This is a site for discussing roleplaying games. Have fun doing so, but there is one major rule: do not discuss political issues that aren't directly and uniquely related to the subject of the thread and about gaming. While this site is dedicated to free speech, the following will not be tolerated: devolving a thread into unrelated political discussion, sockpuppeting (using multiple and/or bogus accounts), disrupting topics without contributing to them, and posting images that could get someone fired in the workplace (an external link is OK, but clearly mark it as Not Safe For Work, or NSFW). If you receive a warning, please take it seriously and either move on to another topic or steer the discussion back to its original RPG-related theme.
The message boards have been upgraded. Please log in to your existing account by clicking here. It will ask twice, so that it can properly update your password and login information. If it has trouble recognizing your password, click the 'Forgot your password?' link to reset it with a new password sent to your email address on file.

Author Topic: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?  (Read 21449 times)

GameDaddy

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2931
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #240 on: January 27, 2021, 11:25:04 AM »
Gareth is far too busy with politics now to complete his Kickstarter. So glad I didn't pony up any money for this...

Blackmoor grew from a single Castle to include, first, several adjacent Castles (with the forces of Evil lying just off the edge of the world to an entire Northern Province of the Castle and Crusade Society's Great Kingdom.

~ Dave Arneson

Almost_Useless

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • A
  • Posts: 105
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #241 on: January 27, 2021, 04:52:48 PM »
He isn't someone I would look to for advice on accountability.

Godfather Punk

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 209
  • Oh dear, how sad, nevermind
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #242 on: February 23, 2021, 04:27:38 AM »
http://intothefarwest.com/2021/02/22/the-long-trail-home/?fbclid=IwAR0jozmu0f9iPO7EG3yGsVeMZxKgpDHUneD4WnxBxi_jgpZalMOwet_LRNg

Quote
Here we are in 2021.

Ten years. A decade. The original FAR WEST Kickstarter was in 2011. Ten years is a long goddamn time to ask people to wait, I know.

It’s been the hardest decade of my life. Professional and personal challenges, like I’d never experienced before. Physical and mental heath crises requiring damn near all of my focus and attention. The work on FAR WEST definitely suffered. You know it. I know it.

Honestly, I’m all out of apologies.

2021 is the year where FAR WEST finally gets released. I have not abandoned the project. I am finishing it up (currently adding some things, suggested by my editors, to various parts of the manuscript, mostly in the final chapter (the Narrator’s chapter). My business partner, Eric Trautmann, has begun layout of the completed chapters. Things are proceeding. PDFs will go out first to the long-suffering Kickstarter backers, and then will be released commercially, followed by the printed book (again, to backers first, and then wide).

We will release this year– delays, disasters, pandemics or societal collapse be damned.

Home is on the horizon. We’re racing the sunset, but we’re gonna get there.
Is this the year where we call out cultural appropriation on this project, and let the SJW cancel Adamant?  ;D

Habitual Gamer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • H
  • Posts: 15
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #243 on: February 23, 2021, 04:49:48 PM »
Far West is the poster child, but really...

Kickstarter is a -terrible- thing for people who want to buy RPGs, and act as a patron for them on the side.

Typically speaking, any rewards are non-exclusive, any prices are beat by online discounters (or you can pirate if you're a PDF-only fan), and what you do finally get... probably wasn't worth the wait (and non-backers don't really have to wait, as RPGs usually hit retail/DriveThru at the same time as backers get their stuff).

There's exceptions, but these are from big companies that can afford exclusives (Onyx Path and their high quality hardbacks) or discounts (Monte Cook Games -used- to be competitive with the online retailers).  And people who want to pay for a PDF copy of a book they already own (which is a whole other thing, and regionally dependent) can be better off backing on KS.  But generally speaking, the risk-to-reward ratio for Kickstarter RPGs are terrible.  And the smaller the publisher, the less likely you'll ever see anything it seems.

So if you want to be a patron and -maybe- get something for your money, sure, back a RPG on Kickstarter.  But if you're looking for a deal, just save your money and wait (which is like backing the KS, but with no risk).

Shasarak

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2600
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #244 on: February 23, 2021, 06:22:37 PM »
Kickstarter is a -terrible- thing for people who want to buy RPGs, and act as a patron for them on the side.

I disagree.

