Setting this up as a spin-off topic for an interesting discussion on another topic. Feel free to post anything you've done with in-game units of time, distance, currency, etc.
For coinage, I went with:
1 gold duket = 100 silver guilder = 1000 copper bob
For size:
copper bob ~ US penny
silver guilder ~ US nickel
gold duket ~ US quarter
If you assume pure metal for those sizes:
100 copper bobs = 0.85 lb
100 silver guilders = 1.60 lb
100 gold dukets = 3.46 lb
I assume that coins have a 50% packing density. A 6"x6"x6" box will hold:
4085 copper bob (34.6 lb)
2569 silver guilder (41.0 lb)
2188 gold duket (75.6 lb)
For distances, went with "paces" and "leagues" as the primary units. This decision is in part to make it somewhat vague to modern ears and partly to make in-game conversions simple.
Paces can be defined as 3', 3 1/3 feet, 1 meter, 5 feet, 6 feet, 2 meters or whatever the group wants. Leagues are set at approximately 3 miles, but are really set to kludged historical 8 leagues is distance adventurers can walk in a day over fields or roads. Because 8 leagues/24 miles are really easy to subdivide for the system in question and the expected scale of hex maps. Thus, the pace/league conversion is not fixed. Lose the fairy tale, "7 leagues boots" as a magical item that lets you take a day's journey in 7 steps, at the more historical approximately 20 miles, but I can live with it for hex conversion simplicity.
I have found in practice that I still give heights in feet, as the players have a mental block against using it for anything but vertical distance. Doesn't hurt that most of the game is not on a grid, with paces being a little fluid even moment to moment.
I still use feet and miles. Battlemaps use 5' squares. Overland hex maps have 6-mile hexes, subdivided with 1.2 mile hexes (per Todd Leback's "Filling in the Blanks -- A Guide to Populating Hexcrawls).
For my players, I give distances in terms of time. For example, a normally encumbered PC can travel two hexes/10 subhexes/12 miles on a road in one day. This accounts for striking camp, rest breaks, stopping for meals, scouting, exploring, and setting up camp. If they wanted to move as fast as possible, I'd up the rate by 50%, but would make them easier to surprise in terms of encounters.
YMMV.
For a calendar, I went lazy. 12 months. 4 weeks/month. 7 days/week.
I use imperial measurements- miles, yards, etc.
Money varies based on where you are. Gold is the usual standard but some places- like Venesha- also use diamonds as currency, leading to a rather interesting set of situations for some hapless characters who stumbled across an island almost made of carbon with tidy atomic arrangements...
Some tribes don't use money at all.
Copper, silver, platinum and in some places brass are typical, too. Paper money is rarely used if at all. Relative values vary somewhat from place to place but is mostly like in the 1977 AD&D rulebooks.
However, since this is Ayundell some do understand the idea of "electroplating," and can literally make counterfeit currency that can pass a typical test since on the surface the material is real. Using that water test is often used to detect this.
In college, in my physics curriculum, I had a T/A who noted that if we didn't give measurements, he would assume that we meant furlongs per fortnight for our raw numbers. This has stuck with me for decades - and I still think of lengths in terms of furlongs, or 220 yards; and fortnights, or two weeks.
I'm big into my games having downtimes measured in fortnights.
Quote from: dkabq on October 07, 2021, 04:28:48 PM
For a calendar, I went lazy. 12 months. 4 weeks/month. 7 days/week.
You can do:
7 days in a week
4 weeks in a month
13 months in a year
Which equals 364 days. Then add a holy day at the end and you get a solar year (leap day notwithstanding. )
I wish the real world would adopt that.
Quote from: Aglondir on October 07, 2021, 05:11:15 PM
Quote from: dkabq on October 07, 2021, 04:28:48 PM
For a calendar, I went lazy. 12 months. 4 weeks/month. 7 days/week.
You can do:
7 days in a week
4 weeks in a month
13 months in a year
Which equals 364 days. Then add a holy day at the end and you get a solar year (leap day notwithstanding. )
I wish the real world would adopt that.
Or just go with 364 days/yr. :)
I'm currently experimenting with coins.
TL;DR version: Bronze Farthing, Copper Penny, Silver Star, Gold Orb, and Mithril Mark.
Currently set at ratios of 4:1, 5:1, 10:1, and then 10:1. That is 1 mm = 10 go = 100 ss = 500 cp = 2,000 bf.
Long version:
For currency, I've done a radical overhaul, building the equipment lists from the ground up. I'm on my second major revision (and I don't know how many minor ones), trying to strike a compromise between game play, vaguely historical/fantastical sounding units, and a focus on main late dark age, early middle ages technology.
