Quote from: Christopher Brady;956816This advert is still running afoul of the Title VII of the Civil Right Act of 1964.

You still haven't addressed if Green Ronin even qualifies according to the definition.

Quote from: Tristram Evans;956823You still haven't addressed if Green Ronin even qualifies according to the definition.

Yes, they do as per Washington state.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;956826Yes, they do as per Washington state.

I see no evidence on that page that those are all full time staff who have worked for 20 weeks out of the year.
For all we know, the majority are freelance workers.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;956826Yes, they do as per Washington state.

Not necessarily. It wholly depends on how Green Ronin handles their business. I would hazard a guess that the folks they 'hire' are independent contractors (freelancers).

When a company hires an independent contractor, they do not have to honor most federal or state guidelines. FLSA, FICA, FUTA, COBRA, protections under the EEOC, workman's comp and other miscellaneous requirements goes out the window, as do other standard employee protections. I am unsure if the bona fide occupational qualification applies, however.

I've owned three businesses and both employed and contracted a lot of folks over time, but I've never ran into a situation where I specifically set out to hire a contractor with a protected characteristic exception. Spinachcat used to be a headhunter, and should be able to share some additional insight.

Quote from: Tristram Evans;956830I see no evidence on that page that those are all full time staff who have worked for 20 weeks out of the year.
For all we know, the majority are freelance workers.

OK, now I know you're deliberately trolling.  Forget it.  I've proven my point, what they are doing is a federal crime.

Quote from: ZWEIHÄNDER;956831Not necessarily. It wholly depends on how Green Ronin handles their business. I would hazard a guess that the folks they 'hire' are independent contractors (freelancers).

When a company hires an independent contractor, they do not have to honor most federal or state guidelines. FLSA, FICA, FUTA, COBRA, protections under the EEOC, workman's comp and other miscellaneous requirements goes out the window, as do other standard employee protections. I am unsure if the bona fide occupational qualification applies, however.

I've owned three businesses and both employed and contracted a lot of folks over time, but I've never ran into a situation where I specifically set out to hire a contractor with a protected characteristic exception. Spinachcat used to be a headhunter, and should be able to share some additional insight.

Did you take photos and use them as proof you have people currently working for you?  Did you name them and their positions, most of which require years of work to get within the company, and then let them go work for another, potentially rival company?

I don't think so.  You don't take photos of freelancers, list their names and positions, and post it on your 'About the Company' page of your website.  Beyond being tacky and dishonest (Oh, them?  They don't work here anymore.) it can cause issues for future employment, especially for contractors, which can (not saying it does) open up for legal action.  Especially if it prevents people from working.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;956832OK, now I know you're deliberately trolling.

Fuck man, I deliberately troll here all the time. When I do it I'm anything but subtle. This is just me poking logical holes in your declarations.


 

QuoteForget it.  I've proven my point,

To who? Everybody raise your hands if Brady has proven anything to you.

Quotewhat they are doing is a federal crime.

You just claimed they were breaking the law according to Washington State. Do you not know what the definition of a Federal Crime is?

Quote from: Christopher Brady;956833Did you take photos and use them as proof you have people currently working for you?  Did you name them and their positions, most of which require years of work to get within the company, and then let them go work for another, potentially rival company?

Sure, that would be standard for the comic book industry. I'm certain many other industries where the majority of work is done by freelance contractors. But at this point you're just making assumptions.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;956816There is no wage gap.  There is an EARNINGS gap.  It's looking at the total earnings for a life time.  And women do earn less, but there are major factors.  Namely marriage, women tend to work less when they get married, whether or not they have children, for example.

Of course. It's been known since Warren Farrell investigated the issue in 1990 something. But the idea won't die because of stuff like the... original topic! That if there's a lack of something ("representation" and pay usually), it must be sexism. The notion that women's choices just might have something to do with it has only recently been breaking into the mainstream conciousness. (Along with the rebuttals, I'm sure someone will make them here.)

Quote from: Christopher Brady;956832OK, now I know you're deliberately trolling.  Forget it.  I've proven my point, what they are doing is a federal crime.

