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Pen & Paper Roleplaying Central => Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion => Topic started by: Ratman_tf on June 06, 2021, 10:18:08 PM

Title: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 06, 2021, 10:18:08 PM
https://dragonflight.org/covid-19-statement/?fbclid=IwAR1Jl9eeNU7nLasKtBJDvpJr-UuPpnGg7Ztt9Evt9D1nju3rYkxRxa-zXuc

With exception for those with a medical excuse.

I hadn't planned on attending any conventions this year due to just this. I'll probably have to skip any X-Wing miniatures events being held at a convention that requires vaccinations.

*Edit* Ok, I can't edit the title. They do accept the Johnson and Johnson vaccination, which is not an mRNA vaccine.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: FingerRod on June 06, 2021, 10:24:06 PM
https://dragonflight.org/covid-19-statement/?fbclid=IwAR1Jl9eeNU7nLasKtBJDvpJr-UuPpnGg7Ztt9Evt9D1nju3rYkxRxa-zXuc

With exception for those with a medical excuse.

I hadn't planned on attending any conventions this year due to just this. I'll probably have to skip any X-Wing miniatures events being held at a convention that requires vaccinations.

Did you read your own link?

“Definition of fully vaccinated: Event attendees vaccinated against COVID-19 by a two-dose mRNA vaccine (such as Moderna and Pfizer), or a single dose vaccine (such as Johnson & Johnson), are considered “fully vaccinated” two weeks after the final dose of vaccine (the second dose for a two-dose regimen, or the single dose for a single-dose regimen).”

Requiring any vaccine for a con is dumb, but it is certainly up to those who organize the event to decide. There is always next year I suppose...
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 06, 2021, 10:42:46 PM
"Even with proof of a negative COVID-19 test all unvaccinated attendees must wear masks while attending the convention."

In other words, kids and those with medical conditions are allowed, but required to wear a scarlet letter.

But it's Puritan Boston I mean Progressive Seattle, what do you expect?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 06, 2021, 10:44:16 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Zelen on June 06, 2021, 10:56:45 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

Worth bitching about to con organizers I think. This type of thing is really going to split society.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: HappyDaze on June 06, 2021, 11:07:50 PM
Requiring any vaccine for a con is dumb, but it is certainly up to those who organize the event to decide. There is always next year I suppose...
Their statement says that they are taking their lead from the state (WA) and hosting hotel restrictions. It also says that these requirements may change as the date gets closer, likely to follow any changes in the state's or hosting hotel's requirements.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 06, 2021, 11:16:22 PM
https://dragonflight.org/covid-19-statement/?fbclid=IwAR1Jl9eeNU7nLasKtBJDvpJr-UuPpnGg7Ztt9Evt9D1nju3rYkxRxa-zXuc

With exception for those with a medical excuse.

I hadn't planned on attending any conventions this year due to just this. I'll probably have to skip any X-Wing miniatures events being held at a convention that requires vaccinations.

Did you read your own link?

Did you read my edit?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Charon's Little Helper on June 06, 2021, 11:22:34 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 06, 2021, 11:30:15 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.

It's got nothing to do with being anti-vaxx. I don't want to take these experimental vaccines until they have full FDA approval and are not protected by the PREP act.
The government and corporations should take their fair share of responsibility for experimental vaccinations.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Eirikrautha on June 06, 2021, 11:31:25 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.
What business is it of a con whether I've been vaccinated (for the record I have.  My work required it, so I got the J&J)?  Do they check for other medical conditions?  Chicken pox, tuberculosis, legionnaires disease, AIDS?  There are literally hundreds of contagious diseases with higher mortality rates, but this one justifies you prying into my medical records?  I want to see your bank records to make sure you haven't spent money on anything that my be socially destructive.  Oh, and I get to define what that is.  Fuck off with that noise!
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 06, 2021, 11:41:31 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.
All evidence suggests that a natural immune response is at least as effective as a vaccination. This has been known for months.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33408181/

Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Charon's Little Helper on June 06, 2021, 11:45:28 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.

It's got nothing to do with being anti-vaxx. I don't want to take these experimental vaccines until they have full FDA approval and are not protected by the PREP act.
The government and corporations should take their fair share of responsibility for experimental vaccinations.

Okay - you do you. But if everyone did that - we'd be having another 600k COVID deaths in the next year or two. Yay! Hopefully we reach herd immunity without you.

This particular MRNA vaccine hasn't been fully tested - but MRNA vaccines are a known factor - and there should likely be a permanent expedited approval process for them.

Anywho - I'll bow out here I guess. Not really gaming related at this point.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 06, 2021, 11:50:20 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.

It's got nothing to do with being anti-vaxx. I don't want to take these experimental vaccines until they have full FDA approval and are not protected by the PREP act.
The government and corporations should take their fair share of responsibility for experimental vaccinations.

Okay - you do you. But if everyone did that - we'd be having another 600k COVID deaths in the next year or two. Yay!

This particular MRNA vaccine hasn't been fully tested - but MRNA vaccines are a known factor - and there should likely be a permanent expedited approval process for them.

Anywho - I'll bow out here I guess. Not really gaming related at this point.

Nice derail and bail. I directly answered your question as it was relevant to the discussion. You're the one who wants to make it about the vaccinations themselves and not gaming.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 07, 2021, 08:22:01 AM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.

It's got nothing to do with being anti-vaxx. I don't want to take these experimental vaccines until they have full FDA approval and are not protected by the PREP act.
The government and corporations should take their fair share of responsibility for experimental vaccinations.

Okay - you do you. But if everyone did that - we'd be having another 600k COVID deaths in the next year or two. Yay! Hopefully we reach herd immunity without you.

This particular MRNA vaccine hasn't been fully tested - but MRNA vaccines are a known factor - and there should likely be a permanent expedited approval process for them.

Anywho - I'll bow out here I guess. Not really gaming related at this point.
It's not like the convention's being run by Andrew Cuomo.

Incidentially, it seems DragonCon has taken a less obnoxious tack:

"Additionally, under Georgia law, there is no liability for an injury or death of an individual on or off the premises of one of the Convention hotels or Dragon Con venues if such injury or death results from the inherent risks of contracting COVID-19. By attending Dragon Con, you accept that you are assuming the risk by entering the premises and participating in Dragon Con activities. You also acknowledge that there is a risk of injury or death from Covid-19 that you may contract during your travel to or from the Convention or any Dragon Con venues. You accept the risk of contracting Covid-19 or transmitting Covid-19 to others as a result of travel to or from the Convention or any Dragon Con venue."
(from the DragonCon policy section, https://www.dragoncon.org/about/dragon-con-policies/ )

See you in Atlanta! :D
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Hakdov on June 07, 2021, 09:16:25 AM
They should be requiring obese gamers to prove they are on a diet.  Diabetes and heart disease are a far greater risk than covid to the majority of the gaming community. 

Or maybe they should inspect everyone's armpits before entering to make sure that they have bathed and put on deodorant before entering.   ;)
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 07, 2021, 10:17:44 AM
They should be requiring obese gamers to prove they are on a diet.  Diabetes and heart disease are a far greater risk than covid to the majority of the gaming community. 

Or maybe they should inspect everyone's armpits before entering to make sure that they have bathed and put on deodorant before entering.   ;)
A lot of conventions actually do require you to practice basic hygiene, upon pain of expulsion or worse, being bodily carried off and thrown into a hotel swimming pool.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 07, 2021, 10:24:22 AM
They should be requiring obese gamers to prove they are on a diet.  Diabetes and heart disease are a far greater risk than covid to the majority of the gaming community. 

Or maybe they should inspect everyone's armpits before entering to make sure that they have bathed and put on deodorant before entering.   ;)
A lot of conventions actually do require you to practice basic hygiene, upon pain of expulsion or worse, being bodily carried off and thrown into a hotel swimming pool.

   I went to Gen Con back in 2016, I have to say if they have a requirement along those lines, I sure as hell would not want to be there if they didnt have a requirement, because I felt surrounded by catpiss men.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: HappyDaze on June 07, 2021, 10:25:33 AM
They should be requiring obese gamers to prove they are on a diet.  Diabetes and heart disease are a far greater risk than covid to the majority of the gaming community. 

Or maybe they should inspect everyone's armpits before entering to make sure that they have bathed and put on deodorant before entering.   ;)
Do you think obesity and diabetes are communicable?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 07, 2021, 10:27:18 AM
They should be requiring obese gamers to prove they are on a diet.  Diabetes and heart disease are a far greater risk than covid to the majority of the gaming community. 

Or maybe they should inspect everyone's armpits before entering to make sure that they have bathed and put on deodorant before entering.   ;)
Do you think obesity and diabetes are communicable?

  being fat makes covid deadly.  His point is if they are going to be concerned over health, might as well cover all the health issues, especially the most preventable.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: HappyDaze on June 07, 2021, 10:37:09 AM
They should be requiring obese gamers to prove they are on a diet.  Diabetes and heart disease are a far greater risk than covid to the majority of the gaming community. 

Or maybe they should inspect everyone's armpits before entering to make sure that they have bathed and put on deodorant before entering.   ;)
Do you think obesity and diabetes are communicable?

  being fat makes covid deadly.  His point is if they are going to be concerned over health, might as well cover all the health issues, especially the most preventable.
That's not what he said.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 07, 2021, 11:05:05 AM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Here in Italy having had COVID counts as "one vaccination". After a few months you get the second shot and - after two weeks (*) - you are ready to go. Dunno about the States.

No big Conventions over here, even if we are slowly reopening and things do seem fine. I'll go to a clinic, instead, to fix an annoying physical problem. I endured with it for a couple of months because for no reason (except life-threatening circumstances) I would have entered a clinic during COVID without at least a shot. Same for a Convention Others' mileage can vary.

(*) "Two weeks" does seem to be the rule for the vaccine to work. I got my first shot of Moderna two Mondays ago, so literally today I'm fully "80% protected". I'll get the second shot on Jun, 28th, which will made the protection permanent and up it to 94.1%. Or so I'm told.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 07, 2021, 11:38:17 AM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.

It's got nothing to do with being anti-vaxx. I don't want to take these experimental vaccines until they have full FDA approval and are not protected by the PREP act.
The government and corporations should take their fair share of responsibility for experimental vaccinations.

Okay - you do you. But if everyone did that - we'd be having another 600k COVID deaths in the next year or two. Yay! Hopefully we reach herd immunity without you.

This particular MRNA vaccine hasn't been fully tested - but MRNA vaccines are a known factor - and there should likely be a permanent expedited approval process for them.

Anywho - I'll bow out here I guess. Not really gaming related at this point.
It's not like the convention's being run by Andrew Cuomo.

Incidentially, it seems DragonCon has taken a less obnoxious tack:

"Additionally, under Georgia law, there is no liability for an injury or death of an individual on or off the premises of one of the Convention hotels or Dragon Con venues if such injury or death results from the inherent risks of contracting COVID-19. By attending Dragon Con, you accept that you are assuming the risk by entering the premises and participating in Dragon Con activities. You also acknowledge that there is a risk of injury or death from Covid-19 that you may contract during your travel to or from the Convention or any Dragon Con venues. You accept the risk of contracting Covid-19 or transmitting Covid-19 to others as a result of travel to or from the Convention or any Dragon Con venue."
(from the DragonCon policy section, https://www.dragoncon.org/about/dragon-con-policies/ )

See you in Atlanta! :D

IMO thats the best way to deal with it. Remind people they are grown assed adults and should be responsible for their own actions. If youre scared of the virus, don't go to conventions.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 07, 2021, 11:47:03 AM
IMO thats the best way to deal with it. Remind people they are grown assed adults and should be responsible for their own actions. If youre scared of the virus, don't go to conventions.
Exactly. We do know that superspreader events are a major vector for the transmission of covid-19, and they're overwhelmingly indoor mass gatherings where people are in close proximity and talk to each other -- so gaming conventions are almost the perfect match. No incremental precautions will eliminate that risk, so be aware and make an informed decision. If you're really worried, you shouldn't go to a Con.

But in a sane world, Cons would be talking more about things like ventilation systems and less about masks, because we know it's primarily transmitted through aerosolization, not large droplets.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 07, 2021, 12:34:20 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be. Taking precautions seems pretty understandable. Especially at cons where theres alot of people concentrated. That is going to exponentially increase the chances something going bad or really bad for someone attending.

A group locally last week met up. They all had been vaccinated but still makes me uneasy so soon.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 07, 2021, 12:40:51 PM
I want to see your bank records to make sure you haven't spent money on anything that my be socially destructive.  Oh, and I get to define what that is.  Fuck off with that noise!

Try to enter the UK in this "after Brexit" world, and you will find just that.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/may/27/eu-tourists-condemn-uk-border-officials-humiliating-treatment

(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/623fd7f01583e3cdcad0c7c3f583e6220e030197/0_0_3024_2405/master/3024.jpg?width=620&quality=45&auto=format&fit=max&dpr=2&s=f45a9820416ce232628883a6f2ccadac)

No more Conventions or trips in UK for me after this.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Jam The MF on June 07, 2021, 01:03:08 PM
And what of those of us who had COVID, and have antibodies? We are actually LESS likely to get or spread the virus, yet are being actively discriminated against.

Guess it's no cons for me.

Worth bitching about to con organizers I think. This type of thing is really going to split society.


