Quote from: HappyDaze;1046707Actually, you want to promote early mobility once the injury is stable (which it should be if it is stitched).

Fair enough.  I'm just remembering my dad, who used to do strenuous stuff that he shouldn't because he was 'well enough'.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046695It's stories like these that make me ask, "What's the point of 'Cursed' items if they're useful?"  That's not a curse, that's an effective tool.

Cursed items work best on those who lack creativity. Though as I mentioned before, or at least think I did, there should be an option to undo it. And that option should be a source of further adventure. This is why I will often have proxies or agents of Deities such as Corellon at the ready to provide a quest to give them the opportunity to fix it, which also allows the rest of the party to have a chance to reap rewards whilst helping out. The idea is not to screw over player characters, but to give them the opportunity to advance, albeit in a different way.

Quote from: Krimson;1046719Cursed items work best on those who lack creativity.

That's probably why I never used them.  Most of the players I know are much more creative and devious than I am.

Quote from: Krimson;1046719Though as I mentioned before, or at least think I did, there should be an option to undo it. And that option should be a source of further adventure. This is why I will often have proxies or agents of Deities such as Corellon at the ready to provide a quest to give them the opportunity to fix it, which also allows the rest of the party to have a chance to reap rewards whilst helping out. The idea is not to screw over player characters, but to give them the opportunity to advance, albeit in a different way.

To me a curse is something players should see coming. There's enough 'gotchas' in the universe that I don't feel the need to trick my players into something they don't deserve.  YMMV, as always, though.

Quote from: Willie the Duck;1044979Chris, Gronan has jumped ship, he's not going to be answering you.

Cupcake won't stop regardless of whether Gronan is here or not. He's going on and on about imaginary* wrongs to imaginary players while the real-life players are enjoying their games, including the cursed items:).
I find it's best to put him on IL and only read his posts when I'm in the mood to be entertained by watching railroad crashes;). YMMV.

*Because he says it's not due to him hating old-school games:p.

Quote from: Krimson;1046719Cursed items work best on those who lack creativity. Though as I mentioned before, or at least think I did, there should be an option to undo it. And that option should be a source of further adventure.

Yeah, that. Your wife died due to a nasty random encounter and a failed Con check in a game without resurrection? Go to the Lord of the Dead, Inspire yourself from your Love: Wife passion and use that to perform the best music the dead have heard - and demand her soul back!

But that's what a good player would do. Some players prefer to just start complaining about the random tables, cursed items, and the penalties to the Constitution check;).

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046721That's probably why I never used them.  Most of the players I know are much more creative and devious than I am.

That's great news, Cupcake:D!

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046695It's stories like these that make me ask, "What's the point of 'Cursed' items if they're useful?"  That's not a curse, that's an effective tool.

How do you think a Treant would view a Wand of Fireballs or a Saw of Mighty Cutting (DMG p153):?

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046695It's stories like these that make me ask, "What's the point of 'Cursed' items if they're useful?"  That's not a curse, that's an effective tool.

Hell, even if you don't want to use them for capturing, imagine a healer with a bunch of these.  Hell, every hospital would love to have a few to keep those idiots from trying to get up and undoing stitches or otherwise slowing their healing down.

On the one hand, absolutely any cursed item can in theory be useful, if for no other purpose than to use them on enemies/prisoners.

But frankly, I find cursed items that are just a temporary problem for PCs (until they can remove curse) to be incredibly boring.
I VASTLY prefer cursed items that actually have a useful purpose but a terrible cost.

Hell, I even wrote a sourcebook about some of these.

I think the best Cursed items are ones players WANT to keep, rather than are FORCED to.

(You know it's sad when one cannot afford to spend 1.99 USD...)

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1046695It's stories like these that make me ask, "What's the point of 'Cursed' items if they're useful?"  That's not a curse, that's an effective tool.

How is this a bad thing? The PCs are handed a lemon and decided to make Lemonaid.

The main thing to remember is that these instances of the PCs finding a use for a cursed item are not that common and as noted earlier in the thread. The item might not really be cursed. What if it really was a medical aid? Or a sleep aid for someone once. What corrupted it? Did it just degrade over time? Did a demon screw with it. er... not that sort of screw... :eek:

Same with any other cursed item. Maybee it was not cursed to begin with. Or even a-la Gamma World. Its just being used wrong or the wrong command word is being used. (trap)

I mean people have been finding creative uses for bags of devouring since about day 1. And since it did commit the first TPK a bag of holding is a cursed item in the wrong hands. And who knows how many groups have been splattered by a mis-placed Daern's Instant Fortress.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1047262I think the best Cursed items are ones players WANT to keep, rather than are FORCED to.

(You know it's sad when one cannot afford to spend 1.99 USD...)

So, wait, did you change your mind? Because that sounds like the opposite of what you were saying before?

Quote from: RPGPundit;1047237But frankly, I find cursed items that are just a temporary problem for PCs (until they can remove curse) to be incredibly boring.
I VASTLY prefer cursed items that actually have a useful purpose but a terrible cost.

Even if I rolled it on a random encounter table, if I thought it would somehow be boring, I wouldn't use it. I want the players to agonize over a curse, not sigh in resignation. I want them to fight their suffering, not accept it. That's not fun.

Quote from: Krimson;1048210Even if I rolled it on a random encounter table, if I thought it would somehow be boring, I wouldn't use it. I want the players to agonize over a curse, not sigh in resignation. I want them to fight their suffering, not accept it. That's not fun.

Well, yeah, that's better than just being pissed off about the item.  But the real notion of the classical cursed artifact is that it fucks you up but you keep using it voluntarily because of the power it offers.

Quote from: RPGPundit;1048418Well, yeah, that's better than just being pissed off about the item.  But the real notion of the classical cursed artifact is that it fucks you up but you keep using it voluntarily because of the power it offers.

Tell me about it. I've played Elric more than a few times.

Quote from: RPGPundit;1047846So, wait, did you change your mind? Because that sounds like the opposite of what you were saying before?

Sorry, let me clarify, the D&D cursed items have almost no benefit compared to the risk, so no one really wants to keep them, but they can find use for them.  But good cursed items are things player WANT.  They should be powerful and useful, as well as cursed.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;1048920Sorry, let me clarify, the D&D cursed items have almost no benefit compared to the risk, so no one really wants to keep them, but they can find use for them.  But good cursed items are things player WANT.  They should be powerful and useful, as well as cursed.

OK, in that case you have a position that's actually very similar to my own. That was the premise behind my "13 cursed artifacts" sourcebook.