No, I work in Washington State. We have a big issue with permatemp jobs doing just that. It's shitty, but challenging the system usually means getting tossed out on your ass.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;956704I've gamed with women who were just as combat/action oriented as the guys. I've gamed with women who were into the talkiy rpg stuff more than fighting. It's almost like... women aren't some kind of hive mind and are instead, individuals.

Yes, and I'm sure you've gamed with women who were taller than most men, too. Does that in any way change the fact that most women are shorter than most men? Strong general tendencies unquestionably exist.

So sure, if you are for some reason looking for someone to provide a feminine perspective on something, you can search look high and low for a man who is one of the small minority of men who have a mostly feminine perspective. Or you can pick a woman at random and gamble that she's not one of the small minority of women who have a mostly masculine perspective. Which one would you expect to take less time and effort?



On another note, since I have already established myself as being (kinda, sorta, mostly) on Team Gender Quota here, I would like to take a moment to double down on my contrariness and complain about things said by that team also:

Quote from: cranebump;956679I believe the average white person is completely in the dark concerning the experiences of minorities, even vicariously, through reading about such experiences, and, as such, cannot understand exactly the issues facing those unlike them. Further, I believe we too easily forgive the crimes of our ancestors because, "It wasn't me."

Remember how I said a few pages ago that MRAs turn me off men's rights activism? Well, this is what turns me off progressivism - this endless, pointless, soul-crushing guilt-flinging. Guess what, it wasn't, in point of fact, me - and for that matter, I'm not going to sit here in the midst of all the comforts of high technology and enlightened social attitudes and piously condemn the people who came before me for acting in accordance with the world they were born into. As for my understanding, it's perfectly adequate, thank you - certainly it is no worse than the understanding of all those feminists who tell me with absolute certainty how wonderful my life is and how I've been handed everything on a silver platter and how I couldn't possibly understand what it feels like to not have everything always go my way.

The difference between me and some screeching alt-righter is that I refuse to be so petty as to actively resist doing the right thing just because the people who are the most gung-ho about doing it all insist on shitting on me. So yeah, bring on the progressiveness - I may bitch endlessly about the form of it, but I won't resist the substance of it. You want to add gender and racial hiring quotas to my profession? Go ahead, I'm sure I'll still get by. You want to raise my taxes to pay for social programs? I am happy to be of service. I can't recall, off the top of my head, any actual liberal policy that I am not at least cautiously in favour of.

So yeah, I'll do the right thing when called upon. But since I am in fact doing the right thing, you are doing the wrong thing by constantly insulting me.

Quote from: Simlasa;956736No, nothing literal or specific.
Like, there's a wide variety of subtle messages we pick up on and interpret as 'unfriendly'... correctly or not. Being TOO friendly can be just as off putting... "Why are these guys so happy to see me?!!!"

Yeah, about that argument, which tends to crop up... if something is too "subtle" to adequately describe or quantify, then it serves no purpose to talk about it. The moment you can present to me a code of behaviour that is functional in a real life context and is backed by either sufficiently strong consensus or a legitimate authority, then I strongly invite you to do so so that I can proceed to follow it. I will do so whether I agree with it or not - I am not unreasonable.

But the whole "microaggressions," "invisible ropes" rhetoric? That carries no meaningful information except "every single thing you do is wrong and you're too stupid to even realise it." I can do nothing productive in reaction to that information except remove myself from all human interaction. That infringes on my right to, well, exist, and is therefore not an acceptable code of behaviour.

Surprisingly or not, Baeraad and me are in agreement. Except I've done wrong things to hurt someone for crossing certain lines.

Quote from: Trond;956820That would be the 'white knights' many people talk about. I'm sure there are some of those out there. I prefer old-fashioned knights.

There are also some people who hate any talk about what is 'typical' for men or women. As if the moment someone realizes that they are atypical in some way, then that makes them less worthy or something. I am not anywhere near the norm in some ways, so I never saw what the problem was with being 'atypical' or against the run of the mill*.

