I don't get why this is in Other Games---Fate is no more a storygame than Savage Worlds is imo? :confused:

That said this is a great thread, very informative. Will be following.

Fate does seem to be a truck but a streamlined, efficient, fairly cool truck.

Quote from: Eisenmann;683616Say you're running a modern SF (special forces) game and the players themselves understand even the basics of shoot, move, communicate, fire and maneuver, working corners, the perils of flagging, assault through, far ambush, and so on, you'll have one heck of a game that ticks all of the tactical boxes.

Sprinkle in a few tac-stunts, take some weapon and gear aspects into consideration and you're ready to rock 'n roll.

Do you know of good introductory material to these concepts? Do you have more detailed explanations how you implemented them with FATE?

Quote from: boulet;684058Do you know of good introductory material to these concepts? Do you have more detailed explanations how you implemented them with FATE?

IMO, most small unit books are pretty dense without accompanying field time. The one book that I think that could be handy is:

https://www.thelightningpress.com/smartbooks/the-small-unit-tactics-smartbook/

Something like the movie, Act of Valor is easily more accessible with enough conceptual oomph to drive a game. There are a lot of small details there that you just don't see in a lot of other movies. For example, how many times elsewhere have you seen someone hit the bolt catch after a mag change? Comparing and contrasting the operators of that movie versus pretty much any other sheds a lot of light on the subject.

As far as hooking these things up to FATE goes, allow the players to roll assessments ahead of time when preparing for a mission. Have 'em keep their Fate Points handy to do declarations on the fly and to tag existing scene aspects; things that contribute to concealment and cover or maybe even 'Guard watching TV.' If things are going swell do a compel. Hey, that barred steel door wasn't accounted for in planning.

The last step is to select or create stunts to accentuate individual team member roles. If a character is a squad gunner, he gets a stunt to pin the enemy to enhance his team's ability to maneuver. Beyond pinning the bad guys, any spin gets applied to his team's maneuvering.

I've got more written up but, my notes are currently in storage.

Beyond all of the sexy mil bits, FATE makes for one heck of a teamwork oriented game.

Thanks for the info, much appreciated.

You're not running games on hangout by any chance ?

Quote from: boulet;684113Thanks for the info, much appreciated.

You're not running games on hangout by any chance ?

You're welcome and no problem.

I'm not but, once things settle down here on my end, I might. It'd be fun.

Quote from: Bill;684020Well thing that I have trouble with is a character removing himself from the scenario; forget what it is called.

Dissociated mechanics?  Breaking immersion?  I've heard it called lots of things.

But yes, it happens in Fate.  And the reasons that it happens are pretty key to how Fate works and what it does - it'd be pretty hard to get rid of that without really changing the system.

Quote from: Bill;684020I think I understand the logic of Fate; its a very logical system.

Except for the parts that aren't immediately obvious  Like why using a situation aspect requires either a Create Advantage roll or spending a Fate Point.  Some of the subtleties of the Stress/Consequence system, etc.

Quote from: Bill;684020It's possible I am just reacting to it being different in a few ways from all the other games I have played.

That's common, and what I'm happy to help with, having gone through the same thing.

Quote from: The Ent;684026I don't get why this is in Other Games---Fate is no more a storygame than Savage Worlds is imo? :confused:

I consider it to be more on the "narrative" side than Savage Worlds (I generally reserve "storygame" for things like Primetime Adventures, Fiasco, or the like).  I consider it an RPG, but one centered around "the physics of fiction", if you will.

And there are definitely some mechanics that require author stance.

Given the general dislike of anything even remotely story-gamey, I felt it was safer to stick this here.  I don't want to be one of those posters with an agenda that comes into RPGPundit's living room and shits on the living room floor.  If a mod feels like it should be moved, they can move it - I won't be offended.  But I may make examples of why mechanics using work by talking about things like camera motions and the like - be warned

Quote from: robiswrong;684144But I may make examples of why mechanics using work by talking about things like camera motions and the like - be warned

I wonder what's the equivalent of shaky cam in FATE.

Quote from: Bill;683613So, a question: Do you use Fate RAW? or do you have any house rules?

You pretty much have to have house rules to run Fate. There isn't even any kind of implied setting, and the Stunts rules are just guidelines for making your own Stunts. There's no default magic system. There are no hard rules for non-human races.

Right now, I'm running two different versions of Fate. I'm running my Wandering Stars game, a kind of dieselpulp fantasy space western which has hard-coded "alien" races, classes (via "Skill Modes"), and a sphere-based magic system. The other is Shroompunk, a kind of wuxia urban fantasy conspiracy thriller, which replaces the combat system entirely with something based on Street Fighter RPG; I have no idea how exactly I'm going to handle non-human PCs in that.

