this trolling?  I can imagine a lot of sour grapes over any thunder that 4e steals from Zweihander though.

Twitter
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Spinachcat on November 16, 2018, 06:11:50 PM
I looked at WFRP 4e...meh. Nothing jumped out as bad/wrong on my cursory flip through, but nothing made me want to buy it. If someone was running 4e, I'd give it a whirl.

On the other hand, I do regret not doing the Shadows of the Demon Lord kickstarter. That book feels like its fun to play.


Quote from: CRKrueger;1053113
Much more unlikely then a low-skill "whiff-fest" is in classic WFRP.

I can't be the only person who went "fuck it, PCs get +10 to WS". Our crew added that within our first year of play. It STFU the complainers 'cuz now your Herbalist is rocking 1/3rd of the time and anybody warrior-ish was 2/5ths right out of chargen.  

We had a GM in our crew who freaked out at house rules and he would begin PCs with a few hundred XP as your backstory. I used to play a Protagonist in his campaign and I was kickass from chargen. After he died to Skaven scum, I rolled up a Herbalist who lasted freaking years and retired as a Guilder (its bad to adventure with 0 Fate points and a critical wound).
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Arkansan on November 16, 2018, 09:30:05 PM
Quote from: Lurtch;1064848
4E is great. We can tell how good it is based on how desperate the troll Daniel Fox has become and how much virtue he is signaling.

Yeah whatever happened to him? He posted here quite a bit then just sort of disappeared, I dip in and out of here for fairly long periods, did I miss something?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Lurtch on November 16, 2018, 10:13:42 PM
Quote from: Arkansan;1064938
Yeah whatever happened to him? He posted here quite a bit then just sort of disappeared, I dip in and out of here for fairly long periods, did I miss something?

He doxxed Pundit
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: FeloniousMonk on November 16, 2018, 11:35:21 PM
Quote from: Lurtch;1064943
He doxxed Pundit
So Punsit says. I follow the guy on FB and Twitter. Despite how
fucking annoying his shilling was he is not the kind of person who does stuff like that.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Snowman0147 on November 16, 2018, 11:55:09 PM
Yes he is.  He even tried to creep in with a fake account acting like a fan of his book.  It didn't take him long to get banned again.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Snark Knight on November 17, 2018, 08:13:04 PM
Ironically the main reason I never looked into Zwel was the never ending shilling on just about every forum/platform dedicated to RPGs.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: FeloniousMonk on November 17, 2018, 08:47:38 PM
Quote from: Snark Knight;1065058
Ironically the main reason I never looked into Zwel was the never ending shilling on just about every forum/platform dedicated to RPGs.

He toned it down after people complained a lot on /warhammerfantasy. Talked about it on Reddit a while back. But it earned him 2 ennies so there is that.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Lurtch on November 17, 2018, 09:24:16 PM
Quote from: FeloniousMonk;1064951
So Punsit says. I follow the guy on FB and Twitter. Despite how
fucking annoying his shilling was he is not the kind of person who does stuff like that.

I thought we were supposed to believe victims?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: FeloniousMonk on November 17, 2018, 11:45:17 PM
Quote from: Lurtch;1065068
I thought we were supposed to believe victims?

Pundit makes himself out to be a victim whenever someone uses his real name which he has used on his old Livejournal then has the audacity to call it his dead name like he is trans. Its sorta gross as weird and I just do not believe the lies because Pundi has a brand of making himself out to be a victim. IMO
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: RPGPundit on November 21, 2018, 06:52:21 AM
In addition to doxxing me, Fox has repeatedly harassed me, in person and through sockpuppets. Most recently, he tried (and failed) to have Youtube take down several of my videos with his utterly spurious claim to a trademark for #DnDGate, a hashtag I invented. Luckily, Youtube didn't fall for it.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: FeloniousMonk on November 21, 2018, 10:05:23 AM
Quote from: RPGPundit;1065601
In addition to doxxing me, Fox has repeatedly harassed me, in person and through sockpuppets. Most recently, he tried (and failed) to have Youtube take down several of my videos with his utterly spurious claim to a trademark for #DnDGate, a hashtag I invented. Luckily, Youtube didn't fall for it.