*For instance, I have always known that men tend to fall for slightly younger women, while women tend to fall for slightly older men, statistically speaking. I have no problem accepting that this general observation is true, even though I myself have sometimes had a tendency to fall for women who were a couple of years older, for whatever reason.

Also, this, it's always funny to watch people assuming that pointing out their behavior is atypical is some kind of hidden criticism (usually followed by them trying to deny the very notion of "typical behaviour")!

As I've mentioned previously, I am an ex-headhunter. I've never heard of any federal law that allows small businesses to legally discriminate against contractors when advertising for positions. If that existed, you would see such ads all over the place. But as others have mentioned, small business employees don't have the same protections once hired.

Here's what the EEOC says about discrimination in job postings:
https://www.eeoc.gov/laws/practices/

Here's what Monster.com tells employers about job postings:
https://hiring.monster.com/hr/hr-best-practices/monster-training/security-center/avoid-discrimination-in-job-postings.aspx

Quote from: Black Vulmea;956644Watching reactionary misogynists shit themselves is comedy gold.

According to this article, 70% of your "reactionary misogynists" are...women.
https://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcome/?toURL=https://forbes.com/sites/datafreaks/2014/10/16/gender-quotas-in-hiring-drive-away-both-women-and-men/&refURL=&referrer=

Quote from: cranebump;956603ALL LIVES MATTER, DAMNIT!

That was the goal of the Civil Rights Movement. It was to end divisiveness and see all humans as equal.

The success of that movement was amazing. One of the greatest achievements in human history.

The success of modern identity politics is....nothing but division, failure and acrimony.

Unless, of course, you consider keeping Hillary out of the White House to be a grand success of identity politics! :eek:

Quote from: CRKrueger;956629SJWs are trying to achieve Justice by taking the path and using the tools of Injustice.  They are trying to eliminate discrimination by discriminating.  Surely intelligent people can see this might not go so well.

Apparently not.

Quote from: Baeraad;956672"We're screeching and howling for a better tomorrow!"

Twitter's next ad campaign!!

Quote from: Lynn;956673It does accomplish something. Creating this situation causes buzz on the internet for a game that otherwise will probably not distinguish itself from others....They can virtue-signal and get buzz at the same time, and pull back in the Blue Rose crowd, too.

I think you nailed it.

Controversy as free marketing.

Quote from: Simlasa;956685There are plenty of female-dominated hobbies, some of them I participate in. I've never seen any women wringing their hands over how to get more men involved. Sometimes I suspect that a portion of this energy is lonely maladroids looking for 'dates'.

The hand wringing reeks of "if I white knight enough, maybe she'll touch my schlong".

The laugh is many female dominated hobbies have huge successful businesses, like the craft hobby. Almost every town has a craft store (or three) and those businesses could increase their profits if they somehow got more males into crafting. But those businesses instead just focus on their core audience.

BTW, I've heard from a few female gamers who love RPGs as a getaway from other women. Just like some men like the non-sexual company of women, some women like the non-sexual company of men. They're not a majority to be sure.

Quote from: jhkim;956696There are a lot of jobs that call for certain attributes that are gender-specific or gender-biased.

The EEOC has the bona fide occupational qualification. It is limited for exactly those kinds of jobs.  

Extremely important for making Einstein / MLK porn when you want to achieve that historical resonance!

Quote from: Ashakyre;956746Who's got the time machine.

Doc Brown and Marty McFly!!

Quote from: Tristram Evans;956834You just claimed they were breaking the law according to Washington State. Do you not know what the definition of a Federal Crime is?

Actually, just realized you probably don't, since you're Canadian. And as such, this isn't an issue that affects you in the slightest....so, I think Black Vulmea was right in this case.

Quote from: Baeraad;956851But the whole "microaggressions," "invisible ropes" rhetoric? That carries no meaningful information except "every single thing you do is wrong and you're too stupid to even realise it."

I wasn't talking about 'microaggressions' actually... just a need, by some people, for more formal invitations to join in.