Kickstarter is a wonderful thing for people who want to buy RPGs and act as a Patron because for one you get your name in the book and can point to it and tell everyone that you had a part in getting it made and

b) you randomly get an RPG in the mail as a gift from someone who knows exactly what you like.

Just think of those people who, ten years ago, backed Far West and then out of the blue a box turns up at their place for something they have completely forgotten about.
"There can be no middle ground with bigots. Bigots want to deny the rights and livelihood of people different from them. They want them to cease existing, either by going underground or by murdering them. There is no "let's meet in the middle" with that. To suggest there can be is ignorance" RPGNet

Brad

  • No me gusta
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2550
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #245 on: February 24, 2021, 10:32:52 AM »
Just think of those people who, ten years ago, backed Far West and then out of the blue a box turns up at their place for something they have completely forgotten about.

This is literally the most insane thing ever posted on this forum...are you smoking crack?

Omega

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • O
  • Posts: 14676
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #246 on: February 24, 2021, 11:46:36 AM »
Well to be fair. 2 years after funding all of maybee 4 people did get their copy of Katalyka. The rest? Never. As in the designer took down even the PnP files and tried to palm off a second KS funded game. Then went non-bemusing nutters. Prior people were more or less content with her antics even if some were disgruntled about the removal of even being able to PnP the game they were promised. That and the fact alot more than 4 were printed off and apparently close to, or ready to ship. And never were.

Compare to HQ25 where it is still unsent. GZ is in legal trouble for not paying workers and on and on. 6 years now and its looking like its going to be never at this point despite probably a large portion of the minis done now.

Or Apex Predator that shipped to some. Others had their games refused by the designer, who kept the money.

Or the epic scamming systems of both Game Salute and now Golden Bell. Lots of luck getting those games you backed. Sorry we spent all the money on plushes.

Is Mark Rein*Hagen still doing the old "coming soon! working on it! coming soon!" song and dance routine with that board game that several backers still havent gotten years later?

Or of course Doom that came to Atlantic City and I believe that big dungeon adventure who's name eludes me that needed bailing out by another company. There are even designers claiming this is a valid KS strategy. You get all the money and someone else bails it out. Except in Atlantics case pissed off backers hunted down the creep who scammed everyone, including leaving the designers to take the blame, and he was taken to court and found guilty and is as of last check still under penalty to pay back what he stole.

Theres a long long long list of these that are never going to be sent. The list of ones that shipped years late can be counted on one hand. Usually if the delay goes past a year odds are its never going to happen. It might. But really. No.

The other problem is many KS scammers bank on delays as if you can stall long enough then the backer may lose options for refunds or action from banks and such.

sureshot

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2109
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #247 on: February 24, 2021, 11:13:30 PM »
Just think of those people who, ten years ago, backed Far West and then out of the blue a box turns up at their place for something they have completely forgotten about.

This is literally the most insane thing ever posted on this forum...are you smoking crack?

What's wrong with the post? I can see it happening someone who gave up on the Kickstarter actually being surprised at receiving the product. If anything you reaction is insane and out of proportion on what Shasarak posted.

In any case I kickstarted some products and was lucky enough to get my product and on time. Not trusting Kickstarter or willing to risk being burnt.

GeekEclectic

  • Toxic SocioKat
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 795
    • View Profile
    • http://del.icio.us/littleshepherd
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #248 on: February 25, 2021, 12:03:09 AM »
What's wrong with the post? I can see it happening someone who gave up on the Kickstarter actually being surprised at receiving the product. If anything you reaction is insane and out of proportion on what Shasarak posted.
I'm pretty sure Shasarak was taking the piss a little. Pushing a couple decent things(not giving up on kickstarters altogether due to the actions of a few bad actors, and that it can still be nice to receive something after you stop expecting it) to Far West extremes for comic effect and that Brad took the comment too seriously.
It's not rocket science; but when you're an idiot - everything is rocket science. Right? - tenbones

Omega

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • O
  • Posts: 14676
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #249 on: February 25, 2021, 07:45:05 AM »
Problem is the reality of crowdfunding platforms is that if it does not ship within about a year. Odds increase exponentially that it never will.

And the fact scammers bank on backers clinging to hope well past the point they should have demanded a refund and well past the point they can get one.