How is that possible if you live in Uruguay to harass you in person?

He is a pitilesss shill no doubt but a harasser? I do not see it. Can you show us proof?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Snowman0147 on November 21, 2018, 10:06:33 AM
Quote from: RPGPundit;1065601
In addition to doxxing me, Fox has repeatedly harassed me, in person and through sockpuppets. Most recently, he tried (and failed) to have Youtube take down several of my videos with his utterly spurious claim to a trademark for #DnDGate, a hashtag I invented. Luckily, Youtube didn't fall for it.

How did you know it was him?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: FeloniousMonk on November 21, 2018, 11:02:40 AM
Quote from: snowman0147;1065624
how did you know it was him?

(deleted by moderator)
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Snowman0147 on November 21, 2018, 12:07:06 PM
Quote from: FeloniousMonk;1065632
DELETED BY MODERATOR

Funny I didn't ask you that question.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: FeloniousMonk on November 21, 2018, 12:22:15 PM
Quote from: Snowman0147;1065642
Funny I didn't ask you that question.

Look bro - this is just the facts. I like Pundits work but Pundit the online personality attract a lot of attention (and he likes it that way b/c it sells books). Because he is a loudmouth and paranoid about his real name. Which is weird b/c literally everyone knows what it is but pretends they do not. I do not use his real name out of respect for him but what does he really expect when he crows on about swine and SJws? Can we just play games in peace?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Snowman0147 on November 21, 2018, 01:24:21 PM
Quote from: FeloniousMonk;1065648
Look bro - this is just the facts. I like Pundits work but Pundit the online personality attract a lot of attention (and he likes it that way b/c it sells books). Because he is a loudmouth and paranoid about his real name. Which is weird b/c literally everyone knows what it is but pretends they do not. I do not use his real name out of respect for him but what does he really expect when he crows on about swine and SJws? Can we just play games in peace?

I was asking for evidence about the attempts of Daniel trying to remove Pundit's videos though.

As for your first question Pundit should see that coming.

As for your last question.  Welcome to the culture war because your in it even if you want out of it.  Not just in RPGs, but in ever single aspect of your life.  Don't hate the truth, but hate the fuckers that created this entire miss.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Manic Modron on November 21, 2018, 01:31:50 PM
For news that is actually on topic, there has been a free adventure released. (https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/259270/WFRP-Ubersreik-Adventures--If-Looks-Could-Kill?affiliate_id=169435&fbclid=IwAR1vve9jc6-fkSlbnym2yUcbCggKqbQxX7grwEwjrKwMJoCG_cVGkjNdJXE)

I haven't had a chance to get a look at it, but it looks like they are going to trickle out a few of these at least.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Llew ap Hywel on November 21, 2018, 02:09:41 PM
Quote from: Manic Modron;1065663
For news that is actually on topic, there has been a free adventure released. (https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/259270/WFRP-Ubersreik-Adventures--If-Looks-Could-Kill?affiliate_id=169435&fbclid=IwAR1vve9jc6-fkSlbnym2yUcbCggKqbQxX7grwEwjrKwMJoCG_cVGkjNdJXE)

I haven't had a chance to get a look at it, but it looks like they are going to trickle out a few of these at least.

Free? My favourite flavour :D
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: crkrueger on November 21, 2018, 02:18:45 PM
Quote from: FeloniousMonk;1065648
Can we just play games in peace?

The ironic part is, the whole raison d'etre for this site is that we couldn't just play games in peace because the Story crowd was attempting to hijack the RPG hobby, redefine all terminology to fit their extremely narrow view of RPGs as a form of literary collaborative story creation, and was attempting to quash all dissent through the academic pseudo-intellectual elitist playbook.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: crkrueger on November 21, 2018, 02:22:46 PM
Quote from: Snowman0147;1065624
How did you know it was him?