Complicating it is that I've deliberately left in some late middle ages options under the guise of a previous golden age. So, for example, a few people know how to make plate armor, but not so many that the weapons list has completely gone into late medieval territory. Yeah, I know, some of this is mere rationalization for a hodge-podge of disparate stuff in one game.
I also wanted a silver standard, that was easy to convert from many existing fantasy games and from historical sources. The nod to late dark ages, early medieval is that weapons and clothes are generally much more expensive, and the higher tech weapons and armor are really expensive. This gives characters something to spend money on before they start finding magic (relatively late in the power levels).
Throw all of that in a blender and do some judicious rounding, and I got those coins.
Seriously considering bumping that last gold/mithril ratio even higher into 20:1, but the "mark" part is about right given the expected purity, size, and ratio of silver and gold (devaluing gold to the lower end of its range, but that's OK given the mixed tech setting). Even though "mark" isn't a real coin but an accounting measure. Of course, mithril isn't real either, so maybe that cancels out.
Delta's Hotspot musings on currency helped a lot with this last pass, in particular setting the silver standard at about the level of the "Groat", or about 4 silver pennies. I didn't use "Groat" because it's a much later coin, but maybe that's me being too picky. OTOH, after a lot of back and forth with various real-world silver and gold names, I didn't find any that didn't invoke either a much later period or imply ratios that are not at all a match for the above.
To reconcile it for game play, the above ratios assume all of these coins are about American quarter size (though a little thicker), with the silver and gold relatively pure, the copper a thin coating on a silver shell, and the bronze a relatively impure copper/bronze mix (that is, lots of impurities that aren't valuable). In reality, copper and bronze aren't used at the same time, and would be close to equal in value. That gives me about 80 silver per pound bar. Which still isn't technically correct, but is in the ballpark for real-world silver. It means that I can use Delta's neat trick of of reading historical equipment list "pennies" (d) as "cp" even with copper penny, "shillings" as x3 silver, and "pounds" as x6 gold. I can also convert most early D&D adventures by dividing treasure values by 1/10th. This makes copper a little more worth hauling out.
The last thing that prompted this particular revision is that I had a slightly easier to convert system before, but the scale and naming was off. I had two different silver coins and a lot of overlap in the sounds, and it was causing all kinds of issues in play. You'll note that a player can use shorthand of "bronze, copper, silver, gold, mithril" or use the coin names, even mixing those up, without confusing the issue. Standard sizes also help. I really wanted to use the dark age "silver penny" as the base, but it just doesn't work with all the other considerations above. I also like the alternate names of "silver moon" and "golden sun", but that provides more overlap and it inconveniently makes the gold abbreviation as "gs" which has a real-world reference inconsistent with the its value.
Designing this system caused me multiple headaches. I hope it works, because I don't want to redo it. :D
Quote from: Aglondir on October 07, 2021, 05:11:15 PM
Quote from: dkabq on October 07, 2021, 04:28:48 PM
For a calendar, I went lazy. 12 months. 4 weeks/month. 7 days/week.
You can do:
7 days in a week
4 weeks in a month
13 months in a year
Which equals 364 days. Then add a holy day at the end and you get a solar year (leap day notwithstanding. )
I wish the real world would adopt that.
Or go with adding a forthnight of celebration every 56 years, which would bring the calendar into alignment and would mark a celestial year. (Sorta-kinda what the Mayas did but they started anew every 52 years for some reason).
I once did a setting with 6 day weeks, 30 day months, 12 months, and 4 "days outside the calendar" at the solstice and equinox points of each season. Players loved it, especially the magic that happened on the special days.
Drove me crazy with keeping track of it. I just couldn't mentally adjust on the fly to having 6 day weeks, either. :D
For years, before Covid we've used what I call the SSU (standard spatial unit). It's the size of the room your group is currently gaming in. "You open the cellar doors and find a musty, dimly lit basement that is about 2 SSU." Works great as I see players looking around the room that we are in.
Quote from: Vic99 on October 07, 2021, 06:21:32 PM
For years, before Covid we've used what I call the SSU (standard spatial unit). It's the size of the room your group is currently gaming in. "You open the cellar doors and find a musty, dimly lit basement that is about 2 SSU." Works great as I see players looking around the room that we are in.
Hah, I do a different thing with creature sizes, using whatever creatures are common in the setting. I can describe a big spider using measurements, and it really doesn't register. I can say that it's body is the size of a "small pony" and half the table freaks out.
Had a lot of fun with that in a recent session. Party was fighting some 3' foot tall rat folk, and I kept describing them as "about the size of" a particular PC that was playing a hobbit-sized character. It became a running gag. Then they ran up against some giant wasps, with foreshadowing of a lot of buzzing. The first scout finally got a look and said, "about the size of" that PC. Nope, "about twice the size of" PC name of big barbarian character. That was all it took, the party ran immediately.
