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Author Topic: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse  (Read 2549 times)

RPGPundit

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I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« on: October 08, 2021, 04:40:52 PM »
As usual, I was exactly RIGHT about the new woke D&D Evolution Edition that WoTC is planning. But in fact, I was off only in that in some ways it's even WORSE than what I'd predicted.


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DM_Curt

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2021, 05:28:11 PM »
Well...guess my gaming dollar will go fishing around for old 1e/2e stuff. Maybe some 5e-compatible (everything is convertible if you strip enough guts out) products from OSR dudes.

Already got some Venger and Pundit stuff,  expect to buy more.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2021, 05:45:26 PM by DM_Curt »

RPGPundit

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2021, 06:11:14 AM »
I appreciate your purchases!
LION & DRAGON: Medieval-Authentic OSR Roleplaying is available now! You only THINK you've played 'medieval fantasy' until you play L&D.


My Blog:  http://therpgpundit.blogspot.com/
The most famous uruguayan gaming blog on the planet!

NEW!
Check out my short OSR supplements series; The RPGPundit Presents!


Dark Albion: The Rose War! The OSR fantasy setting of the history that inspired Shakespeare and Martin alike.
Also available in Variant Cover form!
Also, now with the CULTS OF CHAOS cult-generation sourcebook

ARROWS OF INDRA
Arrows of Indra: The Old-School Epic Indian RPG!
NOW AVAILABLE: AoI in print form

LORDS OF OLYMPUS
The new Diceless RPG of multiversal power, adventure and intrigue, now available.

Chris24601

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2021, 08:56:43 AM »
The only thing I disagree with in your video is that, because Orcus and Demogorgon are unique individuals, they probably will have a fixed alignments.

Other than that, I think you’re spot on in the direction WotC intends to take “evolved” 5e.

I wonder though… if we could convince them to just make all the demons and devils look like straight white men with Christian motifs would they then label them as “Always Lawful/Chaotic Evil?”

hedgehobbit

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2021, 09:47:02 AM »
If all they are doing is wokifying 5e, why will it take them 2 and 1/2 years to do so?

HappyDaze

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2021, 09:57:40 AM »
If all they are doing is wokifying 5e, why will it take them 2 and 1/2 years to do so?
You can't rush sensitivity readers.

DM_Curt

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2021, 10:46:18 AM »
If all they are doing is wokifying 5e, why will it take them 2 and 1/2 years to do so?
You can't rush sensitivity readers.
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Thorn Drumheller

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2021, 11:01:15 AM »
You can't rush sensitivity readers.

Oh gawds that was my laugh for today. Thanks HappyDaze.

It's so bizarre being in this hobby since the late 70's and seeing how things have changed. I mean change is good IMO otherwise things stagnate. But to see the various "groups" be "in power" over the years is fascinating. I know WotC doesn't care about my demographic, but isn't there something something about standing on the shoulders of those who came before? It's so weird.

I'm glad there are so many good rpgs out there that my hobby dollar can go to. And I like it.
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Chris24601

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2021, 11:09:35 AM »
If all they are doing is wokifying 5e, why will it take them 2 and 1/2 years to do so?
While there are many humorous reasons for the timing; the real reason is so that the new “edition” will coincide with D&D’s 50th Anniversary (I fully expect it to be marketed as D&D50 or 50e rather than 5.5e… going from 5e to 50 is just too easy a marketing gimmick).

DM_Curt

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2021, 12:23:49 PM »
If all they are doing is wokifying 5e, why will it take them 2 and 1/2 years to do so?
While there are many humorous reasons for the timing; the real reason is so that the new “edition” will coincide with D&D’s 50th Anniversary (I fully expect it to be marketed as D&D50 or 50e rather than 5.5e… going from 5e to 50 is just too easy a marketing gimmick).
Absolutely 💯.
They're gonna throw a big 50th Anniversary logo of some kind on it all and make it as big of a deal as possible, just to sell Special Edition versions of everything. I expect that even low-tier books (like SCAG or Theros) they don't bother updating will get a 50th Anniversary or "5e Gold" alt cover re-release for $10 more.

Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2021, 12:50:17 PM »
HASBRO as a corporation that makes 100x the revenue that every other game publisher combined on their D&D brand (Almost all of it comes from Licensing the Dragon & icon and branding for MERCHANDISE such as clothing, kitch, and even bullshit like D&D Nerds candy and mints) while producing as little actual real CONTENT as most 3PP and in many cases less than that on a yearly basis.

They have absolutely no incentive to hire more writers or make more content than the glacial pace they've set thus far because they make a mere pittance actually making new content for the game over simply taking a cut of the DMs Guild content creators who do all of the interesting work for them, and just selling the License for the brand to other companies looking to cash in on what D&D has come to represent to the larger market.

