They both seem to strive for a "realistic" setting.
Could you basically play one in the other?
Why pick one over the other?
Before going all in with purchases, which has the best "down to earth" feel and ease of play?
Dark Albion's War of the Roses period has the bulk of France conquered by literal frogpeople so that kinda hosed any down-to-earth feel I might have. Can't speak to Harn but its system is very much its own thing so would have more of a learning curve next to a DnD supplement.
HarnWorld (the setting) can be used with any system as it has no mechanics in it, but HarnMaster (the system) fits the setting best.
For rulesets, I found the "5e Harn" conversion document (PWYW at https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/292441/5e-Harn) plausible on skimming.
Both are amazing settings, but Hârn is a very expensive rabbit-hole to go down.
Whereas Dark Albion is mostly one big book, and the author recommends you make up anything you need, Hârn has every square inch detailed in some suppliment or another. Mind you, you don't *have to* get the country, city, and town suppliment. But they are sooo damn well done. You can stop at any time... really.... there's no commitment...
So to beak it down, the differences are:
Dark Albion:
-15th Century Britain.
-Lots of history, and mythology mixed in.
-medieval style magic system, with alchemy, demonology, and other cool historical "bell, book, and candle" type stuff.
-A Church that is a lot like the Roman Catholic church, with one god, easy to relate to.
-Has firearms.
-excellent charts and resources for B/X style of play in a historical setting.
-You only need one book to run it (plus a d&d-like rule system).
Hârn:
-Is an island roughly the area of all the British Isles combined.
-roughly 12th century tech level.
-Set in the world of Kethira, annother planet.
-Has a pantheon of ten gods with LOTS of info on their respective religions.
-Has seven kingdoms, including one Dwarf, and one Elf kingdom.
-was heavily influenced by Middle Earth
-has Orcs, but otherwise monsters aren't too common.
-has magic based on six "elements": Fire, water, light, metal, life, and mind.
-Has a resident god that makes monsters.
-has a near infinite supply of fan-based matereal.
Yes Harn can be expensive but now it a good time to get the core setting products for $1.
Kingdom of Kaldor Hardback Kickstarter
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/columbiagames/kingdoms-of-harn-kaldor/description
Just select the $1 level and you will be able to get the Harnworld, Harndex, Cities and Towns, and the Harn Map
(https://ksr-ugc.imgix.net/assets/032/925/601/a0ec804de927411d76d48c8c60668d9e_original.png?ixlib=rb-2.1.0&w=680&fit=max&v=1617070483&auto=format&frame=1&lossless=true&s=59b1f3c53f15be65aa7a3f9c33249754)
Quote from: Svenhelgrim on April 14, 2021, 08:26:16 PM
-but otherwise monsters aren't too common.
Yes and no, what Harn does have is a lot more wilderness than 12th century Great Britain along with nearly two dozen locales to have "dungeon" style adventures in. There is now an extensive bestiary including bunch of creatures labeled as Ivashu which are unique monsters created by a god named Ilvir. So if one goes looking for adventures, dungeons, and monsters it there.
How much of each can you "logic out" from modern cultural references and how much do you have to study each to begin play?
I understand that a lot of modern assumptions are wrong but still close enough for an "England" setting. What about Harn?
Quote from: Greentongue on April 15, 2021, 01:26:05 PM
How much of each can you "logic out" from modern cultural references and how much do you have to study each to begin play?
I understand that a lot of modern assumptions are wrong but still close enough for an "England" setting. What about Harn?
Check out the one of the below and let me know.
First off Harn is known for it near-professional fan made material.
https://www.lythia.com/series/pottage/
I suggest #4 is the best as it has a complete town as well as other locales.
For harn itself then get this PDF for free.
http://columbiagames.com/cgi-bin/query/harn/cfg/single.cfg?product_id=5001A-PDF
What they did is laid out the back of the poster map with an overviw.
As for the setting itself. The best overview is found by backing the kickstarter for a $1. You will get Harnworld, Harndex.
In general if you read and understood Game of Thrones you will be good with anything with Harn. As far is it being authentic it is the best out there in regards to feudal society. Mainly because its original author N. Robin Crossby and the Columba Games staff excel at keeping things approachable, and consistent.
If you want approachable historical medieval material than the support books for Ars Magica are the ticket.