I've found that messing with the calendar is more trouble than it's worth. For one world I did 6 days per week, 6 weeks per month, 10 months per year, and 4 extra days on the solstices and equinoxes. It's nice for color, but always caused confusion in conversation; never could remember if we were talking real-world weeks and months or in-game calendar terms.
I'm pretty happy with the currency for my current game. There are gold, silver, and copper coins; each is 1/50 of a pound and has the diameter of a dime. (The thickness of the coins vary to make this work out right.) In current, real world term, the coin values come to about 4 cents, $4, and $400, which is really convenient for coin changing and estimating values. Tell the players they looted 100 gold royals from the bandit camp and they'll think that's nice. But when they realize that's about $40,000 in real-money terms, it adds a lot of impact.
If the setting doesn't have a calendar already, I typically use 12 months of approximately 30 days, labelled M1 M2 M3 etc. I find that having info on the solstices & equinoxes, and day length by time of year, is the most important thing for regulating the calendar & adventuring activities.
Here's my developed Primeval Thule (ancient fantasy Greenland) calendar:
Calendar - from start of campaign
The Atlantean year starts with the Spring Equinox on the 1st of Tebon.
Game Month - Sunrise & Sunset 1st of month, east (Boreal) of Quodeth.
M1 Tebon (March) 6am/6pm (1/1 is the Spring Equinox, festival of Ishtar)
M2 Sana (April) 3am/9pm > LONG DAY (15/2 is first day of no sunset, festival of Tarhun)
M3 Adar (May) LONG DAY (no sunset)
M4 Nidon (June) LONG DAY (1/4 is Summer Solstice, festival of Mitra. No sunset)
M5 Taru (July) LONG DAY (15/5 is last day of no sunset) 17/5 Queen Deyane's birthday festival.
M6 Samon (August) - 3am/9pm
M7 Dumet (September) - 6am/6pm (1/7 is the Autumn Equinox, festival of Set)
M8 Abron (October) - 9am/3pm > TWILIGHT (15/8 is first day of no sunrise, festival of Tiamat) 27/8 Harvest festival of Kishar
M9 Ulon (November) - LONG NIGHT (no sunrise all month, full dark)
M10 Tisra (December) - LONG NIGHT (1/10 is Winter Solstice, festival of Nergal. No sunrise all month)
M11 Samnu (January) - TWILIGHT (15/11 is last day of no sunrise, 16/11 festival of Azura)
M12 Kislon (February) - 9am/3pm on 1st Kislon
The duration of the Long Night varies from over 4 months at Thule's Boreal ("eastern") tip, to 0 months in Katagia and south across the Claws of Sunset where "The Sun Ever Sets".
City: Approximate Duration Long Night/Long Day
Quodeth: 3 months
Marg: 2.5 months
Nith: 5 weeks
Imystrahl: 3 weeks
Katagia: 0 weeks - just outside Polar Circle
With Forgotten Realms I just do a bit of development of the published calendar. For Damara 1359 DR:
Damaran-Impilturan Calendar
Each month is 30 days, made up of three Tendays, with 5 festival days between the months.
Month Common Name
1 (January) Deepwinter
2 (February) Latewinter or Claw of Winter. Last month of Winter.
3 (March) Sunrise. First month of Spring.
Annual holiday: Greengrass. Sunrise 6am/Sunset 6pm
4 (April) Stormsend
5 (May) Melting. The mountain passes typically become navigable in this month.
6 (June) Flowers. First month of summer.
Annual holiday: Midsummer. Sunrise 4am/Sunset 8pm
7 (July) Flamerule. Usually the hottest month of the year.
8 (August) Highsun
9 (September) Fading. The beginning of Autumn.
Annual holiday: Highharvestide. Sunrise 6am/Sunset 6pm
10 (October) Leaffall
11 (November) Rotting
Annual holiday: The Feast of the Moon. Sunrise 7.20am/Sunset 4.40pm
12 (December) Nightfall. The beginning of Winter.
Annual holiday: Midwinter. Sunrise 8am/Sunset 4pm
I actually have several calanders in my world.
The foundation is a seven day week with the days inherited from the Old Faith. The week begins with Truceday, then proceeds through the elements Windsday, Earthsday, Fireday and Waterday, and lastly, Sunday and Moonday. If you don't see the joke... say them out loud.