Yes, there will be division.  The danger hairs will be at the ready, I'm certain.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Jam The MF on June 07, 2021, 01:08:44 PM
They should be requiring obese gamers to prove they are on a diet.  Diabetes and heart disease are a far greater risk than covid to the majority of the gaming community. 

Or maybe they should inspect everyone's armpits before entering to make sure that they have bathed and put on deodorant before entering.   ;)


Ha!!!  Yes!!!
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 07, 2021, 01:18:27 PM
I want to see your bank records to make sure you haven't spent money on anything that my be socially destructive.  Oh, and I get to define what that is.  Fuck off with that noise!

Try to enter the UK in this "after Brexit" world, and you will find just that.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/may/27/eu-tourists-condemn-uk-border-officials-humiliating-treatment

(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/623fd7f01583e3cdcad0c7c3f583e6220e030197/0_0_3024_2405/master/3024.jpg?width=620&quality=45&auto=format&fit=max&dpr=2&s=f45a9820416ce232628883a6f2ccadac)

No more Conventions or trips in UK for me after this.
I hate to be a dick about this, Reckall, but the UK has a point here.

'Sergio' (assuming that's his real name) has no employment, limited funds, and has no return transit (plane, train, or automobile) secured. I'd be awfully suspicious too.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Zelen on June 07, 2021, 01:25:12 PM
If you read Dr. Anthony Fauci's emails, he argues that C-19 is a significant threat to people 70+ with preexisting comorbidities, but is actually less dangerous than the seasonal flu for most demographics. Anyone treating this as anything more than what it is -- a flu -- is not aligned with the science.

Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 07, 2021, 01:28:25 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Wntrlnd on June 07, 2021, 02:02:40 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Slipshot762 on June 07, 2021, 02:07:10 PM
The idea of going anywhere makes me tired.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: JeffB on June 07, 2021, 02:15:08 PM
If you read Dr. Anthony Fauci's emails, he argues that C-19 is a significant threat to people 70+ with preexisting comorbidities, but is actually less dangerous than the seasonal flu for most demographics. Anyone treating this as anything more than what it is -- a flu -- is not aligned with the science.

You are exactly correct.

My Wife worked as a RN Care Coordinator for COVID patients for nearly a year working in the hardest hit city and surrounding areas for the biggest Health provider in the region. Working from home I was able to listen to her  nearly 9 hours a day speaking with other RNs, DR;s, NPs, etc as well as speaking with COVID patients and the patients families.

The whole thing was completely blown out of proportion, and ANY death, despite it's root cause (Cancers, Heart attacks, any previous condition) was tagged as a COVID 19 death if possible  for purposes of stats, and Health insurance claims (My background). MEdicare/MEdicaid  pays out significantly more money for a COVID death, and due to the complete shutdown of most  non emergency procedures, the Hospital systems were losing money hand over fist.

On the subject of the Vax. I got mine, solely because I have not seen my elderly mother (90 this year), in 3 years and it was a condition of me travelling back home to visit her in VA ( Condition set by Her, and my Siblings). As I'm fearful I won't see her before her time is up on this earth,  so I gave in. My reactions have been somewhat worse than average (And I have no allergies, or reactions to other meds, flu shots, etc). Today- a week after my 2nd dose, I've developed a big raised patch about 4 inches in diameter at the injection site. Feels like my arm is on fire. Of course I've got my own RN here, so we are keeping tabs on it  ;D 

And I guess now people I know will be more open to gaming in person again, so that is a positive, but...blech.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Jam The MF on June 07, 2021, 02:42:35 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be. Taking precautions seems pretty understandable. Especially at cons where theres alot of people concentrated. That is going to exponentially increase the chances something going bad or really bad for someone attending.

A group locally last week met up. They all had been vaccinated but still makes me uneasy so soon.

A lot of people in the U.S. continued to live their lives with as much normality as possible.  I worked full time, all the way through the whole mess; and I had a letter stating that I was an essential worker.  Might as well sit down, throw dice, and play RPGs too!!!
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 07, 2021, 02:49:19 PM
I want to see your bank records to make sure you haven't spent money on anything that my be socially destructive.  Oh, and I get to define what that is.  Fuck off with that noise!

Try to enter the UK in this "after Brexit" world, and you will find just that.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/may/27/eu-tourists-condemn-uk-border-officials-humiliating-treatment

(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/623fd7f01583e3cdcad0c7c3f583e6220e030197/0_0_3024_2405/master/3024.jpg?width=620&quality=45&auto=format&fit=max&dpr=2&s=f45a9820416ce232628883a6f2ccadac)

No more Conventions or trips in UK for me after this.
I hate to be a dick about this, Reckall, but the UK has a point here.

'Sergio' (assuming that's his real name) has no employment, limited funds, and has no return transit (plane, train, or automobile) secured. I'd be awfully suspicious too.

Maybe, except that the situation is going out of control. What about 'Antonio', here?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/feb/17/italian-man-95-resident-in-uk-for-68-years-told-to-prove-it

"He was welcomed with one week’s advance wages and a sandwich when he arrived at Folkestone harbour, but almost 70 years later says he has been forced to supply 80 pages of bank statements to prove his right to stay in the UK."

And if I put Italians first is because, obviously, it was the first echo to reach these shores, but all the EU, no matter how lecit their entrance is, is being thrown in the local Guantanamo for reasons out of "Catch 22" or Kafka:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/13/eu-citizens-arriving-in-uk-being-locked-up-and-expelled

I'm not saying that the British are "evil" - far from it. But it would seem that they were stunningly unprepared for what happened after Brexit, had no comprehensive dialogue about immigration laws involving all the concerned parts and, from what I can surmise, underestimated the problem of non-digitized data. If you are not on a computer but in some dusty folder you do not exist - something, BTW, that hits elder people first, of course.

Thanks, but, no, thanks. I worked for three years in London back in the '90s and I never liked it. I'll miss some Conventions at the ExCeL Center, but amen to that. After the COVID, Paris will be just fine.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 07, 2021, 03:15:01 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

How many flu deaths were there in 2020?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 07, 2021, 04:12:53 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

The seasonal flu is not a novel virus. We have established vaccines and treatments for it. The Spanish flu killed up to 50 million. The Asian and Hong Kong flus killed about 1 million each.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: DocJones on June 07, 2021, 05:05:24 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.
How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?
The last time I was at Origins, I had to sit next to this thing. 
I didn't know its pronouns, but it was was crawling with invisible cooties.
Cooties is much worse.   
In order to get rid of cooties, you have to give them to someone else.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Wntrlnd on June 07, 2021, 06:20:01 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

How many flu deaths were there in 2020?

Thanks to social distancing. Masks. Work from home and all those other "unnecessary" precautions and regulations that some people here thought was restricting their freedumbs, very few.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 07, 2021, 06:21:35 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

How many flu deaths were there in 2020?

Thanks to social distancing. Masks. Work from home and all those other "unnecessary" precautions and regulations that some people here thought was restricting their freedumbs, very few.

  You might want to check those Fauci emails, masks do jack shit to stop spread of viruses at gaming conventions.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Wntrlnd on June 07, 2021, 06:27:21 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

The seasonal flu is not a novel virus. We have established vaccines and treatments for it. The Spanish flu killed up to 50 million. The Asian and Hong Kong flus killed about 1 million each.

And since the reproduction (R0) rate of the Hong Kong flu was 1.8, you can see why the Covid is worse, if the fact that we are up to 3.75 Million dead so far isnt evidence enough.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Wntrlnd on June 07, 2021, 06:33:28 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

How many flu deaths were there in 2020?

Thanks to social distancing. Masks. Work from home and all those other "unnecessary" precautions and regulations that some people here thought was restricting their freedumbs, very few.

  You might want to check those Fauci emails, masks do jack shit to stop spread of viruses at gaming conventions.

I will agree that keeping distance to other people are way superior than any masks. Also, not speaking to other people, or shouting. Going round and hugging or touching people are way off. So for the purpose of conventions, just masks wont cut it.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 07, 2021, 06:54:03 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

The seasonal flu is not a novel virus. We have established vaccines and treatments for it. The Spanish flu killed up to 50 million. The Asian and Hong Kong flus killed about 1 million each.

And since the reproduction (R0) rate of the Hong Kong flu was 1.8, you can see why the Covid is worse, if the fact that we are up to 3.75 Million dead so far isnt evidence enough.

You defined it as "insanely" worse. I'm still failing to see you quanitfy "insane" compared to other viral outbreaks.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Wntrlnd on June 07, 2021, 07:29:44 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

The seasonal flu is not a novel virus. We have established vaccines and treatments for it. The Spanish flu killed up to 50 million. The Asian and Hong Kong flus killed about 1 million each.

And since the reproduction (R0) rate of the Hong Kong flu was 1.8, you can see why the Covid is worse, if the fact that we are up to 3.75 Million dead so far isnt evidence enough.

You defined it as "insanely" worse. I'm still failing to see you quanitfy "insane" compared to other viral outbreaks.

I didnt define it as "insanely" worse. Omega did. I said "worse", which it is.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 07, 2021, 07:37:25 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

How many flu deaths were there in 2020?

Thanks to social distancing. Masks. Work from home and all those other "unnecessary" precautions and regulations that some people here thought was restricting their freedumbs, very few.
Most of those had no significant effect. The only factors that really seemed to make a difference were banning large gatherings (relevant to game conventions), and closing borders.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 07, 2021, 07:46:43 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

The seasonal flu is not a novel virus. We have established vaccines and treatments for it. The Spanish flu killed up to 50 million. The Asian and Hong Kong flus killed about 1 million each.

And since the reproduction (R0) rate of the Hong Kong flu was 1.8, you can see why the Covid is worse, if the fact that we are up to 3.75 Million dead so far isnt evidence enough.

You defined it as "insanely" worse. I'm still failing to see you quanitfy "insane" compared to other viral outbreaks.

I didnt define it as "insanely" worse. Omega did. I said "worse", which it is.

Ah, ok. I got a little off track there when you replied to a question for him.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Shasarak on June 07, 2021, 08:36:15 PM
The only thing surprising is that they dont ask everyone to wear masks - double masks preferred of course.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: DocJones on June 07, 2021, 09:12:26 PM
Thanks to social distancing. Masks. Work from home and all those other "unnecessary" precautions and regulations that some people here thought was restricting their freedumbs, very few.
Fauci, I and the science all agree that masks are totally useless...unless you are the one withe the Wuhan flu and are sneezing and coughing at everyone.
And I stated this last year on this forum.   But here's the problem with some of the conventions:
GenCon sent us all a survey asking our opinions on what would make us "FEEL SAFE" to attend their convention.
As of this moment GenCon has no idea what the hell they will require of attendees...
but they are selling badges right now.
Hilariously they claim that 100% of GenCon employees are vaccinated, and yet they are all still working from home!
These people clearly don't even believe in the vaccine they are promoting.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Eirikrautha on June 08, 2021, 07:04:43 AM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

According to the WHO, it has a CFR of 2.0 - 3.0, and an estimated IFR of one-tenth that.  That's identical to the H1N1 flu in 2009.  Did you take all of these precautions back then?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 08, 2021, 07:20:00 AM
Thanks to social distancing. Masks. Work from home and all those other "unnecessary" precautions and regulations that some people here thought was restricting their freedumbs, very few.
Fauci, I and the science all agree that masks are totally useless...unless you are the one withe the Wuhan flu and are sneezing and coughing at everyone.
And I stated this last year on this forum.   But here's the problem with some of the conventions:
GenCon sent us all a survey asking our opinions on what would make us "FEEL SAFE" to attend their convention.
As of this moment GenCon has no idea what the hell they will require of attendees...
but they are selling badges right now.
Hilariously they claim that 100% of GenCon employees are vaccinated, and yet they are all still working from home!
These people clearly don't even believe in the vaccine they are promoting.

   I am a little surprised GenCon is running an event.  That is a serious crowd, and as super serial as the folks around that Con have taken the bug, the best thing they could do, the most responsible thing they could do, to remain intellectually honest is to simply have no Con and wait till next year.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Anon Adderlan on June 08, 2021, 09:07:06 AM
The whole point of providing a vaccine was so policies like this would not be necessary. If you're worried about catching #Covid then just get vaccinated and stop worrying about everyone else.

GenCon sent us all a survey asking our opinions on what would make us "FEEL SAFE" to attend their convention.

Answer: People making medical decisions based on science rather than politics.

Sadly most people don't, and facts aren't going to sell tickets.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: rgalex on June 08, 2021, 09:56:48 AM
Quote
   I am a little surprised GenCon is running an event.  That is a serious crowd, and as super serial as the folks around that Con have taken the bug, the best thing they could do, the most responsible thing they could do, to remain intellectually honest is to simply have no Con and wait till next year.

They have reduced the number of maximum attendees they are allowing.  The badge registration announcement said "In-person attendance will be capped to comply with local, state, and national public-health and safety guidelines".  Who knows how many that means, but I'm guessing it is going to be far less than the 60k - 70k previous attendance.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 08, 2021, 10:13:59 AM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

About twice as infectious as flu (R0 of 1.3 compared to 2.9) and more than ten times as deadly. (US average deaths from flu is 40.000 /year. Covid related deaths in the US are currently at  600.000 after little more than a year.)

