Do you ever make your players do these things?  Or do you find it too much of a hassle?

yeah you have to go out of your way to get the parts

i would do the same for all components if prices were given for the minor ones as it is i dont have the skill to assign those prices

The current Save or Die podcast is about RPG magic and has a brief discussion of spell components. They seemed to think those rules are just there so a GM can grief magic user PCs but I disagree, the source literature is full of witches and wizards collecting odd things to work magic.
Wampler mentions some Player who used to always harvest parts from monsters they'd killed and how it annoyed him... but to me that's atmospheric stuff.

As a Player I'd like it to happen more... it seems the sort of flavorful complication that can lead to adventures.
Even simple stuff like needing to find a spider to cast Spiderclimb.
Maybe not every time... but I'd like to see some use of the component lists rather than just handwaving it all away.
Maybe a something like the rules I've seen for randomly checking if a torch goes out to see if casting a spell uses up the last of the stash.

No.  My longstanding and rock solid prejudice is that game balance through RP or IC factors is difficult at best.  If magic spells are "too powerful," then weaken them.  If powerful spells are "too easy" to cast, make them harder to acquire or weaken them in effect.  "You need a rare mountain opal of X value in order to cast Shataar's Impressive Tumescence" is bullshit.

Seriously, how many games require this level of hoop-jumping from non-spellcasters?  Are fighters, say, restricted only to weapons they've forged themselves, using uncommon materials?  "Sorry, in order to get your 10th level fighting bonus, you need to personally reforge your sword using steel refined by the Ilkorendi elves, and embed a pommel gem of at least 250 sovereigns' value."

If that's indeed the case, then sure: make the spellcasters jump through hoops too.

to be fair there is the implicit assumption that the fighter has to source his own dead dragon for dragonhide armor

and i dont really see it as a balence thing more an imersion thing

Quote from: tuypo1;826086to be fair there is the implicit assumption that the fighter has to source his own dead dragon for dragonhide armor

Except that this happens much more rarely, in my experience.

I think that the potential problem is that it means an entire party often ends up having to focus its choices around whatever thing the Magic-User needs to do next.  It makes everyone else his support-staff in gaining power.

that is an understandable concern

im quite surprised to hear that sourcing your own dragonhide is rare i tend to have most things easy to obtain but unless theres a war going on in the area with a lot of dragons involved good luck going to the store and buying dragonhide.

Quote from: RPGPundit;826059Do you ever make your players do these things?  Or do you find it too much of a hassle?

Depends.  For most spells I don't bother making the players deal with components unless there's a plot-tacular reason for it.  Fucks with my gameplay flow too much to have the wizard check to see if he remembered bat shit for his fireball.

Now the spells that need a ten thousand gold piece gemstone or whatever...those aren't just sitting around.  You can either find a gemologist dragon and find some way to liberate it from him, or go talk to the Empress, who is going to laugh her ass off when you tell her she won't be getting her mother's favorite ring back.  Or I'll come up with a few other ideas.

I never did before.  I'm considering it on my next foray as DM, but I fear it may annoy the players and unnecessarily nerf the casters.  I do plan, however, on making items save more often against things like crushing blow and fire.  That could end up being an equalizer between casters and fighters.

Quote from: Thornhammer;826480Depends.  For most spells I don't bother making the players deal with components unless there's a plot-tacular reason for it.  Fucks with my gameplay flow too much to have the wizard check to see if he remembered bat shit for his fireball.

Now the spells that need a ten thousand gold piece gemstone or whatever...those aren't just sitting around.  You can either find a gemologist dragon and find some way to liberate it from him, or go talk to the Empress, who is going to laugh her ass off when you tell her she won't be getting her mother's favorite ring back.  Or I'll come up with a few other ideas.

Yeah, pretty much it. The spells with expensive material components aren't supposed to be part of a wizard's off-the-cuff, bread-and-butter repertoire. Requiring a 10,000gp diamond is a check on the spell's usefulness. Whether that's necessary or not is up to the GM.

Quote from: RPGPundit;826059Do you ever make your players do these things?  Or do you find it too much of a hassle?

Tried keeping track of material spell components once.  It was not even remotely worth the effort, and made every session feel like going through a bad garage sale or watching an episode of Hoarders.

Since then, everything is just V, S.  No M.

For my next campaign, the usual, limited list of spells require no material components. However, if a caster wants to invent a new spell or create a magic item, they will have to have some rare and bizarre components on hand.

The magic user collects the pineal gland of a basilisk, a snake from medusa's head, and some wood from a petrified forest. He then gets to work fashioning a staff from the petrified wood, paints it with dye from the pineal gland, and then wraps the dead snake skin around the head. That there is the beginnings of a staff of petrification.

I use them pretty extensively.  But it fits my game and game style.   Now, players can ignore them, because they just affect spell success%.  A mage can just try with a lower chance or pull more power through their conduits to make up for the loss of spell success%.

Higher level spells have truncated spell success to begin with.  So often, the PCs will take the time to make sure they maximize their chance of success.  Also, although 5% of the population can touch the void sources (95% of the population s considered void-blind), and some 10% are taught enough to use it, the ability to use more than cantrips or use artificed items is much more rare, maybe .01%.  But 90% of PCs have some ability to tough the void, so this affects a great many PCs.

Quote from: tuypo1;826086to be fair there is the implicit assumption that the fighter has to source his own dead dragon for dragonhide armor

It seems to me that warriors would be obsessed with training, finding new techniques and trainers... new schools of fighting and talented folks to make their weapons and armor... and the money to fund all of that. Lots of potential for adventures focused on that stuff as well.
IMO it's a lot more interesting to play out finding a source for that new Feat vs. having it beamed straight into your head at the moment you hit the next level.

Quoteand i dont really see it as a balence thing more an imersion thing

Same here... and I think there must be better ways to engage with spell components that keep them as atmosphere and plot hooks and avoid the 'bad garage sale' version... though 'watching an episode of Hoarders' does describe how I'd picture a wizard's lair in some styles of fantasy.
 
As wizards gain power it seems they would create a retinue of agents around themselves to go out and seek new spells (or is having to find/steal/create your spells another thing that's too inconvenient/boring?) and gather spell components... mostly happening in the background unless there's something worthy of the wizard's personal attention.
Bean-counting specific quantities of components does sound dull... but just ignoring them altogether seems like it dumps a lot of fun potential.

I've never used them, but I've thought about including them for bonus purposes only. That is, if you don't use material components then the spell works as is. However, if you gather the needed components then you gain a +10% bonus to the effects or target has a -1 to save or something.