The humans use a 12 month calander with the months names for the 12 gods of the primary pantheon; the Via Praetorum. The months coinciding with the spring and autumn equinoxes and the summer and winter solstices have 5 weeks (35 days) while the others have 4 weeks (28 days). Each season begins with the associated solar event which is also the start of the five week month.
The Old Faith marks the seasons, but counts only the weeks instead of months (i.e Windsday of the third week of spring).
The elves, by contrast, use an entirely lunar calander (their All Mother deity is associated with the Moon) with each month beginning on a New Moon and beginning a two week cycle of inward contemplation of one of their eleven deities, followed by two weeks beginning at the Full Moon where that deity is outwardly celebrated.
The final two months of the annual cycle celebrate the relationship of two of the ten lesser gods with the All Mother (one per month) and which gods and their order give the name to that particular year and a complete cycle of those forms a 90 year cycle which themselves are named for one of their gods and is believed to reflect the fortunes of the elves during that age.
There are also several different counts of years; the Old Faith dates from The Covenant that is foundational to their faith. By their count it is Covanent Year (CY) 5204. The Praetorian Empire dated things from its founding and by that reckoning it is Imperial Year (IY) 975. Those who fell to complete barbarism count from The Cataclysm, with a date of 198 Post Cataclysm (PC). The elves use a similar count since they only entered the Mortal World because of the Cataclysm, but with their dating system it is recorded as the Year of Songs of the Seas in the Cycle of Cha-Chata (Fate).
Money is almost entirely by actual weight of the metal and so the Pound (of silver), Cent (one per cent of a pound of silver) and Bit (a quarter of a cent) are the most common for interstate trade, though each realm generally mints its own coinage in varying denominations using various metals.
Bits are typically copper and about the size of a US penny. 1, 5 and 10 cent coins are typically struck in silver (the 1 cent coin is typically about the size of a US nickel). 20 or 25, 50 cent and one pound coins are typically struck in gold, with the £1 being a 1 oz (1/16 variety, not the 1/12 Troy oz) coin about the size of a quarter (thus the de facto ratio is 16:1 for silver to gold value... which is reasonably close to historic norms in the real world).
Anything beyond about £80 (5 pounds of gold) is most likely going to be in the form of precious gems instead (which can hit up to £10 per caret fof very rare varieties) with some extremely wealthy realms striking silver or gold coins that are inlaid with one or more less rare gems for use as £5, £10 or larger values (not that there is much of anything beyond ships, artwork and magic that would require such coinage).
Measurements are generally anthropic (based on the human body). The inch was some past ruler's finger digit, the foot is similarly someone's foot, the yard is the length of their belt. The most common game measurement is the Pace, for which I use the Roman pacum because it is almost exactly 5' and thus measures D&D-style 5' squares in a very natural unit... i.e. 6 paces instead of six 5' squares.
My in-game Mile is similarly based off the Roman mille passum (1000 paces) and so is 5000'.
Weight is based on the pound, derived from the weight of a pint of fresh water (i.e. "a pint's a pound the whole world round"). The pint is derived from a container that comfortably fit in some past ruler's hand (a cylinder about 3" across and 4" high). The ton is 2000 pounds and was based on the largest barrel of alcohol (250 gallons) that could be easily rolled through some past ruler's feast hall door. Finer grades of weight are the oz (1/16 of a pound; primarily a customary unit), the cent (used for coinage and science), the carat (1/10 of a cent; 1/1000 of a pound) and the grain (1/100 of a cent; 1/10,000 of a pound) with fine weights typically recorded as X.YY.ZZ (pounds.cents.grains) with any final zeros dropped (so 4.5 instead of 4.50.00).
In practical game terms only the pound is typically relevant, though cents and carats are common with coinage and gems/jewelry.
It is entirely possible I've thought about this way too much.
Right now, I only tend to clarify that coins are about the size of a US dime. I know there was some trope or assumption that coins were like.. bigger than a Canadian $2 coin, like the pirate gold coins you'd see in movies.
I tend to use the standard imperial units just for ease of reference. I suppose if I was making my own setting it could be interesting to adapt a non-standard set of units to the specific setting, I just wonder how much that would bother people to try and learn/use for in game stuff.
Quote from: Banjo Destructo on October 08, 2021, 01:41:47 PM
Right now, I only tend to clarify that coins are about the size of a US dime. I know there was some trope or assumption that coins were like.. bigger than a Canadian $2 coin, like the pirate gold coins you'd see in movies.
I tend to use the standard imperial units just for ease of reference. I suppose if I was making my own setting it could be interesting to adapt a non-standard set of units to the specific setting, I just wonder how much that would bother people to try and learn/use for in game stuff.