How many flu deaths were there in 2020?

Thanks to social distancing. Masks. Work from home and all those other "unnecessary" precautions and regulations that some people here thought was restricting their freedumbs, very few.

Come on dude. There have always been bad, awful wrong thinkers who didn't mask and social distance and states who didn't force the policy. These people/states would still have flu deaths.

What about pneumonia? People with health conditions can get it all on their own. If you have COPD, for example, no amount of masking (and indeed restricting breathing would make it more likely) you can get pneumonia that will eventually kill without treatment. Yet we see a similar completely out of bounds number of deaths. Why?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 08, 2021, 10:28:01 AM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

As noted in an older thread here. Sister of one of our local players got it and was dead within 2 days. Another family member of a local player was, as last heard, on life support. And in my home town a group went out to a restaurant, all got it and were all dead within a week. Far as know none of these were older people.

In all honesty cons have been a known disease vector for a very long time anyhow. I've lost track of how many times I've gotten "con flu", a few of those really bad too. Getting vaccinated regularly cut that down significantly. But not totally unfortunately.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 08, 2021, 10:34:09 AM
Though as noted, the local meeting last week everyone attending had been vaccinated and so far seems ok.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: rocksfalleverybodydies on June 08, 2021, 10:39:32 AM
Quote
   I am a little surprised GenCon is running an event.  That is a serious crowd, and as super serial as the folks around that Con have taken the bug, the best thing they could do, the most responsible thing they could do, to remain intellectually honest is to simply have no Con and wait till next year.

They have reduced the number of maximum attendees they are allowing.  The badge registration announcement said "In-person attendance will be capped to comply with local, state, and national public-health and safety guidelines".  Who knows how many that means, but I'm guessing it is going to be far less than the 60k - 70k previous attendance.

I'm just pleased that I'll be able to attend online for free as the physical trip there is not feasible and I quite enjoyed a lot of the livestream symposiums they streamed last year.

Pretty much all the ones in Canada have been cancelled until spring 2022 so it fills the need.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: rgalex on June 08, 2021, 10:44:08 AM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

As noted in an older thread here. Sister of one of our local players got it and was dead within 2 days. Another family member of a local player was, as last heard, on life support. And in my home town a group went out to a restaurant, all got it and were all dead within a week. Far as know none of these were older people.

In all honesty cons have been a known disease vector for a very long time anyhow. I've lost track of how many times I've gotten "con flu", a few of those really bad too. Getting vaccinated regularly cut that down significantly. But not totally unfortunately.

I'm not going to say that those things didn't happen, but... that's some amazingly fast moving COVID.  Last numbers I saw, which granted may be off because it was a few months ago, showed that the average number of days from 1st symptoms until death in non-survivors was 18.5.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: FingerRod on June 08, 2021, 12:03:18 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

As noted in an older thread here. Sister of one of our local players got it and was dead within 2 days. Another family member of a local player was, as last heard, on life support. And in my home town a group went out to a restaurant, all got it and were all dead within a week. Far as know none of these were older people.

In all honesty cons have been a known disease vector for a very long time anyhow. I've lost track of how many times I've gotten "con flu", a few of those really bad too. Getting vaccinated regularly cut that down significantly. But not totally unfortunately.

I'm not going to say that those things didn't happen, but... that's some amazingly fast moving COVID.  Last numbers I saw, which granted may be off because it was a few months ago, showed that the average number of days from 1st symptoms until death in non-survivors was 18.5.

Same, I don’t think anybody is maliciously lying about this, however, before I believe that a group of otherwise young and healthy people all went to dinner and died within a week from COVID, I need to go apologize to my cousin for not believing him in third grade when he showed up after rolling five 18’s and a 17 for his character.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Jam The MF on June 08, 2021, 12:13:24 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

As noted in an older thread here. Sister of one of our local players got it and was dead within 2 days. Another family member of a local player was, as last heard, on life support. And in my home town a group went out to a restaurant, all got it and were all dead within a week. Far as know none of these were older people.

In all honesty cons have been a known disease vector for a very long time anyhow. I've lost track of how many times I've gotten "con flu", a few of those really bad too. Getting vaccinated regularly cut that down significantly. But not totally unfortunately.

I'm not going to say that those things didn't happen, but... that's some amazingly fast moving COVID.  Last numbers I saw, which granted may be off because it was a few months ago, showed that the average number of days from 1st symptoms until death in non-survivors was 18.5.

Same, I don’t think anybody is maliciously lying about this, however, before I believe that a group of otherwise young and healthy people all went to dinner and died within a week from COVID, I need to go apologize to my cousin for not believing him in third grade when he showed up after rolling five 18’s and a 17 for his character.

18
18
18
18
18
17

Dude, I swear!!!  What do you mean, you don't believe me?

My character's name, is Festus the Great.  He was born to a poor family, and he grew up in a small village.  His hair is purple, and his penis glows in the dark.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 08, 2021, 01:07:16 PM
One might think that such a startling story would have been everywhere in the crisis oriented news.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 08, 2021, 01:33:06 PM
We're starting to veer off track here, let's get back before Pundit gets grumpy.

Any word on other conventions, if any?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 08, 2021, 02:34:32 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

As noted in an older thread here. Sister of one of our local players got it and was dead within 2 days. Another family member of a local player was, as last heard, on life support. And in my home town a group went out to a restaurant, all got it and were all dead within a week. Far as know none of these were older people.

In all honesty cons have been a known disease vector for a very long time anyhow. I've lost track of how many times I've gotten "con flu", a few of those really bad too. Getting vaccinated regularly cut that down significantly. But not totally unfortunately.

   To move back towards the topic, I heard lots about the con crud before I went to Gen Con years ago.  However, having been in the military, having school age kids, and having a job where I was in close contact with other people for 10 years before I went, I did not end up with the crud, though I most certainly could see how it could be a thing from the way that place was packed out.  Which leads me to veer towards the idea that anyone who feels a mask is necessary to go somewhere, should not be anywhere near a Con of any kind mask or no mask, vaccine or not.   

    Regarding people we know who may have had Covid,  I know several people myself (14 total last I tallied) and no fatalities in the crowd, two hospitalizations - both people with immune issues- and several of the people (6) were in their 70's. 
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 08, 2021, 02:46:42 PM
Which leads me to veer towards the idea that anyone who feels a mask is necessary to go somewhere, should not be anywhere near a Con of any kind mask or no mask, vaccine or not.   
Bears repeating. Cons are the worst sort of event to go to, if you're afraid of covid-19.

But if you do start to display symptoms, get treatment right away. There are some very good treatments that can prevent covid-19 from getting worse, but they have to be started very early. They won't help if the disease is already far along.

So while the two days from first symptoms to death stories aren't plausible, two days from being hospitalized until death is very plausible, because there are a lot of people who think they'll be fine or just want to wait and see, and don't seek help until the disease is quite advanced. I know a friend of the family who did that, and ended up on a ventilator for 6 weeks. Which is ironic in a nasty way, because she was avoiding the hospital because she was scared of ventilators.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: rgalex on June 08, 2021, 03:20:33 PM
We're starting to veer off track here, let's get back before Pundit gets grumpy.

Any word on other conventions, if any?

GenCon seems to be hemming and hawing in trying to figure out what to do.  I've gotten several surveys asking if they did X how would that affect my willingness to attend.  I don't mind if they want to take extra precautions.  Things like having hand sanitizer stations, closing the con at night so they can sanitize things themselves, better spacing of the tables and game rooms (seriously, even w/o a COVID scare they need less tables in those rooms), offering free testing, etc.

Things they will try to force on me though, like mandatory masking, temperature taking, vaccine passport... nah.  Those are show stoppers for me and I said as much.

I've since decided to skip this year.  I can't fathom spending the $$$ to go to a con that will likely have limited attendance. I can't imagine many companies will be there will be due to safety concerns not yet being ironed out and the date being changed.  We already saw Paizo and Asmodee pull out.  There are probably a bunch of smaller ones I haven't heard about yet as well.

The pop-up GenCon idea sounded sorta interesting and I was going to see if my FLGS was interested.  Then they said there is a $5 badge fee for it.  I mean, I get it, sort of.  I just can't think of anyone that would pay $5 for something we do normally for free.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 08, 2021, 04:38:16 PM
Considering how insanely fast and lethal this thing can be.

How insanely fast and lethal is Covid-19?

As noted in an older thread here. Sister of one of our local players got it and was dead within 2 days. Another family member of a local player was, as last heard, on life support. And in my home town a group went out to a restaurant, all got it and were all dead within a week. Far as know none of these were older people.

If we took those anecdotal numbers as representative of the virus, I'd think that the total death toll worldwide would be magnitudes higher.

Quote
In all honesty cons have been a known disease vector for a very long time anyhow. I've lost track of how many times I've gotten "con flu", a few of those really bad too. Getting vaccinated regularly cut that down significantly. But not totally unfortunately.

Yeah, while I think a lot of the reaction to Covid has been superstitious or ideological nonsense, a convention is a prime candidate for maximizing the spread of this thing. And we only have a few months worth of data on the effectiveness of the vaccinations, and quite a few variants have already sprung up.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Spinachcat on June 08, 2021, 06:12:38 PM
This type of thing is really going to split society.

That's the goal.

There just needs to be Red State GameCons that ignores this idiocy. Wanna wear your face diaper? Your choice. Wanna inject yourself with experimental drugs? Your choice. Wanna attend a con with no rules? Your choice.

Like everything else in the cultural war, there needs to be greater division and each side needs to go their own way.
 
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 08, 2021, 07:05:07 PM
I'm not going to say that those things didn't happen, but... that's some amazingly fast moving COVID.  Last numbers I saw, which granted may be off because it was a few months ago, showed that the average number of days from 1st symptoms until death in non-survivors was 18.5.

Thats what family members told me so I am assuming thats the case somehow. I too was under the impression it took a while. Hence the problem. By the time you know you have it, you've likely spread it some.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 08, 2021, 07:07:06 PM
One might think that such a startling story would have been everywhere in the crisis oriented news.

Didnt know rolling 18s was a crisis incident.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 08, 2021, 07:12:01 PM
   To move back towards the topic, I heard lots about the con crud before I went to Gen Con years ago.  However, having been in the military, having school age kids, and having a job where I was in close contact with other people for 10 years before I went, I did not end up with the crud, though I most certainly could see how it could be a thing from the way that place was packed out.  Which leads me to veer towards the idea that anyone who feels a mask is necessary to go somewhere, should not be anywhere near a Con of any kind mask or no mask, vaccine or not.   

For me GenCon was allways the worse. Just about every time went to it, was everything from sick, to hellishly sick right after.

Now mind you. It might not necessarily be the Con that gets you. But the plane or bus you rode.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: HappyDaze on June 08, 2021, 09:39:06 PM
This type of thing is really going to split society.

That's the goal.

There just needs to be Red State GameCons that ignores this idiocy. Wanna wear your face diaper? Your choice. Wanna inject yourself with experimental drugs? Your choice. Wanna attend a con with no rules? Your choice.

Like everything else in the cultural war, there needs to be greater division and each side needs to go their own way.
I totally disagree. Gaming doesn't have to be politically segregated, and I don't think it should be. People that can't be respectful to others in public can be weeded out, but that doesn't need to be based on political lines.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: SHARK on June 08, 2021, 10:08:11 PM
This type of thing is really going to split society.

That's the goal.

There just needs to be Red State GameCons that ignores this idiocy. Wanna wear your face diaper? Your choice. Wanna inject yourself with experimental drugs? Your choice. Wanna attend a con with no rules? Your choice.

Like everything else in the cultural war, there needs to be greater division and each side needs to go their own way.

Greetings!

I totally agree, Spinachcat! The Cons need to be separated, so that normal, sane, gamers can gather together in peace to enjoy gaming without being screamed at, or canceled, or confronted by Marxist pod-people jackasses.

Marxist brainwashed SJW rainbow hippos are the ones that can't act like fucking adults in public. So, they need to be removed.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 09, 2021, 02:36:25 AM
Well I checked up on my home town and yeah there were a bunch of covid deaths over the course of a week then more a month later all at once. But what was really jaw dropping and what had not heard of was a big spike in deaths. around the start of 2021. 20+ in a single day? I am guessing because theres a major university in the middle of the place. But still thats alot of deaths all at once.

So checked local and its worse. But here we both have two colleges and a large population.

On the gaming side this reminds me a bit of the disaster rules from Oriental Adventures where a plague could sweep through an area and even spread to other kingdoms over the course of anywhere from a few months to a year of rolled really badly.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 09, 2021, 04:50:44 AM
This type of thing is really going to split society.

That's the goal.

There just needs to be Red State GameCons that ignores this idiocy. Wanna wear your face diaper? Your choice. Wanna inject yourself with experimental drugs? Your choice. Wanna attend a con with no rules? Your choice.

Like everything else in the cultural war, there needs to be greater division and each side needs to go their own way.

Greetings!

I totally agree, Spinachcat! The Cons need to be separated, so that normal, sane, gamers can gather together in peace to enjoy gaming without being screamed at, or canceled, or confronted by Marxist pod-people jackasses.

Marxist brainwashed SJW rainbow hippos are the ones that can't act like fucking adults in public. So, they need to be removed.

I literally can't say if the above is ironic or intended for real.