If you want to see how medieval ideas and concept translate into a fantasy setting that is NOT thinly skinned Europe then Harn is it.
I threw money at it (Harn). We'll see where that goes.
Quote from: Greentongue on April 15, 2021, 05:40:54 PM
I threw money at it (Harn). We'll see where that goes.
Since you are a backer check out Update #1. It has the download link.
Quote from: Svenhelgrim on April 14, 2021, 08:26:16 PM
Both are amazing settings, but Hârn is a very expensive rabbit-hole to go down.
Whereas Dark Albion is mostly one big book, and the author recommends you make up anything you need, Hârn has every square inch detailed in some suppliment or another. Mind you, you don't *have to* get the country, city, and town suppliment. But they are sooo damn well done. You can stop at any time... really.... there's no commitment...
So to beak it down, the differences are:
Dark Albion:
-15th Century Britain.
-Lots of history, and mythology mixed in.
-medieval style magic system, with alchemy, demonology, and other cool historical "bell, book, and candle" type stuff.
-A Church that is a lot like the Roman Catholic church, with one god, easy to relate to.
-Has firearms.
-excellent charts and resources for B/X style of play in a historical setting.
-You only need one book to run it (plus a d&d-like rule system).
Hârn:
-Is an island roughly the area of all the British Isles combined.
-roughly 12th century tech level.
-Set in the world of Kethira, annother planet.
-Has a pantheon of ten gods with LOTS of info on their respective religions.
-Has seven kingdoms, including one Dwarf, and one Elf kingdom.
-was heavily influenced by Middle Earth
-has Orcs, but otherwise monsters aren't too common.
-has magic based on six "elements": Fire, water, light, metal, life, and mind.
-Has a resident god that makes monsters.
-has a near infinite supply of fan-based matereal.
This is a pretty good objective comparative analysis.
Quote from: Greentongue on April 15, 2021, 01:26:05 PM
How much of each can you "logic out" from modern cultural references and how much do you have to study each to begin play?
I understand that a lot of modern assumptions are wrong but still close enough for an "England" setting. What about Harn?
Although with Albion you could do some deep-dive studies into the minutiae of the War of the Roses, you really don't need to beyond what is in the book.
With Harn, you could just make things up, or you could do a deep-dive study of the enormous amount of detail spread out over all the supplements and fan material.
Quote from: estar on April 15, 2021, 05:56:06 PM
Since you are a backer check out Update #1. It has the download link.
While it currently says,"$32,593 pledged of $5,000 goal" and "All or nothing. This project will only be funded if it reaches its goal by Thu, April 22 2021 10:00 PM EDT"
I don't thank the download link is enabled until the pledge is actually collected.
Quote from: Greentongue on April 16, 2021, 11:43:37 AM
Quote from: estar on April 15, 2021, 05:56:06 PM
Since you are a backer check out Update #1. It has the download link.
While it currently says,"$32,593 pledged of $5,000 goal" and "All or nothing. This project will only be funded if it reaches its goal by Thu, April 22 2021 10:00 PM EDT"
I don't thank the download link is enabled until the pledge is actually collected.
They hosed the original link. The corrected link is in the comments. I tried it and it works. It is a 231 page PDF.
Yes, in the Comments. It's Huge.
Quote from: Greentongue on April 12, 2021, 09:49:26 AM
They both seem to strive for a "realistic" setting.
Could you basically play one in the other?
Why pick one over the other?
Before going all in with purchases, which has the best "down to earth" feel and ease of play?
Of the two, only Albion is in actual earth. Everyone has some idea what medieval Paris or Rome would be like, what a catholic cathedral would be like, what Wales is like.
Your players won't already know what Rethem and Kanday are like.
I have actually run a game using Dark Albion as the world (C&S variant because I'm a sadomasochist), and although I've read through at least 80% of Harn I doubt I could run it reasonably well. There is almost TOO much information that really doesn't seem to have a real-world analogue; contrast this with Hyperborea as detailed in Conan. As Pundit states, the players should be able to figure out what's what in DA, Harn not so much. Another point: Tekumel. While alien in a lot of ways, Tekumel is rooted enough in Indian/Asian culture and tone that it "feels" real. I don't get the same sense from Harn for whatever reason.
The actual system is pretty interesting, and I have contemplated giving it a shot, running a game using just the base book.