Size of coins amounts to trade offs on a few considerations. How much do value historical fidelity on sizes? Which period and area? Do you want to approximate the relative value of silver and gold? Again, which time and area and source of silver and gold and inflation? How many compromises with those are you willing to make for game play? There's no inherent right or wrong answer, only better or worse answers for a given mix of goals.
The "silver penny" as about dime size is a good historical starting place. This works well if you don't have many gold coins and the ones you do are different sizes and/or you vary the rate of silver/gold value from historical norms for game play, etc. That is, you can have easy ratios, same size coins, or keep the historical ratio on bullion but not all three. Which means if you really want silver penny dime-sized coins and then everything follows from that, you can make a really good mix for late dark ages, early middle ages currency. There just won't be much gold involved. Or copper either, for that matter.
The range of the silver/gold bullion value has generally stayed within 1 pound gold equal to 10 to 16 pounds silver. Often closer to the middle than the extremes. Chris has his reason for coins that end up using the 1:16 ratio. I've got different reasons for going the other extreme with 1:10 (almost all game-play and standard coin size compromises, in my case).
Of course, in a fantasy game, you could also decide that the size of the coins was the only thing that mattered and not give 2 bits for historical ratios or the actual weight of the metal.
Which is the long way around to saying that the bigger coins is a trope, but it isn't only a trope. It's a way to manage those compromises. It's also a very convenient way of having currency interact with encumbrance, particularly if you want to put some thought into what it means to haul bags of coins out of a dungeon. :D
Quote from: Chris24601 on October 08, 2021, 11:33:55 AM
Weight is based on the pound, derived from the weight of a pint of fresh water (i.e. "a pint's a pound the whole world round").
Very much something for the World Series of proverbs:
From Wikipedia:
One US fluid pint of water weighs 1.04318 pounds (16.69081 ounces), which gives rise to a popular saying: "A pint's a pound, the world around". However, the statement does not hold around the world because the British imperial pint, which was also the standard measure in Australia, India, Malaya, New Zealand, South Africa, and other former British colonies, weighs 1.2528 pounds, which is where another popular saying used in Commonwealth countries came from: "a pint of pure water weighs a pound and a quarter".
Quote from: Anselyn on October 08, 2021, 02:24:21 PM
Quote from: Chris24601 on October 08, 2021, 11:33:55 AM
Weight is based on the pound, derived from the weight of a pint of fresh water (i.e. "a pint's a pound the whole world round").
Very much something for the World Series of proverbs:
From Wikipedia:
One US fluid pint of water weighs 1.04318 pounds (16.69081 ounces), which gives rise to a popular saying: "A pint's a pound, the world around". However, the statement does not hold around the world because the British imperial pint, which was also the standard measure in Australia, India, Malaya, New Zealand, South Africa, and other former British colonies, weighs 1.2528 pounds, which is where another popular saying used in Commonwealth countries came from: "a pint of pure water weighs a pound and a quarter".
Oh, believe me; I'm aware. I did a lot of research and reverse engineering on certain weights and measures to find ways a similar unit would emerge in my setting. It took a bit of fiddling to get a reasonable sounding volume that would give you right around a US Pint (a finger across and a hand high cylinder got really close so that's what I used in my setting fluff).
Likewise I easily spent a solid day just finding primal-themed names for the days of the week that would also sound as close as possible to the real world American days of the week (i.e. Truceday = Tuesday, Windsday = Wednesday, etc.). Why? So it'd be easier for people playing the game to remember vs. completely made up day names.
The biggest stretches for me were Earthsday = Thursday and Waterday = Saturday as I ended up going more for a similar syllable count with at least one of them sorta matching (i.e. ah-ter in Water and Satur)... so I'm really open to alternatives if someone thinks of one.
For my Auran Empire setting, I decided the moon orbits the earth every 30 1/3 days, while the sun orbits the earth every 364 days.
The solar calendar therefore has a solar year of 364 days divided into 4 seasons of 3 months each. Each season consists of 1 long month of 5 weeks, and 1 short month of 4 weeks.
The long month's first week is a week-long festival that starts on a solstice or equinox that celebrates the start of the new seasons.
WINTER
Long Month 1
Week 1, starts on Winter Solstice
Week 2 - 5
Short Month 2
Week 1 - 4
Short Month 3
Week 1 -4
SPRING
Long Month 1
Week 1, starts on Spring Equinox
Week 2-5
Short Month 2
etc.
The lunar calendar has a lunar year of 364 days divided into 4 seasons of 3 months of 30.33 days each, 91 days total. Since 91 days equals (28+28+35) days, the lunar season and the solar season are the same length; each season is thus three solar months and three lunar months. The moon's phases are thus identical in each day of each season.