Anyway, we are talking about the Conventions held in the country that scored 25% of the World's deaths with only 4% of the World population, right? I so, I can understand why some people over there are a bit jittery
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 09, 2021, 07:50:47 AM
This type of thing is really going to split society.

That's the goal.

There just needs to be Red State GameCons that ignores this idiocy. Wanna wear your face diaper? Your choice. Wanna inject yourself with experimental drugs? Your choice. Wanna attend a con with no rules? Your choice.

Like everything else in the cultural war, there needs to be greater division and each side needs to go their own way.

Greetings!

I totally agree, Spinachcat! The Cons need to be separated, so that normal, sane, gamers can gather together in peace to enjoy gaming without being screamed at, or canceled, or confronted by Marxist pod-people jackasses.

Marxist brainwashed SJW rainbow hippos are the ones that can't act like fucking adults in public. So, they need to be removed.

I literally can't say if the above is ironic or intended for real.

Anyway, we are talking about the Conventions held in the country that scored 25% of the World's deaths with only 4% of the World population, right? I so, I can understand why some people over there are a bit jittery
A couple years ago I'd have laughed at it myself.

Now I'm not so sure, because wokeists tend to do really, really fucking stupid things when something pushes one of their many buttons.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 09, 2021, 07:52:44 AM
This type of thing is really going to split society.

That's the goal.

There just needs to be Red State GameCons that ignores this idiocy. Wanna wear your face diaper? Your choice. Wanna inject yourself with experimental drugs? Your choice. Wanna attend a con with no rules? Your choice.

Like everything else in the cultural war, there needs to be greater division and each side needs to go their own way.

Greetings!

I totally agree, Spinachcat! The Cons need to be separated, so that normal, sane, gamers can gather together in peace to enjoy gaming without being screamed at, or canceled, or confronted by Marxist pod-people jackasses.

Marxist brainwashed SJW rainbow hippos are the ones that can't act like fucking adults in public. So, they need to be removed.

I literally can't say if the above is ironic or intended for real.

Anyway, we are talking about the Conventions held in the country that scored 25% of the World's deaths with only 4% of the World population, right? I so, I can understand why some people over there are a bit jittery

Well, you've got to give the US some credit, we eliminated flu and pneumonia deaths! And of course the Chinese were completely transparent in their death numbers. They wouldn't cook the books.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 09, 2021, 08:02:28 AM
This type of thing is really going to split society.

That's the goal.

There just needs to be Red State GameCons that ignores this idiocy. Wanna wear your face diaper? Your choice. Wanna inject yourself with experimental drugs? Your choice. Wanna attend a con with no rules? Your choice.

Like everything else in the cultural war, there needs to be greater division and each side needs to go their own way.

Greetings!

I totally agree, Spinachcat! The Cons need to be separated, so that normal, sane, gamers can gather together in peace to enjoy gaming without being screamed at, or canceled, or confronted by Marxist pod-people jackasses.

Marxist brainwashed SJW rainbow hippos are the ones that can't act like fucking adults in public. So, they need to be removed.

I literally can't say if the above is ironic or intended for real.

Anyway, we are talking about the Conventions held in the country that scored 25% of the World's deaths with only 4% of the World population, right? I so, I can understand why some people over there are a bit jittery
 
   Well, a country that is also probably better than most at keeping people alive with advanced illnesses like heart disease, cancer, and lung issues, (at least till they are hit with another hammer in the form of Covid) as well as a disproportionate population of fat people.   It seems to me the go to public health message should be get your fat ass in shape. 
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 09, 2021, 09:41:30 AM
   Well, a country that is also probably better than most at keeping people alive with advanced illnesses like heart disease, cancer, and lung issues, (at least till they are hit with another hammer in the form of Covid) as well as a disproportionate population of fat people.   It seems to me the go to public health message should be get your fat ass in shape.

I don't see many fat asses here:

(https://www.mlive.com/resizer/JpweMQ2Vt8SRcyclTThCWFhe7Hg=/1280x0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/advancelocal/OVCCYSALGVH2TO72KLU5WBZDE4.JPG)

That's Spring Break in Florida 2020. They actually tracked the impact of such behaviour on COVID spread using anonymous data from cellphones.

https://twitter.com/TectonixGEO/status/1242628347034767361

As I already mentioned, a distant cousin of mine is a bigwig in General Obstetrics and Gynecology at the Cleveland Clinic in Weston, Florida. When they saw what was happening on the beaches they got the order to prepare for an "all hands on deck" emergency within 5-10 days - no matter what your specialisation was.

When I called her, to check how she was faring, the most chilling thing he told me wasn't her experience in a COVID ward that bordered on madness (some nurses and even doctors developed PTSD and were sent home - that was how bad it was).

No, the most chilling thing were these people, dying from COVID, who implored "Do some more research! Look for other causes! COVID doesn't exist!"

...And after twelve hours they were dead, thus making space for the new arrivals.

Virii don't care about beliefs, political, religious, sexual or what else. Virii are the most uncaring entities on Earth. They are also unexpectedly easy to understand - if one wants to make the effort.

True, the situation is better today, but, as my late uncle used to say, "Don't start to salute before crossing the finish line". Conventions? Yeah, they are great, but my life doesn't depend on them. Maybe next year (or in late Autumn, like Lucca Comics and Games at the end of October).

 

Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Zalman on June 09, 2021, 09:53:39 AM
I need to go apologize to my cousin for not believing him in third grade when he showed up after rolling five 18’s and a 17 for his character.

Obviously if he'd cheated they would all be 18's, duh.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: KingCheops on June 09, 2021, 10:24:23 AM
I'd be down for a convention where they actually require people to act like adults and be polite to each other.  I understand that people with strollers take up a fair bit of space but some of the shit that people said to my wife was uncalled for.  Nerds are really the worst people in the world and all act like they're victims because they were asocial shits in school and got beat up for it.  The solution isn't to double down on being a shit.

No one should be attending a con if they're worried about the coof.  Stay the fuck home!  If you're worried about it the best thing you can do is not expose yourself to it.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Renegade_Productions on June 09, 2021, 12:46:18 PM
https://dragonflight.org/covid-19-statement/?fbclid=IwAR1Jl9eeNU7nLasKtBJDvpJr-UuPpnGg7Ztt9Evt9D1nju3rYkxRxa-zXuc

With exception for those with a medical excuse.

I hadn't planned on attending any conventions this year due to just this. I'll probably have to skip any X-Wing miniatures events being held at a convention that requires vaccinations.

*Edit* Ok, I can't edit the title. They do accept the Johnson and Johnson vaccination, which is not an mRNA vaccine.

Haven't been to a con myself since A-KON 20. Stuff like this? Really makes going to cons not worth it.

But oh well. They want to make themselves irrelevant out of beer bug paranoia, that's on them.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 09, 2021, 03:54:41 PM
   Well, a country that is also probably better than most at keeping people alive with advanced illnesses like heart disease, cancer, and lung issues, (at least till they are hit with another hammer in the form of Covid) as well as a disproportionate population of fat people.   It seems to me the go to public health message should be get your fat ass in shape.

I don't see many fat asses here:

(https://www.mlive.com/resizer/JpweMQ2Vt8SRcyclTThCWFhe7Hg=/1280x0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/advancelocal/OVCCYSALGVH2TO72KLU5WBZDE4.JPG)

That's Spring Break in Florida 2020. They actually tracked the impact of such behaviour on COVID spread using anonymous data from cellphones.

https://twitter.com/TectonixGEO/status/1242628347034767361

As I already mentioned, a distant cousin of mine is a bigwig in General Obstetrics and Gynecology at the Cleveland Clinic in Weston, Florida. When they saw what was happening on the beaches they got the order to prepare for an "all hands on deck" emergency within 5-10 days - no matter what your specialisation was.

When I called her, to check how she was faring, the most chilling thing he told me wasn't her experience in a COVID ward that bordered on madness (some nurses and even doctors developed PTSD and were sent home - that was how bad it was).

No, the most chilling thing were these people, dying from COVID, who implored "Do some more research! Look for other causes! COVID doesn't exist!"

...And after twelve hours they were dead, thus making space for the new arrivals.

Virii don't care about beliefs, political, religious, sexual or what else. Virii are the most uncaring entities on Earth. They are also unexpectedly easy to understand - if one wants to make the effort.

True, the situation is better today, but, as my late uncle used to say, "Don't start to salute before crossing the finish line". Conventions? Yeah, they are great, but my life doesn't depend on them. Maybe next year (or in late Autumn, like Lucca Comics and Games at the end of October).

   Those were not the people dying.......not sure of your point....
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 09, 2021, 04:45:08 PM
   Well, a country that is also probably better than most at keeping people alive with advanced illnesses like heart disease, cancer, and lung issues, (at least till they are hit with another hammer in the form of Covid) as well as a disproportionate population of fat people.   It seems to me the go to public health message should be get your fat ass in shape.

I don't see many fat asses here:

(https://www.mlive.com/resizer/JpweMQ2Vt8SRcyclTThCWFhe7Hg=/1280x0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/advancelocal/OVCCYSALGVH2TO72KLU5WBZDE4.JPG)

That's Spring Break in Florida 2020. They actually tracked the impact of such behaviour on COVID spread using anonymous data from cellphones.

https://twitter.com/TectonixGEO/status/1242628347034767361

As I already mentioned, a distant cousin of mine is a bigwig in General Obstetrics and Gynecology at the Cleveland Clinic in Weston, Florida. When they saw what was happening on the beaches they got the order to prepare for an "all hands on deck" emergency within 5-10 days - no matter what your specialisation was.

When I called her, to check how she was faring, the most chilling thing he told me wasn't her experience in a COVID ward that bordered on madness (some nurses and even doctors developed PTSD and were sent home - that was how bad it was).

No, the most chilling thing were these people, dying from COVID, who implored "Do some more research! Look for other causes! COVID doesn't exist!"

...And after twelve hours they were dead, thus making space for the new arrivals.

Virii don't care about beliefs, political, religious, sexual or what else. Virii are the most uncaring entities on Earth. They are also unexpectedly easy to understand - if one wants to make the effort.

True, the situation is better today, but, as my late uncle used to say, "Don't start to salute before crossing the finish line". Conventions? Yeah, they are great, but my life doesn't depend on them. Maybe next year (or in late Autumn, like Lucca Comics and Games at the end of October).

   Those were not the people dying.......not sure of your point....

My point is A) a superspreader event caused by denial, and B) people victim (either directly or indirectly) still in denial while actually on their deathbeds. The denial is strong in some.

Notice how I pointed out how the doctors rushed to ready the trenches as soon as they saw A) happening. Few people bothered to listen to them. Doctors, however, must act on facts (or at least what is understood to reasonably be facts), not delusions. If my distant cousin didn't lie, even with such preparations they stemmed the tide just barely.

I want to be clear: this is nothing new. The most infamous superspreader event in the 1918 wave of the Spanish Flu was the "Liberty Loan Parade" held in Philadelphia on Sept. 28th, 1918. By then the diffusion of the Spanish Flu was already so widespread that the Army had canceled the next scheduled draft call. Doctors implored the authorities to stop the parade: no one listened. Others pleaded the newspapers to warn the population about the viral bomb that was about to explode: no one printed a single line. Why they should have? The parade promoted the war effort (chest beating, rah rah!), talking about the flu was "against the morale" (the then expression for "unpatriotic"). After two days, people in Philadelphia (and all the other cities people came from) started to collapse in the streets. Maybe the chest beating didn't help - the data is unclear here. Anyway, as a parade "Pro War Effort", the Philadelphia Superspreader Event was a great success, all right, but pro the effort of the virus, not of the soldiers.

[By comparing these two pandemics, BTW, a curious side note emerges. Even if in the mid 1970s they discovered the vaccine against meningitis and almost everyone got it, the average stupidity level in any given population, if analysed as part of the overall reaction to a pandemic, doesn't seem to be decreased between 1918 and 2021. Dunno... maybe this can be an useful data point among vaccine skeptics.]

Conventions? No thanks. Next year they will still be there. OK, maybe with less people...
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 09, 2021, 05:37:50 PM
   Well, a country that is also probably better than most at keeping people alive with advanced illnesses like heart disease, cancer, and lung issues, (at least till they are hit with another hammer in the form of Covid) as well as a disproportionate population of fat people.   It seems to me the go to public health message should be get your fat ass in shape.

I don't see many fat asses here:

(https://www.mlive.com/resizer/JpweMQ2Vt8SRcyclTThCWFhe7Hg=/1280x0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/advancelocal/OVCCYSALGVH2TO72KLU5WBZDE4.JPG)

That's Spring Break in Florida 2020. They actually tracked the impact of such behaviour on COVID spread using anonymous data from cellphones.

https://twitter.com/TectonixGEO/status/1242628347034767361

As I already mentioned, a distant cousin of mine is a bigwig in General Obstetrics and Gynecology at the Cleveland Clinic in Weston, Florida. When they saw what was happening on the beaches they got the order to prepare for an "all hands on deck" emergency within 5-10 days - no matter what your specialisation was.

When I called her, to check how she was faring, the most chilling thing he told me wasn't her experience in a COVID ward that bordered on madness (some nurses and even doctors developed PTSD and were sent home - that was how bad it was).

