This is a site for discussing roleplaying games. Have fun doing so, but there is one major rule: do not discuss political issues that aren't directly and uniquely related to the subject of the thread and about gaming. While this site is dedicated to free speech, the following will not be tolerated: devolving a thread into unrelated political discussion, sockpuppeting (using multiple and/or bogus accounts), disrupting topics without contributing to them, and posting images that could get someone fired in the workplace (an external link is OK, but clearly mark it as Not Safe For Work, or NSFW). If you receive a warning, please take it seriously and either move on to another topic or steer the discussion back to its original RPG-related theme.

Author Topic: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll  (Read 2661 times)

Chris24601

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • C
  • Posts: 3326
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #15 on: July 22, 2021, 10:29:46 AM »
Marchand,  I agree with the bulk of your statements.  Having played for almost 40 years now, I want simpler systems.  Thirty years ago, I wrote a very crunchy system based on d12 dice pools.  d12 is the ultimate die in my view - and you could give more subtle bonuses with a more fine number spread.  It's all we played for 4-5 years.  We loved it.

I don't know if it is a function of age or time to spend learning rules balance by family time, but I find that I don't have the patience for crunchy systems anymore.  I have a great appreciation for all the effort that goes into crafting a workable system, considering possibilities, play testing, more tweaking, etc.  As I build my rules light system, I am curious what people on this forum think.  Sometimes these ideas spark a creativity thread that might otherwise not have gotten started.
Out of curiosity, is this rules lite system you're working on for home games or something you plan on releasing professionally?

Vic99

  • Old Guy That Still Games
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 302
    • Wicked Cool Games FB page
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2021, 11:09:56 PM »
Chris24601,  I'm going to play test it with my group, then run it with my kids.  May do some more play testing and rewriting after that.  I'd like to publish it after that if it seems reasonable.

Marchand

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • M
  • Posts: 304
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2021, 04:11:06 AM »
I'm going to play test it with my group, then run it with my kids.  May do some more play testing and rewriting after that.  I'd like to publish it after that if it seems reasonable.

Good luck with it Vic99, it certainly seems like you are going about in in a very thoughtful way. Look forward to hearing more about it as you make progress.
"If the English surrender, it'll be a long war!"
- Scottish soldier on the beach at Dunkirk

Vic99

  • Old Guy That Still Games
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 302
    • Wicked Cool Games FB page
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2021, 08:13:35 AM »
Thanks, Marchand.  It's fun.  I've been learning about many other games and their mechanics in the process - some really creative ideas.

I initially wanted to do a you tube channel about how to GM better - but I'm too late to the party.  So, many people out there already - some of it really solid content that's already been covered.  However, this gave me some ideas about modifying the games that I already run.  I've always tinkered with systems, but have been limited in my perspective.

One thing I have noticed, is that it is tough to find videos that give really good ideas on how to write your own game.  I'm not a complete novice, but am looking for more inspiration.
 
When writing the system, I'm trying to create a balance between breadth & depth of rules with something that doesn't get completely out of control.  At times it's a bit daunting.  However, this is one of my favorite types of writing and I'm glad I'm back at it.  Will be posting more threads here that will try to get people's opinion.  Perhaps I'll be able to link to it when it's finished or close - depending on the forum rules.

Torque2100

  • Cyberpunk Catgirls FTW
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • T
  • Posts: 116
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #19 on: July 23, 2021, 09:53:33 AM »
It really does depend on what overall "feel" the designer is going for.  Generally for darker settings I like more detailed combat with nasty critical hit results.

However, getting your character's hand chopped off in the first round of combat is not always fun and overly-detailed combat can really bog things down.

Something that I really like in a combat system is dynamism.  I really like systems that have lots of options for attack and defense. It really helps take some of the pressure off of the DM having to keep "you whack the Orc with your Longsword for d8 damage" interesting after the umpteen dozenth time.

One of my favorite Fantasy combat systems in recent memory is the R. Talsorian Witcher RPG.  The various defensive options to Parry, Block, Dodge and Reposition really do add a lot to the system resulting in very dynamic combat.  Yes tracking endurance can get rather crunchy but I like it.

I am hoping to run Forbidden Lands soon.  That has a similar system with Slash and Stab attacks having different modifiers for parrying or dodging.


estar

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10065
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #20 on: July 23, 2021, 02:00:13 PM »
Designing a game system and curious about what there is appetite for among this crowd.  Comments would be helpful.  Thanks!
I think you should aim to be authentic. Explain clearly why you do what you do and only include what you actually have used and played.  Keep it as terse as possible.

Your challenge is not the design of the system but explaining in a way that somebody else can learn it. In the first couple of draft of my Majestic Fantasy Rules, I read some section out loud as I was trying to teach it. And some of it made me wince and think "Well wording that way isn't going to work".

Even now with my published Basic Rules heavily edited, I found a handful of sections where I wasn't complete in my explanation, or omitted something* because it was so second nature to how I run my campaign.