This grants a pleasing regularity that is easy to track, while offering a semblance of "real world" calendars where solar and lunar months are slightly different and so on. A "month" can refer to a lunar month or solar month in easy conversation, and so on. Culturally the sungod-worshipping Aurans use the solar calendar and build their religious festivities around it, while the Chthonic worshippers use the lunar calendar, which is also tied to the zodiac signs.
==
I'm really impressed by the awesome anthropic measurements... In particular I love the idea that the pound is based on a pint of water, while a pint is based on a mug based on a human hand size, and so on. Awesome.
I use meters to measure distance, as the Speed stat measures how many meters per second you can go. This leads to some weird things if you have a certain number of actions per round; characters with more actions can move less distance per action, as how many meters per action you can move is equal to your Speed divided by your actions per round. I've found this works really well with the type of game I'm trying to make.
Coins in my RPG were 10 copper to 1 silver, with each copper about the size of a penny and a silver the size of a nickel, and 10 silver making 1 gold which was about the size of a quarter. I did this mainly so I'd have easy examples on hand if anyone asked how much x amount of coins takes up. (1000 copper will completely fill a standard pasta sauce jar, 100 silver fills an asprin bottle.)
The names varied from kingdom to kingdom.
Distances were noted in days travel on foot. Which was generally around 20 miles. So some nearby ruins might be half a days travel, a farm on the outskirts of town might be stated as a fourths travel.
A day was 25 hours long and a year was 400 days long. 10 months of 40 days each and comprised of four 10-day long weeks. This works because the planet and moon are in no way natural systems in the normal sense.
Thanks to playing through early modules, I have instilled in my players a hatred for the electrum piece. LOL.
Soo, for my Planetary Romance game, should I make up totally new measure units? What about money? I don't think Gold Pieces sound very Venusian if you ask me.
Ditto for the measurements. Of course it could mainly be just renamed units to take advantage of familiarity but still.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on November 29, 2021, 08:41:58 PM
Soo, for my Planetary Romance game, should I make up totally new measure units? What about money? I don't think Gold Pieces sound very Venusian if you ask me.
Ditto for the measurements. Of course it could mainly be just renamed units to take advantage of familiarity but still.
Thus far:
Funnie = Copper Coin
Granni = Silver Coin
Tari = Gold Coin
Oncia = Platinum Coin
Bit = Inch
Palm = 1/2Foot
Pace = Yard
Passum = Mile
Almud = Pint
Adarme = Pound
-o-
Cot = Inch
Palme = 1/2Foot
Picior = Foot
Pasm = Yard
Passum = Mile
Area
Fere
Falce = 1 Passum Sqr
Oca = Pint
Potte = 1/2 Banita
Banita = Quarter
Kwarter – Quarter
Obroc = 22 Banita
Mare = 2 Obroc, 44 Banita
Merta = 120 Banita
Dram = Ounce
Font = Pound
Gium = 1,000 Font
Hadra = 2,000 Font
Quote from: Mishihari on October 08, 2021, 01:03:01 AM
I've found that messing with the calendar is more trouble than it's worth. For one world I did 6 days per week, 6 weeks per month, 10 months per year, and 4 extra days on the solstices and equinoxes. It's nice for color, but always caused confusion in conversation; never could remember if we were talking real-world weeks and months or in-game calendar terms.
+1
I read a book series where early-on it mentioned that there were 12 months and each month was 35 days. So each year was 420 days - about 15% longer than Earth's.
I kept getting confused about ages of characters and thought it was just doing the thing some novels do where all of the characters are younger than they should be to appeal to a younger audience. Then someone on a book review mentioned that they're REALLY all 2-3 years older. (They were still pretty young - but not ridiculously so.)
It was especially weird because I don't remember the books themselves ever bringing it up again.
IMO - unless you have a really good reason, stick with the same calendar. (A good reason could be that it's sci-fi on an obviously different planet than Earth. Though if the characters are human, they'll probably just keep using Earth's calendar for most things anyway.)
Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 29, 2021, 01:37:32 PM
Thanks to playing through early modules, I have instilled in my players a hatred for the electrum piece. LOL.
heh. We dropped the electrum piece faster than TSR did.
Quote from: Omega on November 30, 2021, 12:20:25 PM
Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 29, 2021, 01:37:32 PM
Thanks to playing through early modules, I have instilled in my players a hatred for the electrum piece. LOL.
heh. We dropped the electrum piece faster than TSR did.
I had a discussion with a fellow gamer last night, and the really interesting question is why platinum is more valued than gold.