No, the most chilling thing were these people, dying from COVID, who implored "Do some more research! Look for other causes! COVID doesn't exist!"

...And after twelve hours they were dead, thus making space for the new arrivals.

Virii don't care about beliefs, political, religious, sexual or what else. Virii are the most uncaring entities on Earth. They are also unexpectedly easy to understand - if one wants to make the effort.

True, the situation is better today, but, as my late uncle used to say, "Don't start to salute before crossing the finish line". Conventions? Yeah, they are great, but my life doesn't depend on them. Maybe next year (or in late Autumn, like Lucca Comics and Games at the end of October).

   Those were not the people dying.......not sure of your point....

My point is A) a superspreader event caused by denial, and B) people victim (either directly or indirectly) still in denial while actually on their deathbeds. The denial is strong in some.

Then why did you post a picture of people who we're not sure ever got Covid, much less died of it, to illustrate a point about the people who did die?
Were the people who died all fatasses? Did they have other comorbidities? Did the virus "weed out" the fatties from the rest?

Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Shasarak on June 09, 2021, 05:44:13 PM
My point is A) a superspreader event caused by denial, and B) people victim (either directly or indirectly) still in denial while actually on their deathbeds. The denial is strong in some.

I remember there were super spreader soccer games in Italy vs Spain which spread the virus throughout Europe.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 09, 2021, 06:28:17 PM
My point is A) a superspreader event caused by denial, and B) people victim (either directly or indirectly) still in denial while actually on their deathbeds. The denial is strong in some.

I remember there were super spreader soccer games in Italy vs Spain which spread the virus throughout Europe.

True. Atalanta (the Bergamo soccer team) vs. Valencia was held in Milan on Feb. 19th 2021 and today is officially considered a superspreader event for COVID (the authorities used the term "A viral bomb"). Shortly thereafter Bergamo and its province became one of the hardest hit areas in the planet. That it was a novel virus and no one had the means to totally comprehend the situation didn't help.

That event also became the first opportunity to try study how the virus spreaded. The authorities directly interviewed 3.400 Atalanta supporters who were present at the match, and did a statistical analysis of where the other tickets were sold in the province (more than 50,000). The result showed with no doubts a direct correlation between the match and the spreading of COVID in the Bergamo area. However, statistical contact tracing showed how the "superspreader" part was not the match itself, but the close contact in trains, pullmans, cars and even Milan's metro. Add to this chanting - and then more chanting when Atalanta won, including extemporary "parties" held in bar and pubs.

Valencia was hit hard, too. For some reason Spanish authorities didn't launch the kind of analysis of the event that we did here in Italy, but from there COVID quickly reached Madrid and Barcelona (that were being hit from a lot of fronts, however). I read that in Valencia they did one of the longest lockdowns in Europe and today they are basically COVID-free.

It was winter, the match was held in Milan due to a momentary problem with the Atalanta stadium in Bergamo (no need to fill trains etc. otherwise)... and, ironically, the victory of Atalanta - truly a perfect storm.  :-[

Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 09, 2021, 06:35:13 PM
We could do a death pool. Guess what percentage of GenConners will die from covid! Winner gets bragging rights.

I'm more optimistic than Reckall, so I'm going to guess that only 99.9999% of them will die of concorona.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 09, 2021, 07:33:12 PM
   Well, a country that is also probably better than most at keeping people alive with advanced illnesses like heart disease, cancer, and lung issues, (at least till they are hit with another hammer in the form of Covid) as well as a disproportionate population of fat people.   It seems to me the go to public health message should be get your fat ass in shape.

I don't see many fat asses here:

(https://www.mlive.com/resizer/JpweMQ2Vt8SRcyclTThCWFhe7Hg=/1280x0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/advancelocal/OVCCYSALGVH2TO72KLU5WBZDE4.JPG)

That's Spring Break in Florida 2020. They actually tracked the impact of such behaviour on COVID spread using anonymous data from cellphones.

https://twitter.com/TectonixGEO/status/1242628347034767361

As I already mentioned, a distant cousin of mine is a bigwig in General Obstetrics and Gynecology at the Cleveland Clinic in Weston, Florida. When they saw what was happening on the beaches they got the order to prepare for an "all hands on deck" emergency within 5-10 days - no matter what your specialisation was.

When I called her, to check how she was faring, the most chilling thing he told me wasn't her experience in a COVID ward that bordered on madness (some nurses and even doctors developed PTSD and were sent home - that was how bad it was).

No, the most chilling thing were these people, dying from COVID, who implored "Do some more research! Look for other causes! COVID doesn't exist!"

...And after twelve hours they were dead, thus making space for the new arrivals.

Virii don't care about beliefs, political, religious, sexual or what else. Virii are the most uncaring entities on Earth. They are also unexpectedly easy to understand - if one wants to make the effort.

True, the situation is better today, but, as my late uncle used to say, "Don't start to salute before crossing the finish line". Conventions? Yeah, they are great, but my life doesn't depend on them. Maybe next year (or in late Autumn, like Lucca Comics and Games at the end of October).

   Those were not the people dying.......not sure of your point....

My point is A) a superspreader event caused by denial, and B) people victim (either directly or indirectly) still in denial while actually on their deathbeds. The denial is strong in some.

Then why did you post a picture of people who we're not sure ever got Covid, much less died of it, to illustrate a point about the people who did die?

That its a picture from what is considered a superspreader event: Spring Break in Florida 2020. There are thousands of them. Should I post all of them? Because for the overall effect I linked a video that traced the impact of these idiots on COVID's spread via anonymous cellphone data - and it is chilling.

Quote
Were the people who died all fatasses? Did they have other comorbidities? Did the virus "weed out" the fatties from the rest?

I'm sorry that a fat guy bit you when you were a kid. I hope that you will be able to recover.

Regarding the rest, true, the virus was more deadly for the elderly and those with comorbidities. These include diabetes, cancer, neurological disorders... what should we do? Put these people in camps so that people can party on the beach amid a pandemic?

Florida got the third-highest confirmed case count and the fourth-highest death count in the States. Well, congratulations! but... Are all of them "fatties"?

And it doesn't stop here. In early March, 2020 Florida Governor Ron DeSantis touted the State as "An oasis of freedom in a nation that’s suffering, in many parts of the country, under the yoke of oppressive lockdowns." Yay!!!! Shortly thereafter the "oasis" become an hotzone. During the months of June, July, and August 2020, the number of COVID cases in Florida increased over eleven-fold, from 56,830 on Jun. 1st to 631,040 on Sept. 1st. These are public data, easily obtainable. When this happens the ICUs become filled and the doctors are overwhelmed. This also means that a doctor called in a COVID ward in an "all hands emergency" will not be available to help a woman giving birth, or set a broken bone (maybe yours), or help a child hit by a car, or do your colonoscopy. The impact on healthcare services is much more vast that straight "COVID cases" alone (I'm always amazed by how many people fail to realise this: how they returned home with a badly set bone because upstream some imbecile wanted his Spring Break).

Then maybe you are young and you do not die. But you bring the virus home (maybe in a different State) and others will die. And "not dying" doesn't mean "not catching it". If you are unlucky you become a financial burden for your family in times of economic downturn. And young people aren't immune to "long COVID" - good luck if you catch some strange strain that stays with you for six months or more.

But non-"fatties" had their Superspreader Spring Break and this is what really counts. So, horaaay! Right?

[DeSantis, always the patriot, would pull another stunt in late September, when he issued an order that effectively nullified public health measures imposed by various local governments in Florida to combat the spread of the virus - thus causing another peak in cases. Pro tip: it would seem that DeSantis didn't wise up between March and September. Not even a pandemic helped the poor guy! But, as I said, average stupidity doesn't seem to have declined in the last hundred years, so... Again, nothing really new here.]

[whine]My body is mine and I decide for it!!1[/whine] So, when you plan to start your campaign to abolish laws against DUIing? Or wearing helmets in building sites, for what matters?

4% of World population, 25% of deaths. And still a lot of people refuse to just stop and simply ask: "How comes?" But I digressed a lot and the Pundit is coming with his banhammer, so... You are slim? Choose your convention(s), play some RPGs (remember: closed spaces, no masks and scream a lot) and have fun!  :D
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 09, 2021, 09:20:03 PM
   Well, a country that is also probably better than most at keeping people alive with advanced illnesses like heart disease, cancer, and lung issues, (at least till they are hit with another hammer in the form of Covid) as well as a disproportionate population of fat people.   It seems to me the go to public health message should be get your fat ass in shape.

I don't see many fat asses here:

(https://www.mlive.com/resizer/JpweMQ2Vt8SRcyclTThCWFhe7Hg=/1280x0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/advancelocal/OVCCYSALGVH2TO72KLU5WBZDE4.JPG)

That's Spring Break in Florida 2020. They actually tracked the impact of such behaviour on COVID spread using anonymous data from cellphones.

https://twitter.com/TectonixGEO/status/1242628347034767361

As I already mentioned, a distant cousin of mine is a bigwig in General Obstetrics and Gynecology at the Cleveland Clinic in Weston, Florida. When they saw what was happening on the beaches they got the order to prepare for an "all hands on deck" emergency within 5-10 days - no matter what your specialisation was.

When I called her, to check how she was faring, the most chilling thing he told me wasn't her experience in a COVID ward that bordered on madness (some nurses and even doctors developed PTSD and were sent home - that was how bad it was).

No, the most chilling thing were these people, dying from COVID, who implored "Do some more research! Look for other causes! COVID doesn't exist!"

...And after twelve hours they were dead, thus making space for the new arrivals.

Virii don't care about beliefs, political, religious, sexual or what else. Virii are the most uncaring entities on Earth. They are also unexpectedly easy to understand - if one wants to make the effort.

True, the situation is better today, but, as my late uncle used to say, "Don't start to salute before crossing the finish line". Conventions? Yeah, they are great, but my life doesn't depend on them. Maybe next year (or in late Autumn, like Lucca Comics and Games at the end of October).

   Those were not the people dying.......not sure of your point....

My point is A) a superspreader event caused by denial, and B) people victim (either directly or indirectly) still in denial while actually on their deathbeds. The denial is strong in some.

Then why did you post a picture of people who we're not sure ever got Covid, much less died of it, to illustrate a point about the people who did die?


That its a picture from what is considered a superspreader event: Spring Break in Florida 2020. There are thousands of them. Should I post all of them? Because for the overall effect I linked a video that traced the impact of these idiots on COVID's spread via anonymous cellphone data - and it is chilling.
[/quote]
*nested quoting is getting hard to wrangle*

No. I'd be fine if you posted pictures of the people there who died of Covid. The question was, did they have comorbities. You posted that picture as... shit I dunno now. For funzies? It doesn't make any sense, much less a point.

Quote
Quote
Were the people who died all fatasses? Did they have other comorbidities? Did the virus "weed out" the fatties from the rest?

I'm sorry that a fat guy bit you when you were a kid. I hope that you will be able to recover.

I am overweight myself. I just don't feel like mincing words.

Quote
Regarding the rest, true, the virus was more deadly for the elderly and those with comorbidities. These include diabetes, cancer, neurological disorders... what should we do? Put these people in camps so that people can party on the beach amid a pandemic?

People at risk should take what precautions they deem prudent. What do you want? For us to cage all young people so they don't attend any superspreader events?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 10, 2021, 07:52:21 AM
When I see Spring Break called a "super spreader" but the sasme news outlets calling BLM a non threat, My mind screams out BS one way or the other.

Maybe all the burning buildings killed off the virus?

The bottom line re: conventions:

1. If you're scared of the virus, stay home.

2. conventions should put a disclaimer stating you attend the convention at your own risk.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 10, 2021, 07:57:11 AM
I would also like to note that the so-called 'whistleblower' for Florida, Rebecca Jones, turned out to be a grifter and nutter with a long history of weird behavior.

Kinda goes to credibility.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Zelen on June 10, 2021, 09:13:36 AM
Solution has always been if you're afraid of risk, stay home. I'm personally at higher risk of hurting myself by falling down the stairs, driving a car, cooking dinner, swimming in a pool, and various other types of everyday activities than I am of this particular illness. If my risk tolerance for driving is low, it's not reasonable or rational for me to expect everyone else in the world to accommodate me by staying home so I can drive on roads safely.

Staying home generally is more possible than ever. For example, if you're not comfortable going into a store, basically all stores now offer curbside delivery or even home delivery.

Same principle applies to cons. If you think the risk of getting sick from a con outweighs the benefits, stay home. Fact of the matter is, masks and social distancing and hand sanitizer have demonstrated virtually no real-world impact on transmission rates. If you're going to a big gathering of people none of those magic talismans are going to protect you, so act accordingly and if you think you'll get sick (and that isn't acceptable) then stay home. Even the vaccines only provide a ~1% absolute risk reduction (that might make sense on a population level, but is insignificant for an individual risk assessment).
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Arnwolf666 on June 10, 2021, 04:21:29 PM
It should be a violation of privacy for them to ask to see your medical
Records
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: HappyDaze on June 10, 2021, 04:31:03 PM
It should be a violation of privacy for them to ask to see your medical
Records
They can ask almost anything. You don't have to comply. They don't have to let you in if you don't comply (or even if you do).
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Larsdangly on June 10, 2021, 04:42:26 PM
Isn't this a privately organized and run event? If so, what possible reason could you have for expecting them to bow to your opinions about vaccines? It's their event, so it's their rules. The end. If you don't like it, don't go.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 10, 2021, 05:13:37 PM
It should be a violation of privacy for them to ask to see your medical
Records
They can ask almost anything. You don't have to comply. They don't have to let you in if you don't comply (or even if you do).

Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 10, 2021, 05:16:19 PM
Isn't this a privately organized and run event? If so, what possible reason could you have for expecting them to bow to your opinions about vaccines? It's their event, so it's their rules. The end. If you don't like it, don't go.
So consumers aren't allowed to express their dissatisfaction with businesses now?

Good to know. I'm going to have to apologize to Apple for boycotting them because they supported slave labor.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Larsdangly on June 10, 2021, 05:28:38 PM
You can express whatever hare-brained opinions you want about any business or anything else. But they are under no obligation to pay attention to you. Frankly, the whole issue boils down to childishness: a slice of the population has decided to not get vaccinated against Covid-19 but doesn't want to deal with the consequences of their decision. Sack up, babies.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 10, 2021, 05:43:35 PM
I agree it's about childishness. A selection of the population, let's call them the dangling liars, think that private medical matters should be public, that the standard of informed consent should be thrown out the door in favor of one-size-fits all solutions using experimental technologies, that a segregated society is a good thing, and that any  dissent needs to be suppressed. These people fundamentally believe that people are children, and incapable of making their own decisions.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Larsdangly on June 10, 2021, 05:56:34 PM
'dangling liars'? Not a great opening salvo. I understand that you have a long list of evil people who you hold responsible for the consequences of your decisions, but you really need a better name for them.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 10, 2021, 06:04:04 PM
Consequences? Oh, right. You're one of those people who blames the people who are being bullied. That's sick. You should seek help.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 10, 2021, 06:48:04 PM
You can express whatever hare-brained opinions you want about any business or anything else. But they are under no obligation to pay attention to you. Frankly, the whole issue boils down to childishness: a slice of the population has decided to not get vaccinated against Covid-19 but doesn't want to deal with the consequences of their decision. Sack up, babies.

Disagree. If they dont get the vaccine, they know the risk they are taking. If they get sick it's on them.

But if the vaccines work, then the chance of them getting covid lowers by the percent of people vaccinated.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 10, 2021, 06:53:03 PM
I agree it's about childishness. A selection of the population, let's call them the dangling liars, think that private medical matters should be public, that the standard of informed consent should be thrown out the door in favor of one-size-fits all solutions using experimental technologies, that a segregated society is a good thing, and that any  dissent needs to be suppressed. These people fundamentally believe that people are children, and incapable of making their own decisions.

Yeah, why not insist on records of your polio vaccination, or TB or hey HIV status?

How about a note from your psychologist that you are stable enough not to go on a killing spree?

Or maybe your voter ID card to keep those evil Trump supporters away?

Its not about concern, its about control.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Shasarak on June 10, 2021, 06:55:58 PM
I agree it's about childishness. A selection of the population, let's call them the dangling liars, think that private medical matters should be public, that the standard of informed consent should be thrown out the door in favor of one-size-fits all solutions using experimental technologies, that a segregated society is a good thing, and that any  dissent needs to be suppressed. These people fundamentally believe that people are children, and incapable of making their own decisions.

Come on, man.  You dont want to kill Granny do you?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 10, 2021, 07:03:21 PM
I agree it's about childishness. A selection of the population, let's call them the dangling liars, think that private medical matters should be public
Aren't some people great? They ask you for a proof that you got a vaccine while a pandemic is raging and it is immediately compared with being forced to sell your own family to white slaves  ;D

(They already pry into your "private medical matters" every time they check your temperature before allowing you to enter a place, BTW. Yes, even when they do it with drones and you don't know about it).

Quote
that the standard of informed consent should be thrown out the door in favor of one-size-fits all solutions using experimental technologies
We could keep the World locked down for another year, agreed (only to shift the screams on "they took my freedom!!!" topics). And of course something tested on two billions people across the World for the last six months is nothing more than "experimental". I hear that they are actually importing aliens from Zeta Reticuli so to increase the pool of those "testing".

Quote
that a segregated society is a good thing
If it is mandated during a pandemic? Is this a trick question? Ships were quarantined and people barricaded themselves in remote places centuries before people knew what "germs" were.

Quote
and that any dissent needs to be suppressed.
No one needs to "suppress dissent": the COVID does it for you.

The effort against COVID is a war, pure and simple. And yet the country who, in any war it found itself in, "suppressed dissent" (like with "Wilson's Hardline Approach" in 1917, or the "social self-suppression" in the lead up to Iraq 2003), tried "experimental therapies" (Penicillin C was experimental during WWII), curtailed civil liberties and ignored civil rights (Lincoln suppressed the "Habeas Corpus" during the Civil War) and pried into medical records (McCarthy, amid other things, in the "War against Communism") - all of this usually amid a delirium of RAH! RAH! - can't understand that they are in a fight. They already paid a terrible price in human lives... and yet you can still find people clueless as why "The richest, advancestest and overall bestest country in the World!" had COVID running circles around it. Boy...

(Who knows? Maybe the real point of origin of COVID wasn't China but Vietnam).

I'm seriously considering a new rule for my CoC campaign. Since "Under a Winter Snow" is a scenario about the fear of a Spanish Flu resurgence in 1921's North Dakota, I'll have the players make an INT check. If they fail it, their characters will not believe in masks, social distance and quarantine measures. Stunningly clear proof that they were wrong will require another INT check, with a second failure meaning that this belief is permanent. "Unbelieving" characters will have to make a SAN check if forced to comply. Success will mean that they will fake compliance only to ditch the measures ASAP, failure will cause immediate "deranged rant" reactions and, if repeated, violent behaviour.

As the Keeper, I already know that I'll have to enforce these beliefs the way I enforce certain actions on insane characters - because, believe me, over here no one would behave that way, not even in a RPG.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 10, 2021, 07:12:38 PM
Isn't this a privately organized and run event? If so, what possible reason could you have for expecting them to bow to your opinions about vaccines? It's their event, so it's their rules. The end. If you don't like it, don't go.

That's what I posted. They're allowed to make whatever stupid, bone headed decisions they like. And I'm free to not go.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 10, 2021, 07:14:13 PM
I agree it's about childishness. A selection of the population, let's call them the dangling liars, think that private medical matters should be public, that the standard of informed consent should be thrown out the door in favor of one-size-fits all solutions using experimental technologies, that a segregated society is a good thing, and that any  dissent needs to be suppressed. These people fundamentally believe that people are children, and incapable of making their own decisions.

Come on, man.  You dont want to kill Granny do you?
Andrew Cuomo already did.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 10, 2021, 07:29:25 PM
(They already pry into your "private medical matters" every time they check your temperature before allowing you to enter a place, BTW. Yes, even when they do it with drones and you don't know about it).
Not equivalent, and you know it.

We could keep the World locked down for another year, agreed (only to shift the screams on "they took my freedom!!!" topics). And of course something tested on two billions people across the World for the last six months is nothing more than "experimental". I hear that they are actually importing aliens from Zeta Reticuli so to increase the pool of those "testing".

They're experimental. They're based on a novel technology. They're approved under an emergency authorization, not for general use. While they completed a fairly broad phase 3 testing and have been used on many people, they weren't tested for long enough to rule out any long term side effects. The companies involved have been granted blanket immunity. The known side effects are significant, with more incidents reported to VAERS than all other vaccines combined. There's a good argument that they're more dangerous than the disease itself for those who aren't elderly and don't have co-morbidities. Studies show that people who have had the disease will typically have stronger immunity than those with two shots, yet that's not being considered. Studies also suggest that taking a vaccine after already having covid can lead to more serious side effects. There are highly effective early-course treatments.

This is 101 stuff. You really should read something on the subject.

A better approach for something like a Con is to let people make their own choices. Covid-19 is background noise risk to most people, and those who are higher risk like the elderly and people with co-morbidities can make their own decisions. People who have high risk aversion, or who bought into the fear instead of the science, should probably stay at home because it will never be 100% safe. If the organizers want to do a symptom check at the door, like taking someone's temperature, and kick out people who start coughing, that's fine. They're addressing symptoms, not demanding people undergo experimental medical treatments. And by all means, encourage people who are showing symptoms to seek immediate medical help, and not wait and see. There are treatments that dramatically reduce risk, but only in the early stages.

If it is mandated during a pandemic? Is this a trick question? Ships were quarantined and people barricaded themselves in remote places centuries before people knew what "germs" were.
Quarantining the sick is one thing. Locking out healthy people with no symptoms is something else.

The effort against COVID is a war, pure and simple.
Just like the War against Drugs, or the War against Terror? Declaring something that isn't a war a war is a great way to convince people to give up civil liberties, isn't it?

I'm seriously considering a new rule for my CoC campaign. Since "Under a Winter Snow" is a scenario about the fear of a Spanish Flu resurgence in 1921's North Dakota, I'll have the players make an INT check. If they fail it, their characters will not believe in masks, social distance and quarantine measures. Stunningly clear proof that they were wrong will require another INT check, with a second failure meaning that this belief is permanent. "Unbelieving" characters will have to make a SAN check if forced to comply. Success will mean that they will fake compliance only to ditch the measures ASAP, failure will cause immediate "deranged rant" reactions and, if repeated, violent behaviour.
And you're a shitty GM, too.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Shasarak on June 10, 2021, 11:11:17 PM
I agree it's about childishness. A selection of the population, let's call them the dangling liars, think that private medical matters should be public, that the standard of informed consent should be thrown out the door in favor of one-size-fits all solutions using experimental technologies, that a segregated society is a good thing, and that any  dissent needs to be suppressed. These people fundamentally believe that people are children, and incapable of making their own decisions.

Come on, man.  You dont want to kill Granny do you?
Andrew Cuomo already did.

Cuomo was so good at killing Grannies he even got the ones in Seattle as well.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: trechriron on June 11, 2021, 03:45:41 AM
There is so much conspiracy theory, outright misinformation, nonsense, and fiction in this thread - it actually qualifies as its own RPG!

I hit quote and copied so many times reading this it crashed my clipboard.

Look -- you've worked yourself up guzzling Fox news, reading QAnon boards, and taking Trump's non-consensual sodomy without lube like drug addicts freebase coke -- as you stand here, pants down, bleeding from your nose, with your wild hair and sniffles, and you're trying to exclaim to everyone "it's a power grab! The pandemic is fake! The snake people are planting chips in your blood so they can establish a communist utopia on Earth!" - and then you want me to take you seriously AND consider you a macho man? Any 6th grader can look up the publicly available information on all this and come to sensible conclusions. Unless they meet you first.

I'm glad Dragonflight is requiring proof of vaccination. I have mine ready to go. Fully baked double house Phizer at your service! I feel fine. Just like I did after the 10 flu shots I've had, and the handful of Pneumonia vaccinations, and my Hep B vaccination (double dose over 3 months), and...

Everything should require proof of vaccination. If you can't be bothered to help society get healthy, you shouldn't be allowed in society. And you whiny cunts can pound your toxic-masculinity-lined-boob-sacs all you want. We don't give a shit. Start your own con you twat.

There was a time when conservatives championed capitalism, entrepreneurialism, common sense, self-reliance, and strong moral values. Now it's a bunch of wackos tilting at Dr. Fauci with a QAnon funnel in one ear and an Orange Clown Death Cult in the other. What happened to you?

Get vaccinated you bunch of crazy sissies. Grow up and come back to reality. You know, so we can hangout and play make-believe -- for fucks sake?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 11, 2021, 04:51:17 AM
There is so much conspiracy theory, outright misinformation, nonsense, and fiction in this thread - it actually qualifies as its own RPG!

I hit quote and copied so many times reading this it crashed my clipboard.

Look -- you've worked yourself up guzzling Fox news, reading QAnon boards, and taking Trump's non-consensual sodomy without lube like drug addicts freebase coke -- as you stand here, pants down, bleeding from your nose, with your wild hair and sniffles, and you're trying to exclaim to everyone "it's a power grab! The pandemic is fake! The snake people are planting chips in your blood so they can establish a communist utopia on Earth!" - and then you want me to take you seriously AND consider you a macho man? Any 6th grader can look up the publicly available information on all this and come to sensible conclusions. Unless they meet you first.

I'm glad Dragonflight is requiring proof of vaccination. I have mine ready to go. Fully baked double house Phizer at your service! I feel fine. Just like I did after the 10 flu shots I've had, and the handful of Pneumonia vaccinations, and my Hep B vaccination (double dose over 3 months), and...

Everything should require proof of vaccination. If you can't be bothered to help society get healthy, you shouldn't be allowed in society. And you whiny cunts can pound your toxic-masculinity-lined-boob-sacs all you want. We don't give a shit. Start your own con you twat.

There was a time when conservatives championed capitalism, entrepreneurialism, common sense, self-reliance, and strong moral values. Now it's a bunch of wackos tilting at Dr. Fauci with a QAnon funnel in one ear and an Orange Clown Death Cult in the other. What happened to you?

Get vaccinated you bunch of crazy sissies. Grow up and come back to reality. You know, so we can hangout and play make-believe -- for fucks sake?