Ask Dan White, aka OneHorseTown, he has a decent amount of evidence of some of Fox's shenanigans via emails, posts, IP info, etc.  That's mostly about the sockpuppeting though.

OHT probably doesn't give a shit at this point, however, seeing as Pundit has a knack for pulling "With me or against me." and pissing all over his mods who had his back when he was right, but still criticized him when he was being a douche.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on November 21, 2018, 02:28:36 PM
Quote from: Manic Modron;1065663
For news that is actually on topic, there has been a free adventure released. (https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/259270/WFRP-Ubersreik-Adventures--If-Looks-Could-Kill?affiliate_id=169435&fbclid=IwAR1vve9jc6-fkSlbnym2yUcbCggKqbQxX7grwEwjrKwMJoCG_cVGkjNdJXE)

I haven't had a chance to get a look at it, but it looks like they are going to trickle out a few of these at least.
Thank you for this! Something to read while ignoring the family for the holiday!
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: FeloniousMonk on November 21, 2018, 02:37:12 PM
Well the burden of proof is on the accuser. Zweilander gets a lot of flack due to marketing mode but I need to see proof. 4chan regularly doxed him somsid he do it in retaliation?
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: HappyDaze on November 21, 2018, 03:59:55 PM
Quote from: FeloniousMonk;1065672
Well the burden of proof is on the accuser. Zweilander gets a lot of flack due to marketing mode but I need to see proof. 4chan regularly doxed him somsid he do it in retaliation?

Can you take this to Pundit's forum? I'd like to have a WFRP4e thread that doesn't swim in this mud.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Manic Modron on November 22, 2018, 12:09:30 AM
Quote from: HappyDaze;1065671
Thank you for this! Something to read while ignoring the family for the holiday!

Glad to spread the news!

Cubicle 7 has said on their web page that there will be a series of Ubersreik Adventures available and if I'm interpreting the hints correctly, they are likely to be releasing a version of Rough Night at the Three Feathers next week.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: TheHistorian on November 25, 2018, 12:04:21 AM
I was going to take a look at WFRP4. But then I looked at the shelves with my complete WFRP1 and WFRP2 collections, which really don't get used, and thought, why bother? WFRP3 wasn't my cup of tea, and Zwei... well I bought some stuff early, but recently have realized I don't need that either. Maybe if I saw a supplement that touched on some important element that hadn't been explored before, I'd pick that up, but I can't imagine what that would be.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Warboss Squee on November 25, 2018, 12:21:31 AM
Quote from: Snowman0147;1065624
How did you know it was him?


When Youtube strikes a video for copyright, they tell you ob who's behalf it's done for, in case you want to contest it.

I've had both a movie review and 3 of my videos on politics hit with false claims and was able to beat them.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: RPGPundit on November 28, 2018, 03:27:25 AM
Quote from: FeloniousMonk;1065622
How is that possible if you live in Uruguay to harass you in person?


I mean as himself, or with sockpuppets.

Quote
He is a pitilesss shill no doubt but a harasser? I do not see it. Can you show us proof?


No, I'd rather not share private information or ideas about how to harass me here. Especially not when I get the sense that you're doing this intentionally.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: RPGPundit on November 28, 2018, 03:29:41 AM
Quote from: FeloniousMonk;1065632
(DELETED BY MODERATOR)


OK, this is the one and only warning. You're pushing the line and in very bad faith. Keep going this route, and I'll ban you.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: RPGPundit on November 28, 2018, 03:30:44 AM
Quote from: Snowman0147;1065661
I was asking for evidence about the attempts of Daniel trying to remove Pundit's videos though.


Evidence of that (screenshots) was posted by @geekybugle on Twitter, who was another target of his Trademark-complaint trolling.
Title: Is anyone looking at WFRP4e yet?
Post by: Snowman0147 on November 28, 2018, 12:05:26 PM
Quote from: RPGPundit;1066363
Evidence of that (screenshots) was posted by @geekybugle on Twitter, who was another target of his Trademark-complaint trolling.

Thank you.  I am going to search, but it would be convenient if there was a link to that exact twitter post.