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Author Topic: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian  (Read 15212 times)

WillInNewHaven

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #105 on: November 11, 2020, 06:33:48 PM »
Titanic Thompson said it well: "Suckers got no business with their money."

Thanks for that... :) :) ;D

I am very skeptical about the whole Kickstarter idea.

Wicked Woodpecker of West
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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #106 on: November 11, 2020, 08:29:17 PM »
Quote
I can't ask for a refund.  I went in for the pdfs and those are nearly all delivered.  Overall, I've been pretty happy with what they've produced.  Honestly, I'm not even upset with the changes.  I just hate how they did it.

If they hadn't made an announcement of "look at this great thing we did" I never would have known.  I download the draft copies and flip through them, then go back and get the final versions.  But who the heck would compare them side-by-side?  They just had to make it a virtue signal.

Indeed. I definitely agree.
And I have no problem with them showing more wide approach towards cultures Howard's only mentioned a little overall.
But signalling is just sour. Nevertheless I'm still going to use those books - they are overall good.

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The third one with the guyliner wearing Conan, I'm not sure who that one was for. Certainly not me.

I totally prefered Momoa overall as Conan, but this film was just unholy stupid mess.

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As an actual Native American with blond hair and blue eyes, that actually offends me quite a bit...I guess these people have only seen Hollywood Indians or the South American/Southwest tribes or something.

Then of course such colouring is almost certainly sign of European ancestry.
That's saying why we even assume someone called Goldmoon must be N.A.



Rob Necronomicon

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #107 on: November 11, 2020, 09:30:50 PM »
Not that I want to hijack the thread and turn it into a thread about Martial Arts. But as you asked... :)

I don't mind partly turning it into a martial arts thread.  I moved here from ENWorld and RPG.net because of SJW idiocies, but that doesn't mean that's what I always want to talk about.

Since you sound knowledgeable, what would you recommend as a practical martial art for use outside the dojo?  I'm always looking to learn new things and was considering Krav Maga as my next step, which you seem not to care for.  Past experience is hapkido, ishinryu, tang soo do, and bits and pieces of a lot of other styles.

Same question to anyone who's interested in putting in their two bits.

 
If you already know how to poke someone in the eyes and kick nuts, I think KM loses some value.  I would say you already know how to kick and punch, try Judo or BJJ.  People constantly say some pretty silly things like "You dont want to be rolling around...."  But the fact is, you might be rolling around when you didnt want to be, and the other one is, if I am good at BJJ and you are not, the amount of "rolling around" is going to be me strangling you to limbo in about 5-6 seconds.   That is about all the rolling you offer me if you are clueless.


When it comes to 'reality' you should train for every event (or as much as you can through crises rehearsal). That includes going to the ground. So, should you be dragged to the floor you'll be able to deal with it. Being on the ground is always a secondary option, and never a primary one. You're always going to train for counter weapons too, even though in my country meeting a person with a gun is very very unlikely. Knives are more probable. Again, if someone does have a blade going to ground with would be a deadly affair.

No system is perfect and Murphy's Law is ever present. Best thing anyone can do is practice under full contact and one will soon see what works and what does'nt.



Attack-minded and dangerously so - W.E. Fairbairn.
youtube shit:www.youtube.com/channel/UCt1l7oq7EmlfLT6UEG8MLeg

Innocent Smith

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #108 on: November 12, 2020, 03:38:01 AM »
This entire thing is an exercise on looking for things to be offended by, but none more than this...

Quote
For example, the “Martial Arts” talent tree title was changed to reflect our editorial view, as associated unarmed combat with eastern peoples has a poor tradition of Orientalism within the hobby, when there are counterparts all over the world. Instead they are now called “Unarmed” techniques.

Why, yes... there is a broad variety of combat styles and techniques--both armed and unarmed--all over the world, not just in eastern countries. And they are all called and fall under the category of:

Martial Arts

The subject of "Martial Arts" is not just limited to unarmed techniques or Eastern styles, but applies to ALL combat forms. And there're ALL called "Martial Arts", since acronyms like "HEMA" (Historical European MARTIAL ARTS). "Martial Arts" is not even an eastern language term.

You mongoloids.

You mean to tell me the thing named after a Roman god isn't exclusively Asian?

Wicked Woodpecker of West
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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #109 on: November 12, 2020, 05:32:22 AM »
Or maybe consultant didn't want to have anything to do with wicked cruel european war gods?

Ghostmaker

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #110 on: November 12, 2020, 07:51:56 AM »
There was a whole thread about Dragonlance over at ENworld where multiple posters were saying the portrayal of Goldmoon in Dragonlance art as a blonde white skinned native american was racist.  I pointed out that the whole progressive issue with Elizabeth Warren's DNA test which blew back on her, was because she was supposedly doing the exact same thing those posters were doing - treating Native American identity as an issue of biology.