Quote from: boulet;684215I wonder what's the equivalent of shaky cam in FATE.

Me violently shaking any player that even suggests such a thing???

Quote from: FaerieGodfather;684243You pretty much have to have house rules to run Fate. There isn't even any kind of implied setting, and the Stunts rules are just guidelines for making your own Stunts. There's no default magic system. There are no hard rules for non-human races.

But those things generally fall within the established mechanics of stunts, skills, and aspects.  I don't consider that so much "houseruling" as using the tools the game gives you.

I mean, defining the skill list for your game is a presumed part of game prep.

If by "houseruling" you mean adding things that aren't prepackaged elements on a list, I'd agree that you have to do that, but I don't really consider it "houseruling" within the context of Fate (though it would be within the context of GURPS).

To me, houseruling in Fate would mean things like changing how Fate Points or aspects work, or the stress/consequence model, etc.

I have little experience with FATE but what I did have I liked very well. My D&D group took a break from the play test and ran a one off steam punk game. It went well enough that I am going to continue it.

So in Fate, if a character is a samarai surrounded by 100 ninjas, and they stab him 900 times, who gets to decide if he is dead, the player or the gm?

As far as I am aware, Fate goes in the main forum. So moving this there.

I like Fate in the way it puts the character (as in his personality and motivations) at the heart of things. A characters Aspects are important, his equipment not so much.

I also like the way Fate encourages and even rewards characters playing up their flaws and deliberately making poor decisions. Fate isn't the only game with rules for disadvantages and character flaws, but it champions this more than most and clearly spells out the screwing up is okay, as long as it's in-character. This is in stark contrast to the gaming ethos where stupid gets you killed.

I'm not to keen on Fate when the Fate point economy becomes the be and end all. For me focusing too much on often Aspects get invoked or compelled and trying to use the economy as the main pace setting mechanism seems to miss out that each game session has a dynamic of its own. Also, is an Aspect are used to frequently and casually they lose their dramatic power and just become another utility mechanic. The latter may be the intended effect, but it's not the way I enjoy it.

Quote from: Bill;687245So in Fate, if a character is a samarai surrounded by 100 ninjas, and they stab him 900 times, who gets to decide if he is dead, the player or the gm?

Technically I think it works like this, bear with me because I tend to get the different versions confused.

If the player is Taken Out (ie runs out of Stress) the GM gets to decide the player's fate. If however the player Concedes before he get's stabbed 900 times then the player get's to decide the terms on which he loses. He still loses the fight and whatever the the fight was about, he just has more control on how the way he loses.

I don't honestly know if technically the GM can state that a Taken Out character is irrevocably dead. But Fate places the responsibility on both player and GM to ensure that what happens the game fiction makes sense. You would expect in a grim samurai game  given the situation you describe that the player would be the first to offer his death as part of his Concession, but perhaps stipulates that his character's body is sent back to his father for burial.

Fate is not the kind of game which assumes a responsible adult GM and unruly children as players. If you have players you can't trust, who try to win at all costs, exploit the rules and generally pay little attention to spirit of the game then you may not want to run Fate for them. I'm not I'd want to run anything at all with that kind of player, but Fate would make things worse.

Quote from: Soylent Green;687268Technically I think it works like this, bear with me because I tend to get the different versions confused.

If the player is Taken Out (ie runs out of Stress) the GM gets to decide the player's fate. If however the player Concedes before he get's stabbed 900 times then the player get's to decide the terms on which he loses. He still loses the fight and whatever the the fight was about, he just has more control on how the way he loses.

I don't honestly know if technically the GM can state that a Taken Out character is irrevocably dead. But Fate places the responsibility on both player and GM to ensure that what happens the game fiction makes sense. You would expect in a grim samurai game  given the situation you describe that the player would be the first to offer his death as part of his Concession, but perhaps stipulates that his character's body is sent back to his father for burial.

Fate is not the kind of game which assumes a responsible adult GM and unruly children as players. If you have players you can't trust, who try to win at all costs, exploit the rules and generally pay little attention to spirit of the game then you may not want to run Fate for them. I'm not I'd want to run anything at all with that kind of player, but Fate would make things worse.

I don't see it as an issue of adult gm child like children.

I see it as an issue of adult opinionated people not agreeing (Congress?)

Do you want a stalemate or a game that proceddes because it is clear who is in charge?

You can always have a vote of no confidence or an impeachment of a gm