Quote from: RPGPundit;994814It's funny how all the people that desperately argue it's not FATE are fans of the most pretentious FATE games. All the shitty ones.

Well, I'm not, so I've no idea where you are coming from on that one.

Quote from: RPGPundit;994192Sure. But ICONS came out in the middle of the FATE boom when other FATE games also used the d6-d6 mechanic.

FFS, Icons has the same core mechanic as fate, it has Fate points, it has a number of other mechanical elements that are also found in FATE games. It's a fucking FATE game, people. I get that some people hate it because it did a better job of being a FATE game than the pretentious games beloved by the Swine. But trying to cover your ears and say it's just not true, that's bullshit.

That's funny.  My first impression was that "It's a fucking Marvel FASERIP game, people" with the serial numbers filed off and Fate mechanics.

According to the creator, Steve Kenson, Icons is basically a combination of ideas from 'old school' games (like FACERIP) and Fate. It still remains it's own system, and doesn't self-identify as being a Fate game. You couldn't take the ICONS rulebook and use it to run a Fate supplement, for example. It's not a Fate game, as such.

Quote from: RPGPundit;994814It's funny how all the people that desperately argue it's not FATE are fans of the most pretentious FATE games. All the shitty ones.

What are you going on about?  I hate the FATE system.

Quote from: TrippyHippy;995007According to the creator, Steve Kenson, Icons is basically a combination of ideas from 'old school' games (like FACERIP) and Fate. It still remains it's own system, and doesn't self-identify as being a Fate game. You couldn't take the ICONS rulebook and use it to run a Fate supplement, for example. It's not a Fate game, as such.

I picked up a single FATE book, Atomic Robo because I like the setting, couldn't care less about using the system.  Same thing with a couple of the PDF's, like the settings not the system.  So that qualifier out of the way, I can guarantee this.  ICONS is definitely different than Atomic Robo, no interchangeable in the least, unlike say Master of Umdaar, Venture City or Atomic Robo, which I could probably mix and match them.

Quote from: Gunslinger;995003That's funny.  My first impression was that "It's a fucking Marvel FASERIP game, people" with the serial numbers filed off and Fate mechanics.

They are nothing alike!

Quote from: Biscuitician;995406They are nothing alike!

I disagree!

(And I'm actually serious, I can see the influence more than FATE.   )

Other than that they're both about superheroes, it's patently absurd or a moronic denial of reality to suggest that ICONS is closer to marvel than to FATE.

Do you accept it isn't a Fate game, then?

Quote from: RPGPundit;995892Other than that they're both about superheroes, it's patently absurd or a moronic denial of reality to suggest that ICONS is closer to marvel than to FATE.

So what you're saying is that Steve Kenson is a moron and denying reality?  Because it uses adjectives like Good, Great, just Marvel FASERIP's Feeble, Poor, Typical, Good, Excellent to mark it's stats and powers.  Yes, FATE/FUDGE uses it too, but FASERIP did it first.  In fact, ICONS is closer to FASERIP because it adds NUMBERS to the adjectives.  FATE doesn't do this.

Sorry, mate, you're blinded by your own bias here.  I've got both items in front of me, and FASERIP is more accurate than FATE.  At least in the Assembled Edition.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;995905So what you're saying is that Steve Kenson is a moron and denying reality?  Because it uses adjectives like Good, Great, just Marvel FASERIP's Feeble, Poor, Typical, Good, Excellent to mark it's stats and powers.  Yes, FATE/FUDGE uses it too, but FASERIP did it first.  In fact, ICONS is closer to FASERIP because it adds NUMBERS to the adjectives.  FATE doesn't do this.

Sorry, mate, you're blinded by your own bias here.  I've got both items in front of me, and FASERIP is more accurate than FATE.  At least in the Assembled Edition.

Could the adjectives used in ICONS be considered an homage to FASERIP, rather than a port of the same mechanics?

The descriptors used in ICONS come from both FASERIP and Fate, as far as I know. Fate does use numbers, by the way. I know there are some people who prefer playing Fudge/Fate with descriptors only, but every published Fate game I have uses both numbers and adjectives for its skills or attributes.

Apart from the fact that ICONS is a game all about super powers, which developed from MSH, Steve Kenson also swiped the attributes from that game and folded Endurance into Strength to form ICONS' abilities:

Fighting = Prowess
Agility = Coordination
Strength & Endurance = Strength
Reason = Intellect
Intuition = Awareness
Psyche = Willpower

A lot of stuff went into the melting pot to make ICONS, but FASERIP and Fate were probably the two biggest influences. And in case anyone still doubts that MSH wasn't a huge influence, take it from the man who made the game:

https://stevekenson.com/2011/01/09/icons-marvelous-numbers/
https://stevekenson.com/2005/07/01/superlative-system/

Quote from: cranebump;995928Could the adjectives used in ICONS be considered an homage to FASERIP, rather than a port of the same mechanics?

Homage?  Yes, but they do line up pretty well if you want to take the extra step.  It's clearly more inspired by FASERIP in that regard.  Again, I want to stress I'm talking about the Assembled Edition, I have no knowledge of the previous one.

To be fair, I'm intimately more familiar with Marvel FASERIP than Fate.  I've perused Fate.  The FASERIP influences are readily apparent minus the table and Karma.

Quote from: Brand55;995983The descriptors used in ICONS come from both FASERIP and Fate, as far as I know. Fate does use numbers, by the way. I know there are some people who prefer playing Fudge/Fate with descriptors only, but every published Fate game I have uses both numbers and adjectives for its skills or attributes.

Apart from the fact that ICONS is a game all about super powers, which developed from MSH, Steve Kenson also swiped the attributes from that game and folded Endurance into Strength to form ICONS' abilities:

Fighting = Prowess
Agility = Coordination
Strength & Endurance = Strength
Reason = Intellect
Intuition = Awareness
Psyche = Willpower

A lot of stuff went into the melting pot to make ICONS, but FASERIP and Fate were probably the two biggest influences. And in case anyone still doubts that MSH wasn't a huge influence, take it from the man who made the game:

https://stevekenson.com/2011/01/09/icons-marvelous-numbers/
https://stevekenson.com/2005/07/01/superlative-system/

Convinces me.:-)

Quote from: cranebump;995928Could the adjectives used in ICONS be considered an homage to FASERIP, rather than a port of the same mechanics?

Yes, exactly. The fundamental mechanical system for task resolution is FATE. It bears no resemblance at all to Marvel Supers.