As an actual Native American with blond hair and blue eyes, that actually offends me quite a bit...I guess these people have only seen Hollywood Indians or the South American/Southwest tribes or something.
Everyone knows that North America was littered with gangs of Vikings wandering around beating up the natives*.

* yes, this was part of the lore of Werewolf: Wild West, and my group found it absolutely ridiculous.

Armchair Gamer

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #111 on: November 12, 2020, 09:26:35 AM »
That's saying why we even assume someone called Goldmoon must be N.A.

   In fairness, everything about Goldmoon's background and culture was N.A.-inspired and derived, and her appearance was unusual for her people. Then again, since the Plainsmen of Ansalon weren't isolated from the other cultures, the possibility of ancestral genetics from another ethnic group is highly plausible.

  (Ansalon's diversity is interesting--for a continent smaller than Australia, it has white, black, and American Indianesque residents, with no indication of migration from elsewhere. And this has been part of the setting since 1984.)

oggsmash

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #112 on: November 12, 2020, 09:29:07 AM »
Not that I want to hijack the thread and turn it into a thread about Martial Arts. But as you asked... :)

I don't mind partly turning it into a martial arts thread.  I moved here from ENWorld and RPG.net because of SJW idiocies, but that doesn't mean that's what I always want to talk about.

Since you sound knowledgeable, what would you recommend as a practical martial art for use outside the dojo?  I'm always looking to learn new things and was considering Krav Maga as my next step, which you seem not to care for.  Past experience is hapkido, ishinryu, tang soo do, and bits and pieces of a lot of other styles.

Same question to anyone who's interested in putting in their two bits.

 
If you already know how to poke someone in the eyes and kick nuts, I think KM loses some value.  I would say you already know how to kick and punch, try Judo or BJJ.  People constantly say some pretty silly things like "You dont want to be rolling around...."  But the fact is, you might be rolling around when you didnt want to be, and the other one is, if I am good at BJJ and you are not, the amount of "rolling around" is going to be me strangling you to limbo in about 5-6 seconds.   That is about all the rolling you offer me if you are clueless.


When it comes to 'reality' you should train for every event (or as much as you can through crises rehearsal). That includes going to the ground. So, should you be dragged to the floor you'll be able to deal with it. Being on the ground is always a secondary option, and never a primary one. You're always going to train for counter weapons too, even though in my country meeting a person with a gun is very very unlikely. Knives are more probable. Again, if someone does have a blade going to ground with would be a deadly affair.

No system is perfect and Murphy's Law is ever present. Best thing anyone can do is practice under full contact and one will soon see what works and what does'nt.

   A Blade is deadly wherever you are.  Period.  I would say though, the only reason I would say going to the ground is worse on the scale of deadly, is because I have eliminated the option to run.  IF you fight a person who knows what they are doing with a knife, and you have no weapon, you are up shit creek.  If you know you are doing and they do not, and they are committed in attack, you are still likely to bleed, alot.   The only upside is it is not a gun, and a person does make more power with it, stopping power (liver, kidney, heart, etc) thrusts are easier to get with full leverage (meaning standing),  So you will get cut up grappling a person with a knife....but guess what, if they have a knife and you do not, you are likley to get cut up anyway. So I agree regarding train the best you can, and most of the time I spend grappling more these days has more to do with impact being harder on the joints than what I feel if most practical for a street scenario.  Because the true reality is, the "street scenario" is extremely, extremely rare in a first world nation unless you just want to fight in bars, or you go to too many "peaceful protests".

Rob Necronomicon

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #113 on: November 12, 2020, 10:31:27 AM »
A Blade is deadly wherever you are.  Period.  I would say though, the only reason I would say going to the ground is worse on the scale of deadly, is because I have eliminated the option to run.  IF you fight a person who knows what they are doing with a knife, and you have no weapon, you are up shit creek.  If you know you are doing and they do not, and they are committed in attack, you are still likely to bleed, alot.   The only upside is it is not a gun, and a person does make more power with it, stopping power (liver, kidney, heart, etc) thrusts are easier to get with full leverage (meaning standing),  So you will get cut up grappling a person with a knife....but guess what, if they have a knife and you do not, you are likley to get cut up anyway. So I agree regarding train the best you can, and most of the time I spend grappling more these days has more to do with impact being harder on the joints than what I feel if most practical for a street scenario.  Because the true reality is, the "street scenario" is extremely, extremely rare in a first world nation unless you just want to fight in bars, or you go to too many "peaceful protests".