You turned on the firehose, and there's a certain quality in quantity. But by just spewing everywhere and lack of imagination makes this a generic and forgettable rant. This is twitter grade stuff.
5/10. Room for improvement.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Anon Adderlan on June 11, 2021, 04:58:27 AM
why not insist on records of your polio vaccination, or TB or hey HIV status?

To be fair it's illegal to conceal your HIV status when it comes to activities which could transmit the disease in most states.

Everything should require proof of vaccination.

Why thou? And how would you manage such verification at events like this?

Anyone in America can now choose to get vaccinated at this point, and once you do the ones who don't are no longer a mortal threat to you. These extra demands are redundant for those who've been vaccinated, and those who believe otherwise never had faith in the science behind it anyway.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 11, 2021, 05:27:19 AM
   Always the first step to denying rights is to "declare war".   I will say this again though, if a Con is so concerned about vaccines, IMO they should not be having a Con.   The vaccine is experimental, I am glad the people here do not have any side effects and are healthy who received one.  I like to see where it goes with births down the road a few years, then I will have a better idea just how experimental it was/is.  I am also curious as to how well it works against what is certain to be a new strain coming round the globe in perpetuity from here on out.  Might be it is great, might be it was bad.  Calling people sissies is pretty funny too, somehow people willing to risk an infection are more afraid than people taking a vaccine because some people who stand to make a shitload of money told them to?   Upside down world.

    Any events that feel a need to show proof of shot though is not really ready to be open to the public.  Many, including myself have mentioned the huge numbers and crowds at Cons (no idea how crowded Dragon Con gets) and even with a substantial reduction it sure seems like an awful lot of people.   If you feel the vaccine protects you, go right ahead into the crowd IMO.  If you do not want a vaccine, then accept they can turn you away IMO.    I think a better answer, is vaccine (with unproven efficacy) or no vaccine (or even having had a strain already) its better to skip massive indoor gatherings for a while longer if you have any concerns around Covid.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 11, 2021, 07:00:58 AM
The effort against COVID is a war, pure and simple.
Just like the War against Drugs, or the War against Terror? Declaring something that isn't a war a war is a great way to convince people to give up civil liberties, isn't it?
I'll put this forward, both because I agree with your answer but it is a false equivalency.

True, declaring for something to be a war is a great way to convince people to give up civil liberties. However, both "The War Against Drugs" and "The War Against Terror" were, from the very beginning, vague actions with vague strategies against vague enemies. And, most importantly, without a definite endgame.

"War against COVID" has both a very definite enemy (a coronavirus) about which we actually know a lot (it is the specific variant that needed and still needs research) and a clear modern playbook (actually created by Bush Jr. after he read "The Great Influenza" by John M. Barry, about the Spanish Flu, and asked if the same thing could have happened today; and then further refined by Obama along with the creation of a standing "Pandemic First Response Team" - so it was a bi-partisan effort).

And we have a definite endgame: reopening the World. So, yes, the one against COVID is a war with a clear enemy, strategies, mobilization of resources and a clear goal. We even have past proof, like the "War Against Smallpox" that ended up eradicating smallpox from the planet.
Quote
They're experimental. They're based on a novel technology. They're approved under an emergency authorization, not for general use.
[snip]
This is 101 stuff. You really should read something on the subject.
I do read about the subject, but not only "something". This is the first time in history that all stops are eliminated by all nations from the process of finding a vaccine and then getting people vaccinated.

Why some people are unable to just stop and wonder "Why?" before blathering their pre-conceived ideas like if nothing special is happening?

Currently, the World had an infarction. Its lifeblood, the circulation of people and money, almost stopped. All human activities that required human contact - i.e. almost all of them - were curtailed, from working in a factory to going on a cruise or to see a movie. Before you say "Cruises are not essential!" remember: people losing their job in the entertainment sector will not spend their money to buy non-essential groceries. Shop owners will face closure, maybe default (all of this with the real possibility of medical bills piling up). This process is the same that Kickstarted the Great Depression in 1929.

The World never stopped like this. The great plagues of the past didn't stop it, because they circled the World in waves. The Two World Wars didn't stop it. The Spanish Flu didn't stop it - because back then the World wasn't as globalised as today. 9/11 didn't stop the World. But COVID did.

So, you pull out your playbook and... what do you read in it? Things known since primary school: masks, social distance, lockdowns, find a vaccine and get people vaccinated ASAP.

And people who were so lucky to never have lived in times where your government could draft you, give you a rifle and say "Go there and kill someone, or else" (something very unsafe, I assure you), look at two billions vaccinated over six months, a bunch of unavoidable bad reaction cases, and say "You know? I'll risk another year of living with COVID and the risk of catching it, cratered economy, lower general health, more deaths in the States than in all the wars they were in combined, and even all-around sanity loss (it is a given that the psychological effects of COVID will last much more than the pandemic itself). Amazing.
Quote
A better approach for something like a Con is to let people make their own choices.
This is already happening.
Quote
Covid-19 is background noise risk to most people
Honest question: when it was the last time that you put your noise outside your door and looked around? You really think that COVID is only about deaths? What about those afflicted by long-covid, their burden on their own family economy and on the healthcare system? What about the direct burden of COVID on the healthcare system? (you may have heard of the repeated "ICU crises"; now try to decode the acronym). What about those who lost their job? What if the dead family member was the bread winner? What about gigantic markets like entertainment or tourism and the ripple effects from their closure to the rest of the economy?
Quote
and those who are higher risk like the elderly and people with co-morbidities can make their own decisions.
Until their RAH RAH nephew goes to some "Freedom Convention" ("no masks, no social distancing, no vaccines required!") and brings COVID home to bite their ass.

Almost one year and half into this pandemic, and the very first warning they gave back in early 2020 (you can be asymptomatic but you can still be a carrier) still struggles to penetrate some skulls...  ::)
Quote
If it is mandated during a pandemic? Is this a trick question? Ships were quarantined and people barricaded themselves in remote places centuries before people knew what "germs" were.
Quarantining the sick is one thing. Locking out healthy people with no symptoms is something else.
During a pandemic caused by a virus that can make you infective while asymptomatic? Is this another trick question?

(Which was the reason why it exploded so hard in Italy: no one still knew about this specific characteristic of Covid-19. I still remember when I heard on the radio: "It has been confirmed that one can be positive and a source of infection up to seven days before showing symptoms." I felt my skin crawling. I could even tell you where I was and what I was doing when I heard this. The "viral bomb" exploded in Lombardy after a couple of days).
Quote
I'm seriously considering a new rule for my CoC campaign. Since "Under a Winter Snow" is a scenario about the fear of a Spanish Flu resurgence in 1921's North Dakota, I'll have the players make an INT check. If they fail it, their characters will not believe in masks, social distance and quarantine measures. Stunningly clear proof that they were wrong will require another INT check, with a second failure meaning that this belief is permanent. "Unbelieving" characters will have to make a SAN check if forced to comply. Success will mean that they will fake compliance only to ditch the measures ASAP, failure will cause immediate "deranged rant" reactions and, if repeated, violent behaviour.
And you're a shitty GM, too.
I feel that in CoC it is important to ground your characters in the realities of the time. Others' mileage may vary :D 
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: the crypt keeper on June 11, 2021, 09:14:02 AM
Requiring people to be vaccinated to attend a con is a means to prevent the transmission of Covid-19. If the health of your fellow humans are is a bridge to far I for one am glad such a selfish person will not be at a con I am attending. And this I don't want an experimental drug in your system is quite the bullshit. The hamburger you eat is extremely more toxic to your health then the achievements of modern science. This special snowflake entitlement is disgusting. Get over yourself get vaccinated and demonstrate on the most basic level you can be a productive member of society.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 11, 2021, 09:15:16 AM
And there goes 'my body, my choice', right off into the sunset.

Good job, folks.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: the crypt keeper on June 11, 2021, 09:19:58 AM

[/quote]

While less likely than the general populace - I don't think that's as solid as the vaccine.

Are there a bunch of anti-vaxxers on this board? I don't understand why getting a vaccine that may save your life and will help let society re-open is such a burden that you would avoid going to a gaming con that you otherwise would like to.
[/quote]
Because if they admit they are incorrect (read wrong) about one thing it calls into question their whole rotten ideology based on selfishness and me-ism. Cognitive Dissonance is a bitch. Tender egos get wiped out by apprehending your current reality clearly.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: the crypt keeper on June 11, 2021, 09:22:07 AM
And there goes 'my body, my choice', right off into the sunset.

Good job, folks.

No one is saying you have to get a vaccine. Just like no one needs to be forced in a closed space with your dumb ass. If you choose to not be vaccinated be prepared for the consequences, like right-minded people not wanting you breathing near them.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: the crypt keeper on June 11, 2021, 09:27:15 AM
There is so much conspiracy theory, outright misinformation, nonsense, and fiction in this thread - it actually qualifies as its own RPG!

I hit quote and copied so many times reading this it crashed my clipboard.

Look -- you've worked yourself up guzzling Fox news, reading QAnon boards, and taking Trump's non-consensual sodomy without lube like drug addicts freebase coke -- as you stand here, pants down, bleeding from your nose, with your wild hair and sniffles, and you're trying to exclaim to everyone "it's a power grab! The pandemic is fake! The snake people are planting chips in your blood so they can establish a communist utopia on Earth!" - and then you want me to take you seriously AND consider you a macho man? Any 6th grader can look up the publicly available information on all this and come to sensible conclusions. Unless they meet you first.

I'm glad Dragonflight is requiring proof of vaccination. I have mine ready to go. Fully baked double house Phizer at your service! I feel fine. Just like I did after the 10 flu shots I've had, and the handful of Pneumonia vaccinations, and my Hep B vaccination (double dose over 3 months), and...

Everything should require proof of vaccination. If you can't be bothered to help society get healthy, you shouldn't be allowed in society. And you whiny cunts can pound your toxic-masculinity-lined-boob-sacs all you want. We don't give a shit. Start your own con you twat.

There was a time when conservatives championed capitalism, entrepreneurialism, common sense, self-reliance, and strong moral values. Now it's a bunch of wackos tilting at Dr. Fauci with a QAnon funnel in one ear and an Orange Clown Death Cult in the other. What happened to you?

Get vaccinated you bunch of crazy sissies. Grow up and come back to reality. You know, so we can hangout and play make-believe -- for fucks sake?

Should be quoted and posted at the top of each page of this thread!
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 11, 2021, 09:33:39 AM
And there goes 'my body, my choice', right off into the sunset.

Good job, folks.
So, when will your campaign to suppress laws against DUIing start?  :D
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 11, 2021, 09:48:50 AM
And there goes 'my body, my choice', right off into the sunset.

Good job, folks.
Yep.

The number of people lining up for jackboots in this thread is appalling.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 11, 2021, 09:55:06 AM
That's right, hammer out those snotty rejoinders.

So here's a question: If you're vaccinated, and I'm not, how exactly am I a threat to you?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 11, 2021, 09:57:52 AM
Just for reference, this is the very first principle in the Nuremberg Code, which established the absolute minimum standards physicians must follow when experimenting on human subjects. It's been adopted worldwide.

Quote from: http://www.cirp.org/library/ethics/nuremberg/
1. The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential. This means that the person involved should have legal capacity to give consent; should be so situated as to be able to exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior form of constraint or coercion; and should have sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved as to enable him to make an understanding and enlightened decision.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Primarch_XI on June 11, 2021, 10:00:11 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 11, 2021, 10:08:04 AM
That's right, hammer out those snotty rejoinders.

So here's a question: If you're vaccinated, and I'm not, how exactly am I a threat to you?

You've got (insert leftist buzzword) cooties.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 11, 2021, 10:22:53 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.

Sadly, we live in times where a question strictly belonging to medical science applied to RPG-loving, like "Is it fair for Conventions to ask for a proof of vaccination when held during a pandemic?" (not before, not after, not anything else), has become part of an inane political debate.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ghostmaker on June 11, 2021, 10:25:35 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.
Agreed. I'm withdrawing from this before Pundit gets mad. If anyone wants to continue this, take it over to the other subforum.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Omega on June 11, 2021, 10:33:13 AM
That's right, hammer out those snotty rejoinders.

So here's a question: If you're vaccinated, and I'm not, how exactly am I a threat to you?

Wish Kat were still alive as I could just ask her these things and get a competent answer.

But at a guess. A: You arent a threat to vaccinated people. You are potentially threatened by anyone else at the con not vaccinated and carrying, or who picked it up on the way. And if you get it then its going to potentially spread to anyone else not vaccinated.

Or think of it in game terms. Its not the characters immune to the mutating magic curse you have to worry about. Its the ones that can and probably will mutate that you have to worry about. This is probably how the blue drow came to be.  8)

At the end of the day though its their con and their rules. Or the venues rules the con has to abide. Or state rules the venue and the con have to abide. I've been to two that for example had a no alcohol rule. In one case that was the hotels rule. And in the other case because the con manager didnt like it and so set the rules.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: KingCheops on June 11, 2021, 10:40:27 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.

QFT.  This can't stay on track.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 11, 2021, 11:20:48 AM
Yes, it is indeed time to spout off a final insult, whilst bemoaning how off topic the thread has become!
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Kyle Aaron on June 11, 2021, 11:25:08 AM
What business is it of a con whether I've been vaccinated
Well, gamers are a high-risk group...  ;D

It's sort of odd they'd require proof of vaccination to attend. After all, if you're unvaccinated you'll only be a threat to the health of other unvaccinated people. And those other unvaccinated people are either mitigating their risks in other ways, or have chosen not to be vaccinated. So...?