And of the ones we have seen ship really late. Most were sub par or lacking things that were payed for. And it is not a happy occasion. Its just one more nail in the frustration coffin. Or only a select few get the game payed for and everyone else is still waiting years later after that. Moreso if its been the usual song-n-dance routine of "Going to printers! Working on it! Going to printer!"

This has gotten to the point we now have predatory scam companies that look for struggling KS campaigns and offer their "help". Which oft ends up being a lesson in frustration to the point one desigher took Golden Bell to court to get her game back after GB laid claim to it when she tried to get out of their clutches.

Alot of KS campaigns succeed and its still a viable platform. But the sheer number of scams and failures means every one you back could be a loss.

And at this point whenever a KS starts saying "be patient" it is a huge red flag.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2021, 07:47:50 AM by Omega »

sureshot

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2109
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #250 on: February 25, 2021, 08:15:53 AM »
I'm pretty sure Shasarak was taking the piss a little. Pushing a couple decent things(not giving up on kickstarters altogether due to the actions of a few bad actors, and that it can still be nice to receive something after you stop expecting it) to Far West extremes for comic effect and that Brad took the comment too seriously.

I suspect Brad was also taking the piss too.


Though I would be one of those who kickstarted just ignore the loss and anything to do with said Kick Starter and author and just move on with my life. While being pleasantly surprised if and when Far West ever arrives.

Charon's Little Helper

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 580
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #251 on: February 25, 2021, 09:14:48 AM »
Problem is the reality of crowdfunding platforms is that if it does not ship within about a year. Odds increase exponentially that it never will.

I've backed 3 things total. Two have worked out well. One ended up being a semi-generic TTRPG, but fine (it's pretty). The other TTRPG is great, though it was delayed a couple times. Shinobigami is a bit narrative for my usual taste, but it's set up with concrete enough rules for the pacing that I like it. (The Kickstarter was just to translate - as it had been published in Japan well before.)

The third was Star Citizen and.... yeah. (Note: I only ever put out $ for the basic game 7-8 years back, so not that bad. Did not put down $100s on potential future fake space ships.)

I've definitely gotten to the point where I won't back anything that isn't either:

A: Obviously 90%+ done, likely just needing $ for publishing and/or using Kickstarter as marketing or playtesting etc.

or

B: Obviously well over half done AND the creator has a good record of getting crowdfunding stuff out the door. (Crowdfunding specifically rather than having completed stuff in the past when a publisher was hounding them.)
« Last Edit: February 25, 2021, 09:16:50 AM by Charon's Little Helper »

Brad

  • No me gusta
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2550
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #252 on: February 25, 2021, 04:01:30 PM »
I suspect Brad was also taking the piss too.

Yeah, just fucking around. We all know Far West will never be delivered unless someone else writes and publishes it with zero budget.

Omega

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • O
  • Posts: 14676
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #253 on: February 26, 2021, 01:54:04 AM »
The third was Star Citizen and.... yeah. (Note: I only ever put out $ for the basic game 7-8 years back, so not that bad. Did not put down $100s on potential future fake space ships.)


Star Citizen is a PC game isnt it? Those are notorious for having long delays sometimes or just never delivering. But PC game creation is different from a board game or RPG.

One of my friends has backed a few and usually its been a year or more before release. Sometimes sooner with demos and the like. But a year wait or more has been how at least two went.

Eirikrautha

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 257
    • View Profile
Re: Has it really been seven years since Far West was funded?
« Reply #254 on: February 26, 2021, 08:02:25 AM »
The third was Star Citizen and.... yeah. (Note: I only ever put out $ for the basic game 7-8 years back, so not that bad. Did not put down $100s on potential future fake space ships.)


Star Citizen is a PC game isnt it? Those are notorious for having long delays sometimes or just never delivering. But PC game creation is different from a board game or RPG.

One of my friends has backed a few and usually its been a year or more before release. Sometimes sooner with demos and the like. But a year wait or more has been how at least two went.

Dude, the Star Citizen Kickstarter was in 2012.  So it's a little more than "delayed."  It has become the poster-child of projects that make money through continuous fundraising, as opposed to actually producing anything (it isn't really even in alpha, at this point... more of a glorified tech demo).  When people think "over-promise," Star Citizen is the image that pops into their head...