Grappling certainly has it's place no doubt about it. But tactically its the worst place to go unless you've no other option or get dragged down.
There's lots of things to consider:
Dangerous uneven surface.
The concrete is effing hard, and if you go down badly you could be looking at an injury. No light canvas to break your fall.
Detritus - Broken bottles, syringes, etc.
Also, if there are two assailants. His mate could stab you or kick you to death while you're engaged - that actually happened some years back to UFC guy (got stabbed by the opponent's mate from behind).
You're critical focus will be compromised and focused on one opponent (tunnel vision, adrenaline, etc).
Compromises one's ability to escape.

Like I said, you train for it but you don't aim for it.

Re. Knives, a person who 'really knows' what they are doing with a knife - Then you can pretty much kiss your ass goodbye. AKA - a two handed knife fighter. Someone who uses their 'off hand' in order to use their main hand to stab. Mind you, even a drooling drunk lunatic with absolutely no training whatsoever is still very deadly. Especially if they panic. They will go sewing machine on your ass (especially if you try and hold them).

In all honesty, to this date, I've never seen ANY system that can deal with a knife 100%. Yeah, you might very well get cut - It's about mitigating the damage by attempting to cover your vital areas. Easier said then done of course. However, there are some principals that are light years ahead of that Kratty Fu shit where they just simply pluck the knife out of the air. LOL. I'd love to see someone try that outside the Dojo against a committed knife wielder with real intent.

Running is always the best option... As I said before. Fighting is a mugs game, best reserved for the school yard and scum bags. Unfortunately, even in a 1st world country there are still plenty of violent scum who venture into nice places. I know many people who've been violent attacked in Dublin city for doing nothing more than minding their own business (some even in broad daylight with lots of folks about). And it's only going to get worse as the economy takes another nosedive with this whole pandemic thing. Shite bags have got to have their drug money.

Also, if it's part of your occupation you don't always have the option of running or walking away. For example I worked as a bouncer for three years in the UK to put myself through art college (in my twenties). I never had the option of just walking away unfortunately. Luckily we had a good team of guys.














 
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youtube shit:www.youtube.com/channel/UCt1l7oq7EmlfLT6UEG8MLeg

oggsmash

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #114 on: November 12, 2020, 10:55:22 AM »
A Blade is deadly wherever you are.  Period.  I would say though, the only reason I would say going to the ground is worse on the scale of deadly, is because I have eliminated the option to run.  IF you fight a person who knows what they are doing with a knife, and you have no weapon, you are up shit creek.  If you know you are doing and they do not, and they are committed in attack, you are still likely to bleed, alot.   The only upside is it is not a gun, and a person does make more power with it, stopping power (liver, kidney, heart, etc) thrusts are easier to get with full leverage (meaning standing),  So you will get cut up grappling a person with a knife....but guess what, if they have a knife and you do not, you are likley to get cut up anyway. So I agree regarding train the best you can, and most of the time I spend grappling more these days has more to do with impact being harder on the joints than what I feel if most practical for a street scenario.  Because the true reality is, the "street scenario" is extremely, extremely rare in a first world nation unless you just want to fight in bars, or you go to too many "peaceful protests".

Grappling certainly has it's place no doubt about it. But tactically its the worst place to go unless you've no other option or get dragged down.
There's lots of things to consider:
Dangerous uneven surface.
The concrete is effing hard, and if you go down badly you could be looking at an injury. No light canvas to break your fall.
Detritus - Broken bottles, syringes, etc.
Also, if there are two assailants. His mate could stab you or kick you to death while you're engaged - that actually happened some years back to UFC guy (got stabbed by the opponent's mate from behind).
You're critical focus will be compromised and focused on one opponent (tunnel vision, adrenaline, etc).
Compromises one's ability to escape.

Like I said, you train for it but you don't aim for it.

Re. Knives, a person who 'really knows' what they are doing with a knife - Then you can pretty much kiss your ass goodbye. AKA - a two handed knife fighter. Someone who uses their 'off hand' in order to use their main hand to stab. Mind you, even a drooling drunk lunatic with absolutely no training whatsoever is still very deadly. Especially if they panic. They will go sewing machine on your ass (especially if you try and hold them).

In all honesty, to this date, I've never seen ANY system that can deal with a knife 100%. Yeah, you might very well get cut - It's about mitigating the damage by attempting to cover your vital areas. Easier said then done of course. However, there are some principals that are light years ahead of that Kratty Fu shit where they just simply pluck the knife out of the air. LOL. I'd love to see someone try that outside the Dojo against a committed knife wielder with real intent.

Running is always the best option... As I said before. Fighting is a mugs game, best reserved for the school yard and scum bags. Unfortunately, even in a 1st world country there are still plenty of violent scum who venture into nice places. I know many people who've been violent attacked in Dublin city for doing nothing more than minding their own business (some even in broad daylight with lots of folks about). And it's only going to get worse as the economy takes another nosedive with this whole pandemic thing. Shite bags have got to have their drug money.

