Quote from: Domina on September 06, 2023, 01:38:32 AM
I need advice on making it more racist

Anything made before this morning is racist, homophobic, bigoted, etc. So of course everything Gary ever wrote is totally racist.

There is no such thing as Christophobia. It does not exist. Just like it is impossible for anyone not-white to be racist. There is no such thing as racism against white people.

That covers most of it. Did I miss anything?

I do not, on a fundamental level, understand the need to "sanitize" RPGs.

If you look at Romantic Fantasy, which is, like... the most wokest of the fantasy literature genres? It's still not like this. Yes, the heroes are presented as being good, shining people, and maybe they even come from a very woke, progressive nation within the world, where all the heroes ride talking white horses and everything is great on the surface...

But the worlds themselves are never shining and clean. Actually they usually have some really bad, nasty shit going on. Because without the bad things, there's not really anything to talk about. It's like taking a sandbox video game and removing all the enemies and just having people walk around an empty game world. What's the point, at that point?

You can absolutely run a progressive game where every person in the game is a trans person of color and disabled, but you have to have something for them to DO. It's like that scam fake native american sci fi game that came out a year or two ago. Great, but what do you do with it? It's a good (using the term loosely) example of world building, but there's no game to be had.

Orcs are Evil...

In the Movie version of "LOTR" they were shown being created as an evil army.
One back story has it that JRR himself said they corrupt or fallen 'elves'.

By-the-way, when the movie "Star Wars: The Return of The Jedi" was in theaer I saw the Gamorrean guards and thought "Ah, that is what Orcs must look like!"

- Ed C.

Quote from: Bruwulf on September 10, 2023, 09:23:20 AM
I do not, on a fundamental level, understand the need to "sanitize" RPGs.

If you look at Romantic Fantasy, which is, like... the most wokest of the fantasy literature genres? It's still not like this. Yes, the heroes are presented as being good, shining people, and maybe they even come from a very woke, progressive nation within the world, where all the heroes ride talking white horses and everything is great on the surface...

But the worlds themselves are never shining and clean. Actually they usually have some really bad, nasty shit going on. Because without the bad things, there's not really anything to talk about. It's like taking a sandbox video game and removing all the enemies and just having people walk around an empty game world. What's the point, at that point?

You can absolutely run a progressive game where every person in the game is a trans person of color and disabled, but you have to have something for them to DO. It's like that scam fake native american sci fi game that came out a year or two ago. Great, but what do you do with it? It's a good (using the term loosely) example of world building, but there's no game to be had.

And the one big attempt to create a romantic fantasy RPG, Blue Rose, created a boring game (at least in the True20 iteration...I've been told the FATE version isn't) because it missed something key in its source material: the ability to fail, to be a bad person.

I was very disappointed in BR.

I think this is also a parallel to the consent thread about mind flyers. Both come from the same mindset where your favorite TV show being cancelled is an existential crisis. I honestly think these people were so sheltered they never learned failure can happen and be survived, leading to growth.

Quote from: PulpHerb on September 10, 2023, 02:43:51 PMAnd the one big attempt to create a romantic fantasy RPG, Blue Rose, created a boring game (at least in the True20 iteration...I've been told the FATE version isn't) because it missed something key in its source material: the ability to fail, to be a bad person.

I was very disappointed in BR.

The second version was AGE, not FATE, and it was /worse/ than the T20 version. The T20 version still allowed some nuance and subtlety. The AGE version did away with it and shoved the progressiveness down your throat even more.

I bought it for the artwork. I'm a huge fan of Stephaine Pai-Mun Law's art. But the game was terrible. And I say this as someone who is actually a consumer of romantic fantasy novels, and theoretically in the target market for Blue Rose.

Quote from: Bruwulf on September 10, 2023, 02:51:33 PM
The second version was AGE, not FATE, and it was /worse/ than the T20 version. The T20 version still allowed some nuance and subtlety. The AGE version did away with it and shoved the progressiveness down your throat even more.

I bought it for the artwork. I'm a huge fan of Stephaine Pai-Mun Law's art. But the game was terrible. And I say this as someone who is actually a consumer of romantic fantasy novels, and theoretically in the target market for Blue Rose.

  I've always wondering ... how heavy-handed did they get with Jarzon in Blue Rose 2E? (I glanced at 1E out of interest in the system, the art, and a certain level of sympathy for optimistic fantasy, but various elements, including Jarzon, turned me off.)

Quote from: Bruwulf on September 10, 2023, 02:51:33 PM

Quote from: PulpHerb on September 10, 2023, 02:43:51 PMAnd the one big attempt to create a romantic fantasy RPG, Blue Rose, created a boring game (at least in the True20 iteration...I've been told the FATE version isn't) because it missed something key in its source material: the ability to fail, to be a bad person.

I was very disappointed in BR.

The second version was AGE, not FATE, and it was /worse/ than the T20 version. The T20 version still allowed some nuance and subtlety. The AGE version did away with it and shoved the progressiveness down your throat even more.

I bought it for the artwork. I'm a huge fan of Stephaine Pai-Mun Law's art. But the game was terrible. And I say this as someone who is actually a consumer of romantic fantasy novels, and theoretically in the target market for Blue Rose.

Ah, got confused (maybe it was Freeport they did a FATE version of).

I bought BR for the rules which we later got as T20 a game I love but just didn't get any traction.

I can't imagine more heavy handed, but given it is Green Ronin, no surprise.  Glad I didn't bite on it.

The sad thing is there is a cool setting to be made from that source material. I doubt one I'd run, but that would appeal to a lot of the modern 5e crowd who do understand without risk there can be no triumph.