That's right, hammer out those snotty rejoinders.

So here's a question: If you're vaccinated, and I'm not, how exactly am I a threat to you?

Just for reference, this is the very first principle in the Nuremberg Code, which established the absolute minimum standards physicians must follow when experimenting on human subjects. It's been adopted worldwide.

Quote from: http://www.cirp.org/library/ethics/nuremberg/1. The voluntary consent of the human subject is absolutely essential. This means that the person involved should have legal capacity to give consent; should be so situated as to be able to exercise free power of choice, without the intervention of any element of force, fraud, deceit, duress, overreaching, or other ulterior form of constraint or coercion; and should have sufficient knowledge and comprehension of the elements of the subject matter involved as to enable him to make an understanding and enlightened decision.

This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on June 11, 2021, 09:55:06 AM
That's right, hammer out those snotty rejoinders.

So here's a question: If you're vaccinated, and I'm not, how exactly am I a threat to you?

You've got (insert leftist buzzword) cooties.

Quote from: Primarch_XI on June 11, 2021, 10:00:11 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.

Sadly, we live in times where a question strictly belonging to medical science applied to RPG-loving, like "Is it fair for Conventions to ask for a proof of vaccination when held during a pandemic?" (not before, not after, not anything else), has become part of an inane political debate.

Quote from: Primarch_XI on June 11, 2021, 10:00:11 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.

Agreed. I'm withdrawing from this before Pundit gets mad. If anyone wants to continue this, take it over to the other subforum.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on June 11, 2021, 09:55:06 AM
That's right, hammer out those snotty rejoinders.

So here's a question: If you're vaccinated, and I'm not, how exactly am I a threat to you?

Wish Kat were still alive as I could just ask her these things and get a competent answer.

But at a guess. A: You arent a threat to vaccinated people. You are potentially threatened by anyone else at the con not vaccinated and carrying, or who picked it up on the way. And if you get it then its going to potentially spread to anyone else not vaccinated.

Or think of it in game terms. Its not the characters immune to the mutating magic curse you have to worry about. Its the ones that can and probably will mutate that you have to worry about. This is probably how the blue drow came to be. 

At the end of the day though its their con and their rules. Or the venues rules the con has to abide. Or state rules the venue and the con have to abide. I've been to two that for example had a no alcohol rule. In one case that was the hotels rule. And in the other case because the con manager didnt like it and so set the rules.

Quote from: Primarch_XI on June 11, 2021, 10:00:11 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.

QFT.  This can't stay on track.

Yes, it is indeed time to spout off a final insult, whilst bemoaning how off topic the thread has become!

Quote from: Eirikrautha on June 06, 2021, 11:31:25 PM
What business is it of a con whether I've been vaccinated

Well, gamers are a high-risk group... 

It's sort of odd they'd require proof of vaccination to attend. After all, if you're unvaccinated you'll only be a threat to the health of other unvaccinated people. And those other unvaccinated people are either mitigating their risks in other ways, or have chosen not to be vaccinated. So...?

Do you need to show some condoms in your wallet in case you get lucky in the cosplay room?

Quote from: the crypt keeper on June 11, 2021, 09:14:02 AM
Requiring people to be vaccinated to attend a con is a means to prevent the transmission of Covid-19. If the health of your fellow humans are is a bridge to far I for one am glad such a selfish person will not be at a con I am attending. And this I don't want an experimental drug in your system is quite the bullshit. The hamburger you eat is extremely more toxic to your health then the achievements of modern science. This special snowflake entitlement is disgusting. Get over yourself get vaccinated and demonstrate on the most basic level you can be a productive member of society.

  The good news is you will be able to attend a con where there are only people like you, who are concerned for their fellow man.  The bad news is, there will still be a bunch of fat folks there, and that is going to kill them at a higher rate than Covid ever could.  As you are concerned with your fellow man, maybe you could go about and limit soda and chili cheese fries intake?

Quote from: Ghostmaker on June 11, 2021, 10:25:35 AM

Quote from: Primarch_XI on June 11, 2021, 10:00:11 AM
This is a political thread pretending to be an RPG thread with only a tangential RPG convention link.

Agreed. I'm withdrawing from this before Pundit gets mad. If anyone wants to continue this, take it over to the other subforum.

Yeah, I'm going to drop it, too. Though I would argue that that the discussion is directly relevant to the topic, but it does feel like it's going to drown out anything else.

Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

Quote from: ScytheSong on June 11, 2021, 12:57:03 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

   The thin margins are one reason I have to question the business decision to have a Con.  Even if in a perfect world all potential attendees got a vaccine, and no one got the bug.   They will still limit attendance a good deal as a precaution.  Exactly how are they going to make money if they operate on thin margins by having a considerably smaller crowd?

Quote from: ScytheSong on June 11, 2021, 12:57:03 PM
Think of it from the point of view of the convention organizers. Most conventions operate on razor-thin margins and the abuse of volunteers. If they don't have rules in place and even one person catches COVID there, a lawsuit would destroy the convention. So the volunteer with a law degree says, "if we require everyone to be vaccinated, they can't sue us for getting COVID at our event." QED.

So what are the odds of proving you got COVID at the convention? Unless you can get contact tracing from everyone you interacted with, it's going to be tough.

IMO the best policy is to state on the tickets that you assume responsibility and the venue or event is not responsible.