Do you need to show some condoms in your wallet in case you get lucky in the cosplay room?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 11, 2021, 11:59:38 AM
Requiring people to be vaccinated to attend a con is a means to prevent the transmission of Covid-19. If the health of your fellow humans are is a bridge to far I for one am glad such a selfish person will not be at a con I am attending. And this I don't want an experimental drug in your system is quite the bullshit. The hamburger you eat is extremely more toxic to your health then the achievements of modern science. This special snowflake entitlement is disgusting. Get over yourself get vaccinated and demonstrate on the most basic level you can be a productive member of society.

  The good news is you will be able to attend a con where there are only people like you, who are concerned for their fellow man.  The bad news is, there will still be a bunch of fat folks there, and that is going to kill them at a higher rate than Covid ever could.  As you are concerned with your fellow man, maybe you could go about and limit soda and chili cheese fries intake?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Pat on June 11, 2021, 12:13:24 PM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.
Agreed. I'm withdrawing from this before Pundit gets mad. If anyone wants to continue this, take it over to the other subforum.
Yeah, I'm going to drop it, too. Though I would argue that that the discussion is directly relevant to the topic, but it does feel like it's going to drown out anything else.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: ScytheSong on June 11, 2021, 12:57:03 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: oggsmash on June 11, 2021, 01:19:19 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

   The thin margins are one reason I have to question the business decision to have a Con.  Even if in a perfect world all potential attendees got a vaccine, and no one got the bug.   They will still limit attendance a good deal as a precaution.  Exactly how are they going to make money if they operate on thin margins by having a considerably smaller crowd?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 11, 2021, 01:26:23 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

So what are the odds of proving you got COVID at the convention? Unless you can get contact tracing from everyone you interacted with, it's going to be tough.

IMO the best policy is to state on the tickets that you assume responsibility and the venue or event is not responsible.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Wntrlnd on June 11, 2021, 01:52:07 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

So what are the odds of proving you got COVID at the convention? Unless you can get contact tracing from everyone you interacted with, it's going to be tough.

IMO the best policy is to state on the tickets that you assume responsibility and the venue or event is not responsible.

I am no means a legal expert. However, from what I know, the burden of proof is much lower in a civil case than a criminal case.
In a criminal case you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt (100%) but in a civil case it is enough if most of the jurors are convinced of someones guilt.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: GeekyBugle on June 11, 2021, 01:59:49 PM
Danger-Con sounds more and more appealing, someone needs to make it a reality.

Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: SHARK on June 11, 2021, 02:44:42 PM
And there goes 'my body, my choice', right off into the sunset.

Good job, folks.
Yep.

The number of people lining up for jackboots in this thread is appalling.

Greetings!

Hi, Pat! I know the topics are serious.

However, when I read your comment here, I rolled laughing. So fucking true, all the pod-people so eager to get them a pair of Jackboots! ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 11, 2021, 03:07:14 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

So what are the odds of proving you got COVID at the convention? Unless you can get contact tracing from everyone you interacted with, it's going to be tough.

IMO the best policy is to state on the tickets that you assume responsibility and the venue or event is not responsible.

I am no means a legal expert. However, from what I know, the burden of proof is much lower in a civil case than a criminal case.
In a criminal case you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt (100%) but in a civil case it is enough if most of the jurors are convinced of someones guilt.

IIRC, the term is "preponderance of evidence" Not as high a bar as beyond reasonable doubt, but still a pretty high bar.

Besides, if a venue can assume no responsibility for the car they parked in their parking lot because they posted a disclaimer in fine print, I doubt they will be held responsible if they give apt warning to prospective Con goers.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 11, 2021, 03:29:51 PM
And there goes 'my body, my choice', right off into the sunset.

Good job, folks.
Yep.

The number of people lining up for jackboots in this thread is appalling.

Greetings!

Hi, Pat! I know the topics are serious.

However, when I read your comment here, I rolled laughing. So fucking true, all the pod-people so eager to get them a pair of Jackboots! ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

I'm watching Italy - Turkey, the opening game of the 2020 European Soccer Championship. It is held at the Stadio Olimpico in Rome. It has seats for 70,000 spectators but only 16,000 were admitted. You can see them wearing masks and social distancing (dunno about vaccines). And yet the feeling of seeing again a soccer match with supporters (2,100 of them from Turkey they said) is so... dunno, the idea that we are returning to normalcy after a long fight. For the first time I feel optimistic. Time will tell.

These jackboots are really smart this time. They are wearing rubber on their soles, so that no one can hear them.

BTW, can't wait for the Second SS Division "Das Reich" to appear in the stands (I'm told that we are headed that way). I always dreamed to see a real Tiger tank in action! And...

BOY! Miracle by the Turkish goalkeeper! :( Sorry, see you later!
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Ratman_tf on June 11, 2021, 03:34:07 PM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.
Agreed. I'm withdrawing from this before Pundit gets mad. If anyone wants to continue this, take it over to the other subforum.
Yeah, I'm going to drop it, too. Though I would argue that that the discussion is directly relevant to the topic, but it does feel like it's going to drown out anything else.

In order to discuss the con policy, we have to discuss the vaccinations themselves.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 11, 2021, 03:53:43 PM
Have there been any successful lawsuits against events/establishments for acquiring coronavirus while on premise?
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: ScytheSong on June 11, 2021, 04:12:13 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

So what are the odds of proving you got COVID at the convention? Unless you can get contact tracing from everyone you interacted with, it's going to be tough.

IMO the best policy is to state on the tickets that you assume responsibility and the venue or event is not responsible.

Note that I said "a lawsuit" not "a successful lawsuit." Just trying to pay for lawyers to defend themselves would have bankrupted the conventions I was familiar with (Norwes, Rusty, Ory).
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Godsmonkey on June 11, 2021, 05:23:10 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

So what are the odds of proving you got COVID at the convention? Unless you can get contact tracing from everyone you interacted with, it's going to be tough.

IMO the best policy is to state on the tickets that you assume responsibility and the venue or event is not responsible.

Note that I said "a lawsuit" not "a successful lawsuit." Just trying to pay for lawyers to defend themselves would have bankrupted the conventions I was familiar with (Norwes, Rusty, Ory).

Fair point.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 11, 2021, 06:32:13 PM
Well, since this is a role-playing forum, I'll role-play SHARK  :D

Greetings!

Yo, Pat! What the Italian REGIME just pulled was EPIC!

They tied an event with mandatory masks, reduced venues, social distancing and all other sanitary dictatorship means to THE RETURN OF THE ITALIAN SOCCER TEAM!

You know how Italians are! First there is their Mom, then their Team, then their Mom, then their Team, and lastly Spaghetti.

And the Italian team WON. 3 - 0 against Turkey, so everybody and their Mom is happy! "The REGIME is right!" they are saying on television, LOL!

Good partying with your vino and your "tricolore" masks!! Tomorrow you will wake up with an hangover and the Nazis governing you! Best to start exercising! Nazi camp uniforms will not fit if you have a big pancia! Just imagining the lazy Italians trying to escape with the microchips running in their bodies makes me rolling laughing! LOL!!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

(OK, that was not perfect. I have to refine it a bit, but I think I nailed more or less everything...)

P.S. LOL!  ;D
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Shasarak on June 11, 2021, 08:20:34 PM
Well, since this is a role-playing forum, I'll role-play SHARK  :D

Greetings!

Yo, Pat! What the Italian REGIME just pulled was EPIC!

They tied an event with mandatory masks, reduced venues, social distancing and all other sanitary dictatorship means to THE RETURN OF THE ITALIAN SOCCER TEAM!

You know how Italians are! First there is their Mom, then their Team, then their Mom, then their Team, and lastly Spaghetti.

And the Italian team WON. 3 - 0 against Turkey, so everybody and their Mom is happy! "The REGIME is right!" they are saying on television, LOL!

Good partying with your vino and your "tricolore" masks!! Tomorrow you will wake up with an hangover and the Nazis governing you! Best to start exercising! Nazi camp uniforms will not fit if you have a big pancia! Just imagining the lazy Italians trying to escape with the microchips running in their bodies makes me rolling laughing! LOL!!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

(OK, that was not perfect. I have to refine it a bit, but I think I nailed more or less everything...)

P.S. LOL!  ;D

Needs more cock sucking Marxists.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Darrin Kelley on June 11, 2021, 08:50:31 PM
Over 25 years ago, I attended Dragonflight with a vendor. And I got a good hunk of event participation from it. It was around the time Champions 4th Edition was released. And I had my copy and notebooks with me. And I got in a few good games.

My view of the convention itself? Great. But I would have liked to have been there when I actually had some money.

They kept sending me new convention announcements for about 10 years after I moved to Southern California.

Compared to other conventions I had been at? I'd give Dragonflight high marks. They were as old school as it gets.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: SHARK on June 11, 2021, 09:18:49 PM
Well, since this is a role-playing forum, I'll role-play SHARK  :D

Greetings!

Yo, Pat! What the Italian REGIME just pulled was EPIC!

They tied an event with mandatory masks, reduced venues, social distancing and all other sanitary dictatorship means to THE RETURN OF THE ITALIAN SOCCER TEAM!

You know how Italians are! First there is their Mom, then their Team, then their Mom, then their Team, and lastly Spaghetti.

And the Italian team WON. 3 - 0 against Turkey, so everybody and their Mom is happy! "The REGIME is right!" they are saying on television, LOL!

Good partying with your vino and your "tricolore" masks!! Tomorrow you will wake up with an hangover and the Nazis governing you! Best to start exercising! Nazi camp uniforms will not fit if you have a big pancia! Just imagining the lazy Italians trying to escape with the microchips running in their bodies makes me rolling laughing! LOL!!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

(OK, that was not perfect. I have to refine it a bit, but I think I nailed more or less everything...)

P.S. LOL!  ;D

Greetings!

*Laughing* That post is hilarious, Reckall! ;D

I almost choked on my coffee laughing. Pretty neat how you mixed in aspects of serious political commentary, with a side of humour and fun! I try to not take things in life too seriously. At some point, regardless of a particular political/social topic, it can get very frustrating and even depressing. I like that you have a sense of humour, Reckall.

Cheers!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: SHARK on June 11, 2021, 09:20:50 PM
Well, since this is a role-playing forum, I'll role-play SHARK  :D

Greetings!

Yo, Pat! What the Italian REGIME just pulled was EPIC!

They tied an event with mandatory masks, reduced venues, social distancing and all other sanitary dictatorship means to THE RETURN OF THE ITALIAN SOCCER TEAM!

You know how Italians are! First there is their Mom, then their Team, then their Mom, then their Team, and lastly Spaghetti.

And the Italian team WON. 3 - 0 against Turkey, so everybody and their Mom is happy! "The REGIME is right!" they are saying on television, LOL!

Good partying with your vino and your "tricolore" masks!! Tomorrow you will wake up with an hangover and the Nazis governing you! Best to start exercising! Nazi camp uniforms will not fit if you have a big pancia! Just imagining the lazy Italians trying to escape with the microchips running in their bodies makes me rolling laughing! LOL!!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

(OK, that was not perfect. I have to refine it a bit, but I think I nailed more or less everything...)

P.S. LOL!  ;D

Needs more cock sucking Marxists.

Greetings!

Yes, Shasarak, my friend. That's for when I get angry at things...especially, well, you know who, by now, heh? ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Reckall on June 12, 2021, 11:09:38 AM
Well, since this is a role-playing forum, I'll role-play SHARK  :D

Greetings!

Yo, Pat! What the Italian REGIME just pulled was EPIC!

They tied an event with mandatory masks, reduced venues, social distancing and all other sanitary dictatorship means to THE RETURN OF THE ITALIAN SOCCER TEAM!

You know how Italians are! First there is their Mom, then their Team, then their Mom, then their Team, and lastly Spaghetti.

And the Italian team WON. 3 - 0 against Turkey, so everybody and their Mom is happy! "The REGIME is right!" they are saying on television, LOL!

Good partying with your vino and your "tricolore" masks!! Tomorrow you will wake up with an hangover and the Nazis governing you! Best to start exercising! Nazi camp uniforms will not fit if you have a big pancia! Just imagining the lazy Italians trying to escape with the microchips running in their bodies makes me rolling laughing! LOL!!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

(OK, that was not perfect. I have to refine it a bit, but I think I nailed more or less everything...)

P.S. LOL!  ;D

Needs more cock sucking Marxists.

Not with the Mom present. No.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: Anon Adderlan on June 13, 2021, 02:41:27 PM
Which was the reason why it exploded so hard in Italy

Meanwhile in Spain... (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/love-of-lesbian-concert-barcelona-palau-sant-jordi/)
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: horsesoldier on June 14, 2021, 08:37:46 AM
Ah, yes, they were wearing the special masks and only took them off when eating or drinking! These Spaniards deserve a round of applause; not a single person rubbed their nose or talked with the mask off or anything like that.
Title: Re: Dragonflight convention requires mRNA vaccination
Post by: KingCheops on June 14, 2021, 10:23:42 AM
Kung flu.  So woke, such brave.