The new edition is a chance for them to repackage everything they already made with a year to tweak out and change in order to make the game "more inclusive" and less objectionable to the most hyper sensitive crowds/mobs. They'll end up spending less than 1/4 of what it cost to develop 5e to bring in a new revised edition and basically reprint everything they already made after the editorial push. In other words, HASBRO most likely has taken to the idea that they can sell what is effectively the same game with a "new spirit" to all the same customers they already have sold it to. The new edition should be expected to get wall to wall coverage on every social and traditional media platform known to man, a cost that I guarantee will hit their pocketbook far harder than the actual development and editing/layout costs of making the books ever will.

Mark my words, they also have the opportunity with their digital sales method to ACTUALLY force all subscribers of D&D beyond to stop playing 5e because as I understand it they have no plans WHATSOEVER of continuing the normal 5e (NOT PDF) book access methods through their service once 5.5 drops, this will be marketed as a "free upgrade" to the new edition that is mandatory within 6 months of the CRB/PHB release that cannot be opted out of since they view selling their older games as conflicting with the strategy of marketing a new one.

HASBRO will do everything possible to milk their IP for all it is worth while investing the bare minimum into actually creating content in-house, expect to see more rebranded board games spun with recycled D&D art assets, a newly revised logo that is slightly different that they can sell the License to Nestle, fruit of the loom and CBS for a higher cost, as well as an eventual requirement for GM guiild products to either switch to the new edition or have the products produced as "compatible" with both costing them a double dip on the cut HASBRO takes.

The soul of the game and identity of D&D has been dying ever since it was taken out of the control of people actually involved in the hobby and sold to megacorp.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2021, 12:53:36 PM by DefNotAnInsiderNopeNoWay »

HappyDaze

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2021, 01:02:20 PM »
You can't rush sensitivity readers.

Oh gawds that was my laugh for today. Thanks HappyDaze.

It's so bizarre being in this hobby since the late 70's and seeing how things have changed. I mean change is good IMO otherwise things stagnate. But to see the various "groups" be "in power" over the years is fascinating. I know WotC doesn't care about my demographic, but isn't there something something about standing on the shoulders of those who came before? It's so weird.

I'm glad there are so many good rpgs out there that my hobby dollar can go to. And I like it.
Why stand on their shoulders when you can dance on their graves?

hedgehobbit

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2021, 04:12:13 PM »
While there are many humorous reasons for the timing; the real reason is so that the new “edition” will coincide with D&D’s 50th Anniversary (I fully expect it to be marketed as D&D50 or 50e rather than 5.5e… going from 5e to 50 is just too easy a marketing gimmick).

I understand the 50th anniversary, but I don't see why they started talking about it already. It is impossible to predict which parts of D&D will be racist next month, let alone two years from now. By then, there will probably be a couple more types of istaphobes that haven't even been thought of yet.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2021, 04:15:03 PM by hedgehobbit »

Jaeger

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2021, 05:58:52 PM »
If all they are doing is wokifying 5e, why will it take them 2 and 1/2 years to do so?

You have to read between the lines in their announcement which a lot of people miss:


They've begun work on new versions of the core rulebooks. Recent surveys tie into that.

The recent surveys asked a LOT of questions about Classes, Class abilities, and Subclasses.

And they are going to do more surveys:


...but expect more surveys. More will be said next year.

If the surveys next year continue to ask a lot of questions about Classes, Class abilities, and Subclasses. Then we have less and less reasons to not expect a full 5.5 style revision.

I expect that the game will look visually the same, but that there will be a lot of "small" mechanical changes in the class structures...

They will totally get away with this because unlike 3.0's 3 year run, 5e will have been the longest running WotC edition when 2024 rolls around.

They will absolutely refuse to call it a new edition, revision, or 5.x anything. Ever.

They 50th celebration of D&D will give them a lot of cover in the form of general good will, and positive press for the D&D brand.

The special 50AE D&D not-edition could not have the ground better laid with sugary sweetness to help the people pretend that it isn't totally a 5.5 revised edition with a smile.



...
They have absolutely no incentive to hire more writers or make more content than the glacial pace they've set thus far ...

IMHO, their release schedule is one of the few things that they actually did right.

There is just no need for tons of splat books. But IMHO they did fall short in providing real options for GM who might want to go into domain play etc,.  But that is probably a result of the decisions made with their core books.

Aside from that, while I imagine their MtG setting books sold rather well, IMHO no one really plays those setting very much - they benefit a ton  with collector tie in and the MtG crowd has never mixed with the D&D crowd to the extent that WotC would like. And they never will.

So for me it was not so much about their release pace - it was the types of books that they chose to release...



...
The soul of the game and identity of D&D has been dying ever since it was taken out of the control of people actually involved in the hobby and sold to megacorp.

This has been true since Gygax lost control. For all his business failings, he at least had a personal stake in what the game meant to people. This effect was mitigated a great deal in the Williams era of TSR because a lot of employees who worked under Gygax still had input into the game.

Things just got accelerated with WotCs 3.0, and they are ticking along even faster now that anyone with a real love for TSR D&D is now off of the WotC dev team.
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Spinachcat

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Re: I Told You So About "D&D Evolution" - But it's Even Worse
« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2021, 03:37:21 AM »
50e as woke shit that sells phenomenally is a no brainer.

No question that the DM's Guild will be required to adhere to the new edition.