Also, if it's part of your occupation you don't always have the option of running or walking away. For example I worked as a bouncer for three years in the UK to put myself through art college (in my twenties). I never had the option of just walking away unfortunately. Luckily we had a good team of guys.
  I think you keep missing the most important part about grappling, If I am the one who knows how (on the ground, and more importantly how to get you to the ground) I get to decide who lands on which surface.  When we are down there, I get to decide I am on top.  While we are down there, I get to decide when I get up.  Of course I prefer to hand the other fellow in the conversation a spicy three piece and be done with it, but I think you have basically simply expounded for the most part on everything I have said and we agree.  It has always been the narrative the street will be littered with broken glass, needles and poop.  IN the past I laughed at it, but the state of some large US cities actually make me take it more seriously.  But again, if we tie up, and I know what I am doing, and you do not, you go airborne and I land on you.  You land on the poop, glass and needles.  That is an ace I personally like to keep in my pocket.

Rob Necronomicon

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #115 on: November 12, 2020, 11:17:25 AM »
But again, if we tie up, and I know what I am doing, and you do not, you go airborne and I land on you.  You land on the poop, glass and needles.  That is an ace I personally like to keep in my pocket.

Oh absolutely... If said 'no mark' who has no training goes to the floor with someone who does. He's in deep shit (literally!). I think it's just good practice to keep the other situational factors at the back of one's mind whenever possible.
Attack-minded and dangerously so - W.E. Fairbairn.
youtube shit:www.youtube.com/channel/UCt1l7oq7EmlfLT6UEG8MLeg

Wicked Woodpecker of West
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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #116 on: November 12, 2020, 11:34:13 AM »
Quote
   In fairness, everything about Goldmoon's background and culture was N.A.-inspired and derived, and her appearance was unusual for her people. Then again, since the Plainsmen of Ansalon weren't isolated from the other cultures, the possibility of ancestral genetics from another ethnic group is highly plausible.

  (Ansalon's diversity is interesting--for a continent smaller than Australia, it has white, black, and American Indianesque residents, with no indication of migration from elsewhere. And this has been part of the setting since 1984.)

I mean maybe gods created it that way?

oggsmash

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #117 on: November 12, 2020, 11:44:30 AM »
But again, if we tie up, and I know what I am doing, and you do not, you go airborne and I land on you.  You land on the poop, glass and needles.  That is an ace I personally like to keep in my pocket.

Oh absolutely... If said 'no mark' who has no training goes to the floor with someone who does. He's in deep shit (literally!). I think it's just good practice to keep the other situational factors at the back of one's mind whenever possible.
  Dont get me wrong, I waste more breath trying to get BJJ guys to learn footwork, head movement, and training their kickboxing and boxing that I do trying to get anti grapplers to at least be proficient (to me that is about a year of training with about 6-10 hours on the mat a week).    Dogmas are everywhere, and BJJ, especially in the past 15 or so years with such a shift to sport focus is far, far from immune to it.

Rob Necronomicon

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #118 on: November 12, 2020, 11:51:35 AM »
Dogmas are everywhere, and BJJ, especially in the past 15 or so years with such a shift to sport focus is far, far from immune to it.

Absolutely... It's everywhere.

If you have something like BJJ and combine it with boxing, while adding a few principals (and some scenario training) you'll be formidable. No doubt about it...

Attack-minded and dangerously so - W.E. Fairbairn.
youtube shit:www.youtube.com/channel/UCt1l7oq7EmlfLT6UEG8MLeg

VisionStorm

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Re: Coming soon to your favourite game store: Soynan the Barbarian
« Reply #119 on: November 12, 2020, 11:55:35 AM »
This entire thing is an exercise on looking for things to be offended by, but none more than this...

Quote
For example, the “Martial Arts” talent tree title was changed to reflect our editorial view, as associated unarmed combat with eastern peoples has a poor tradition of Orientalism within the hobby, when there are counterparts all over the world. Instead they are now called “Unarmed” techniques.

Why, yes... there is a broad variety of combat styles and techniques--both armed and unarmed--all over the world, not just in eastern countries. And they are all called and fall under the category of:

Martial Arts

The subject of "Martial Arts" is not just limited to unarmed techniques or Eastern styles, but applies to ALL combat forms. And there're ALL called "Martial Arts", since acronyms like "HEMA" (Historical European MARTIAL ARTS). "Martial Arts" is not even an eastern language term.

You mongoloids.

You mean to tell me the thing named after a Roman god isn't exclusively Asian?

Naming the Martial Arts after a Roman god was a white supremacist plot to steal Asian cultural heritage for white people, and is deeply racist. Just like logic and mathematics.