Keep in mind that platinum was originally considered 'immature' or 'impure' silver. The Spanish actually dumped their stocks in 1735 because people were counterfeiting their coins with the stuff (the irony did not escape me, especially as platinum is pretty pricey nowadays -- US$1055 per troy ounce, versus gold's US$1320 per troy ounce). But that's because platinum has a number of modern day uses. Why would it be considered valuable in a fantasy setting?
From Wikipedia: 'The most common use of platinum is as a catalyst in chemical reactions, often as platinum black. It has been employed as a catalyst since the early 19th century, when platinum powder was used to catalyze the ignition of hydrogen. Its most important application is in automobiles as a catalytic converter, which allows the complete combustion of low concentrations of unburned hydrocarbons from the exhaust into carbon dioxide and water vapor. Platinum is also used in the petroleum industry as a catalyst in a number of separate processes, but especially in catalytic reforming of straight-run naphthas into higher-octane gasoline that becomes rich in aromatic compounds. PtO2, also known as Adams' catalyst, is used as a hydrogenation catalyst, specifically for vegetable oils. Platinum also strongly catalyzes the decomposition of hydrogen peroxide into water and oxygen and it is used in fuel cells as a catalyst for the reduction of oxygen.'
Now, this is all highfalutin' industrial revolution and forward tech. But it gives me the idea: platinum is heavily used in alchemy and magical workings. Potion reagents are best distilled and purified using platinum vessels, or perhaps platinum makes an excellent material for permanent protective circles and wards. That would explain its higher value in a fantasy setting.
I generally say that Platinum coins are old Elvish coins, and Elf stuff is cool, right? ;D
If it were up to me I'd only have gold and silver, copper was rarely used for coins until quite recently.
Quote from: S'mon on November 30, 2021, 01:44:43 PM
I generally say that Platinum coins are old Elvish coins, and Elf stuff is cool, right? ;D
If it were up to me I'd only have gold and silver, copper was rarely used for coins until quite recently.
Not necessarily. Copper was used in Roman currency (though hardly pure; it was either alloyed into brass or a nickel-lead mixture).
Honestly, using copper as a minor coin doesn't make a lot of sense either as it's more useful in cooking and surgical utensils, or alloyed to make bronze or brass. Hmm.
Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 30, 2021, 02:07:53 PM
Not necessarily. Copper was used in Roman currency (though hardly pure; it was either alloyed into brass or a nickel-lead mixture).
True, not in the Middle Ages though.
Things don't have to be useful to be valuable. Gold is too soft to be of much use in most things. Until it started to be used in electronics and dentistry it was valued just because it's pretty.
I decided to use mithril instead of platinum as the next coin up, with the idea that "mithril" is magically treated platinum. What's used in a coin is not fully treated, thus it's only worth about 10x a gold coin. But given enough additional magic and coins in bulk, you could turn them into a mithril weapon or even armor.
Since I also have iron affecting magic use for most characters, having "silvered" equipment as a stand-in and mithril as the long-term solution, fits the setting.
Quote from: GeekyBugle on November 29, 2021, 09:27:28 PM
Thus far:
Funnie = Copper Coin
Granni = Silver Coin
Tari = Gold Coin
Oncia = Platinum Coin
Would an Electrum Coin = a Tranni?
Quote from: Steven Mitchell on November 30, 2021, 09:15:36 PM
I decided to use mithril instead of platinum as the next coin up, with the idea that "mithril" is magically treated platinum. What's used in a coin is not fully treated, thus it's only worth about 10x a gold coin. But given enough additional magic and coins in bulk, you could turn them into a mithril weapon or even armor.
Since I also have iron affecting magic use for most characters, having "silvered" equipment as a stand-in and mithril as the long-term solution, fits the setting.
Platinum is quite heavy and mithril is supposed to lighter than steel. It would almost make more sense for mithril to be enchanted aluminum or titanium.
Quote from: Shasarak on November 30, 2021, 09:17:46 PM
Quote from: GeekyBugle on November 29, 2021, 09:27:28 PM
Thus far:
Funnie = Copper Coin
Granni = Silver Coin
Tari = Gold Coin
Oncia = Platinum Coin
Would an Electrum Coin = a Tranni?
LOL, no, electrum doesn't exist in Venus, the equivalences will be there just to facilitate the use, and you might choose to stick with what you know.
I played around with some odd coinage ideas like Tin or Brass coins as those metals have been in use a long long time. And Aluminum or even Titanium as coins.
At a playtesters suggestion I also tinkered with gems as a monetary type. Someone else suggested wooden coins.
Quote from: Omega on December 01, 2021, 08:36:31 AM
I played around with some odd coinage ideas like Tin or Brass coins as those metals have been in use a long long time. And Aluminum or even Titanium as coins.
At a playtesters suggestion I also tinkered with gems as a monetary type. Someone else suggested wooden coins.
