Alnag: The same ROPGs are considerd today... just entertaiment, and sometimes ritual but mostly entertaiment... good musicians were good entertainers, not artists...

Just look at all that what is called art today, for example dadaism... is it considerd art...? Yes... Would most people consider it to be fun...? Hell no!

Quote from: FritzsAlnag: The same ROPGs are considerd today... just entertaiment, and sometimes ritual but mostly entertaiment... good musicians were good entertainers, not artists...

Sure, there is this appeal on attention in both game and art (the one, that we can call entertaining), yet that does not eliminate artistic aspect of music.

Quote from: FritzsJust look at all that what is called art today, for example dadaism... is it considerd art...? Yes... Would most people consider it to be fun...? Hell no!

Well the whole western art is not a very good example of vast majority of artistic products, but I see some nice analogy between traditional arts and traditional RPGs on one hand and Forge dadaistic games and dadaism on the other one. Guess what? Most people would not consider neither Forge game nor dadaism product very entertaining.

Alnaq, I can't help but note (and with a certain irony) that you're posting to this thread trying to convince others that Forge games suck.

So, on topic, why do you feel the need to try to convince others that games suck?

Quote from: BalbinusSo, on topic, why do you feel the need to try to convince others that games suck?

Actually, I feel urgent need to tease Fritzs, if that counts...

Despite the fact, it might sounds like I think that I think (or trying to convice other people that Forge games sucks) it is not like that. I think that some games are less entertaining for majority of gamers as dadaist art might be less entertaining for most people. Does that mean that dadaist art sucks? Hardly.

That does not mean, that one doesn't have any preference at all. I know exactly that I like A more than B and usually I know even why is that so. That fact does not make B sucks, but it makes A shine.

Quote from: AlnagAcutally, I feel urgent need to tease Fritzs, if that counts...

I feel strong urge to call you moron everytime I see your avatar...

And you should tell people around there about your great little theory about FORGE games causing break up in "infested" gaming groups:rolleyes:

Quote from: FritzsAnd you should tell people around there about your great little theory about FORGE games causing break up in "infested" gaming groups:rolleyes:

Sure why not. I have a theory about those laser-focused games that are sometimes called "Forge games" or "indies". They don't cater well the preferences of mixed group of player types. So once such mixed gaming group (which I thing is most prevalent) starts playing such a game they might be fun for one or two and really boring for the rest because of its one single focus. IMO in most cases they don't facilitate the group cohesion very well.

So to put it simply, the groups that are less socialy tied or in some kind of bad shape anyway (which is why they usually try new system anyway) has significantly bigger chance to break. This I believe is one of the reasons why spreading of indies is so slow.

Now Fritzs might want to imply, that means that those games sucks. Yet I don't think so. I think, that when your game group fall apart, that sucks. That really sucks. I think that some games create more tension, more argument and more friction which contributes to possible group breakage. If that means that those games sucks as well I am not sure, but whatever.

I should add that Fritzs and buch of other group-less wanderers don't like my theory.

Alnag: And where did you get the idea I amj group-less...? Well  If you assume only people who play mere and once per week to be group-haves, then I am indeed group-less...

Quote from: BalbinusAlnaq, I can't help but note (and with a certain irony) that you're posting to this thread trying to convince others that Forge games suck.

I think it's more because he wants to give his Forger rival Fritzs some stick.

Quote from: FritzsAlnag: And where did you get the idea I amj group-less...? Well  If you assume only people who play mere and once per week to be group-haves, then I am indeed group-less...

It's more about if you stick with the same people rather than frequency. I can imagine that one plays every and each day with someone yet is group-less because the structure of the people he plays with changes (significantly).

damn double post

Alnag: I am playing with the same people weekly...

Quote from: grubmanUnrelated to any specific game...

I mean seriously...I understand trying to convince people that games you like are great!  But, why try to convince people that like, love, or are at least open minded that a game sucks...and they have no reason to like it (or are at least stupid or inferior for not thinking it sucks)?

We see it over and over on the internet.  What is there to be gained in this action?

A related post:  http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/LRPGSW/message/1716

Quote from: SaphimI know that this right now looks like I called you on your "experience" and you are responding with nothing but nasty words. Which probably means you were lying or exaggerating your "experience".

I really care very little how this looks to you, but I can tell you that I reacted like a hotheaded asshole (which I am) to you being a smug and condescending prick (I'll let your posts along those lines speak for themselves), especially to someone who's been such a positive and useful contributor to this site as Koltar.