*Like how I award XP.  :(

As for how popular it will be, as long as you are authentic, friendly and diligent, you will get a get at least a small audience. Beyond that is so random that the best you can do is to have a plan if it happens but don't count on it.

But with the cost of today technology and the way we distribute things now, you don't need a particularly large audience to do a nice project or to get a reasonable return (in downloads or sales) for your time.

« Last Edit: July 23, 2021, 02:07:40 PM by estar »

BoxCrayonTales

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • B
  • Posts: 3313
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #21 on: July 23, 2021, 03:09:41 PM »
What about abstracted one-roll attacks instead of separate to-hit and damage?

Jaeger

  • That someone better.
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1536
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #22 on: July 23, 2021, 06:09:21 PM »
It's true that past a certain point too much crunch will alienate some of the audience. However, to me a bigger factor is how well the complexity is selected and how it fits into the other complexity of the game.  Crunch that "fits" is easier for people to retain. 
...

For me complexity has to justify itself in actual play at the table.

It needs to justify itself by offering something beneficial to the system so that the players will want to engage in it during play.

When adding on 'critical hits' or hit locations, or "socail combat"; the players should see the benefits of using those systems in play right away, so that they willingly want to obtain rules mastery of those bits to benefit their PC.

If after a few session the players are still having to ask the GM how things work, then that means that those system bits, are uninteresting and are only slowing down your play.

One needs to be ruthless in culling and streamlining system bits if they do not meet expectations in actual play at the table.



...
When writing the system, I'm trying to create a balance between breadth & depth of rules with something that doesn't get completely out of control.  At times it's a bit daunting.  However, this is one of my favorite types of writing and I'm glad I'm back at it.  Will be posting more threads here that will try to get people's opinion.  Perhaps I'll be able to link to it when it's finished or close - depending on the forum rules.

If I may ask what dice system are you using?

Because the die mechanic does dictate how 'easy' some complex systems are to integrate in a game system than others.

"The envious are not satisfied with equality; they secretly yearn for superiority and revenge."

Vic99

  • Old Guy That Still Games
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 302
    • Wicked Cool Games FB page
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2021, 10:52:08 PM »
Jaeger, right now going with a version of d20.  I have a few variations on it which I'm still playing around with and will hopefully play test soon.  As I've said, trying to minimize rules, but also don't want to minimize so much as to be too narrative either.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2021, 10:56:48 PM by Vic99 »

Mishihari

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • M
  • Posts: 989
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2021, 02:24:59 AM »
I voted #1 but my preference is really somewhere between #1 and #2.  I don't want to play Squad Leader, but the simplistic systems in #2 and below bore me.

Trond

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2743
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #25 on: July 25, 2021, 05:22:37 AM »
I think my favorite system for general use is the one found in Stormbringer 5th ed, and also if you pick the same option in the BRP system. It has to hit percentage rolls, parry rolls, and a relatively simple critical hit table. I have to admit it's been a good while since last time I used it though.

SHARK

  • The Great Shark Hope
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5048
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #26 on: July 25, 2021, 10:39:06 AM »
I voted #1 but my preference is really somewhere between #1 and #2.  I don't want to play Squad Leader, but the simplistic systems in #2 and below bore me.

Greetings!

SQUAD LEADER FOREVER, BRO! ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

Trond

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2743
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #27 on: July 25, 2021, 12:00:24 PM »
I voted #1 but my preference is really somewhere between #1 and #2.  I don't want to play Squad Leader, but the simplistic systems in #2 and below bore me.

Greetings!

SQUAD LEADER FOREVER, BRO! ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Something tells me that you might like Phoenix Command :D

SHARK

  • The Great Shark Hope
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5048
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #28 on: July 25, 2021, 01:09:02 PM »
I voted #1 but my preference is really somewhere between #1 and #2.  I don't want to play Squad Leader, but the simplistic systems in #2 and below bore me.

Greetings!

SQUAD LEADER FOREVER, BRO! ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Something tells me that you might like Phoenix Command :D

Greetings!

*Laughing* Hey there, Trond!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

oggsmash

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4009
Re: Fantasy RPG Combat Preferences Poll
« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2021, 03:50:01 PM »
I think my favorite system for general use is the one found in Stormbringer 5th ed, and also if you pick the same option in the BRP system. It has to hit percentage rolls, parry rolls, and a relatively simple critical hit table. I have to admit it's been a good while since last time I used it though.

   Mythras is the modern cleaned up and modified version of this isn't it?  It has been a long time since I cracked open by Stormbringer book, but I recognized a great deal of the nature of combat from Stormbringer.  I think strike ranks was the big thing I noticed as missing.  Other than that it seemed almost exactly the same (I do not remember all the special effects from specific combat styles being in Stormbringer though). 

    Mythras and Stormbringer were very similar to GURPS for me (different dice, but the back and forth of combat and armor, etc).  For me these sorts of systems begin to bog down with around 4 players.   Do you find that to be the case?   I find 4+ players and Savage Worlds, DCC, and similarly lighter games go a good deal faster for me when a big fight with skilled enemies breaks out.