The problem with using aluminum or titanium is that they're a stone bitch to refine in a fantasy setting, outside of using magic. It wasn't until the advent of the Hall–Héroult process in 1886 that refining aluminum became (relatively) easier.
Suddenly Dragonlance's steel coinage looks downright normal by comparison. :D
I'd count that as a plus. If a government is the only one that the method to refine the metals used in coins, then they're very difficult to counterfeit.
Quote from: Mishihari on December 01, 2021, 02:23:50 PM
I'd count that as a plus. If a government is the only one that the method to refine the metals used in coins, then they're very difficult to counterfeit.
If the value of the coin is based purely on the metal (as opposed to modern fiat currency) then that's largely moot. The empire doesn't care if people make "fake" gold coins so long as they're actually gold.
Historically the issue with counter-fitting would be someone making a coin only partly gold. Such as an alloy or plated - or just a hair smaller.
Heck, the reason that many coins (in the US - quarters & dimes) have the serrated edge is tradition from when it was used to prevent 'clipping' where people would cut off a tiny piece of a silver or gold coin. They would spend it normally at full value and then still have a tiny slice of silver or gold.
Platinum would probably be a poor coin due to how close it looks to silver. You can tell with a bit of examination, but do you want to have to examine each coin closely to be sure? And if platinum is so valuable, many wouldn't have ever seen it before and think you're trying to BS them with silver.
You would want all of your coinage metal to both look distinct from each-other and not have any other cheaper metals which look too similar.
Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 01, 2021, 09:06:22 AM
Quote from: Omega on December 01, 2021, 08:36:31 AM
I played around with some odd coinage ideas like Tin or Brass coins as those metals have been in use a long long time. And Aluminum or even Titanium as coins.
At a playtesters suggestion I also tinkered with gems as a monetary type. Someone else suggested wooden coins.
The problem with using aluminum or titanium is that they're a stone bitch to refine in a fantasy setting, outside of using magic. It wasn't until the advent of the Hall–Héroult process in 1886 that refining aluminum became (relatively) easier.
Suddenly Dragonlance's steel coinage looks downright normal by comparison. :D
They could possibly use Uranium Elementals as power sources.
Quote from: Mishihari on December 01, 2021, 02:23:50 PM
I'd count that as a plus. If a government is the only one that the method to refine the metals used in coins, then they're very difficult to counterfeit.
That's a good point, actually. Coins made from a process and material that can't easily be duplicated would be very useful as a currency.
Quote from: Shasarak on December 01, 2021, 03:04:20 PM
Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 01, 2021, 09:06:22 AM
Quote from: Omega on December 01, 2021, 08:36:31 AM
I played around with some odd coinage ideas like Tin or Brass coins as those metals have been in use a long long time. And Aluminum or even Titanium as coins.
At a playtesters suggestion I also tinkered with gems as a monetary type. Someone else suggested wooden coins.
The problem with using aluminum or titanium is that they're a stone bitch to refine in a fantasy setting, outside of using magic. It wasn't until the advent of the Hall–Héroult process in 1886 that refining aluminum became (relatively) easier.
Suddenly Dragonlance's steel coinage looks downright normal by comparison. :D
They could possibly use Uranium Elementals as power sources.
Very distasteful. Do you not know the classical elements are classics for a reason? :D
Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 01, 2021, 03:36:24 PM
Quote from: Mishihari on December 01, 2021, 02:23:50 PM
I'd count that as a plus. If a government is the only one that the method to refine the metals used in coins, then they're very difficult to counterfeit.
That's a good point, actually. Coins made from a process and material that can't easily be duplicated would be very useful as a currency.
Only for someone who's worldview is distorted by living in a world of fiat currency.
Historically, the value of gold was based on weight and purity, not whose head was stamped on a disc. That's the virtue of commodity money, and why it makes sense to measure gold coins in fantasy games by weight. If you have a chest full of 10 pounds of gold, that tells you everything you need to know about how much treasure you have. The type of coin and even the count just becomes flavor.
The main reason why some coins were preferred over others in the past was trust. If the country who minted a particular coin put in protections like ridges to make filing or other cheats obvious, was known for not debasing their coins (diluting the gold with some less valuable metal), and aggressively went after counterfeiters, a random merchant was more likely to accept the coin because it was a safe bet that the coin was was worth its face value. Otherwise, merchants would have to test the purity, check to see if the coins were just plated, weigh them, and so on. From a game standpoint, you could roll to see if a batch of coins were debased, plated, or whatever; and then have another roll to appraise their true value. Certain well regarded types of coin would be highly reliable, while others would be more suspect, and unknown coins would be unknowns until verified.