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Author Topic: Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware  (Read 67010 times)

DeadUematsu

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #30 on: May 02, 2018, 11:56:56 PM »
Personally I hope to see more industry figures stop being overly familiar with women at conventions and similar venues. If not for self-respect, then hopefully the fear of a potential witch hunt makes them act less like dopey clowns.
 

GameDaddy
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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #31 on: May 03, 2018, 12:32:57 AM »
Quote from: trechriron;1036850
http://www.enworld.org/forum/content.php?5204-Harassment-Policies-New-Allegations-Show-More-Work-To-Be-Done

This is character assassination period. This is NOT journalism. It is a fevered machinations of a clearly emotionally-compromised human being desperate for the false-love of his fevered SJW sycophants.

I officially hereby take back everything nice I've ever said about Christopher Helton. He is using ENWorld as a platform to carry out his arrogant witch-hunt to satisfy his obviously personal shame for who-knows-what.

Don't let Chris Helton fool you. He is not a journalist. He is a demented self-appointed inquisitor.

I have cancelled my support of ENWorld, my EONS subscription and will be seriously considering my support of WOIN.

Meh... Enworld really hasn't been very good as a gaming forum for gamers since Eric Noah left in 2003, and that was a decade and a half ago, fifteen years now. I have caught Morrus on more than one occassion making some screwed up unverifiable statements about the game Industry, called him on it, and been threatened with a banhammer for that... so haven't really posted there myself since about 2013 or so...

Just an interesting side note for you. This character assassination, and that's all it is, because the testimony provided in this case so far is only hearsay, ...not even admissible in a Civil Court case. This particular case continues in a common vein with all of the other character assassinations cases I have witnessed over the last eighteen months. That is, ...a Successful Independent game publisher is accused of wrongdoing in a public forum, and is publicly humiliated. No actual trial occurs, yet the Indy Publisher suffers tremendous damage to his/her reputation in the gaming community with no actual proof of wrongdoing, and their income is also affected. Where are the photographs of the supposed victim with the wrongdoer? We don't see them. There are no recorded conversations, no Independent confirmation, no Independent third party corroboration. Nothing. ...No real evidence at all, of any wrongdoing. Just whispers in the dark. This reminds me of Wormtongue, Theoden's advisor.

They call themselves Social Justice Warriors, and the compare themselves to heroes who fight for the oppressed and downtrodden, but with these cases it is clear that the successful Indy Game Publishers that are the only ones being permanently harmed.  The big game and toy companies are renowned for fighting dirty like this, and have since the Tabletop Games Industries was founded early last century. The SJW show only a fleeting knowledge of the games and people they interact with, and are pretentious, shallow, callow, and openly disrespectful of anything outside of their reality bubble. Sometimes I really wish the Department of Defense had the draft still in place, so these losers could get sucked into serving their country for four years and get stationed in some dunghole that smells like a dunghole, where there are very real sexual predators. Pretty sure they would find that an enlightening  experience.

I'm also 100% certain that there are women in the gaming Industry who have been harassed, or imposed upon. There is a couple of really simple solutions for this, just to start they should really use their iPhone and all that fine portable tech like their tablets and such, to very discreetly record one of these real losers making unwanted advances, and record themselves rejecting such an advance. If it happens once... no big deal. the nerd was probably just trying to get a date. If it happens repeatedly, take his or her A$$ to court, and get a Judgement, then publicise the hell out of that. I would support a lynching for that 100%.

This whispers in the dark character assassination campaign though, ...holds no interest for me, and as you mention reflects very poorly on the organizations that sponsor and support such douchebaggery.

P.S. you socially inept nerd gamers who want a date, shouldn't be looking for a date at a gaming convention, you should be bringing your date to the gaming convention, 'just sayin...
« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 12:39:57 AM by GameDaddy »
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Spinachcat

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #32 on: May 03, 2018, 03:24:45 AM »
ENworld sent out its weekly update...and guess what "article" was included? One day, these clowns are going to pick a target who bites back.

I suspect they know this and that's why the focus on devouring their own. [which produces LoLz as a side effect]

Gamedaddy, there is no reason for gamers to not hookup at conventions. Just make it consensual and don't be creepy. Same rules for trying to hookup anywhere else. Our local cons have several couples who met through gaming and now have gaming kids. I'm sure plenty of sports fans meet at sports events or sports bars. And sports fandom has plenty of social inept members too, most who invariably figure out how to make the sexytime.

The Family Law courts aren't packed with divorce and custody cases just from the pretty people with social skills!

RPGPundit

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #33 on: May 03, 2018, 03:33:42 AM »
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Brand55

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #34 on: May 03, 2018, 11:11:29 AM »
Forget harassment allegations, SPF thinks delving into dungeons is for unheroic losers. That alone should have gotten him tarred and feathered years ago.

I kid, I kid (at least about the tarring and feathering part). From what I've seen over the years, I wouldn't care to know either Helton or Fannon personally. I don't think I've ever agreed with any of the Helton articles I've read, and it was only a few years ago that I saw Fannon asking people on Facebook about their views on certain subjects because he "wanted to cut evil out of his life." As far as they are both concerned, the only thing I can say is that at least Fannon has contributed to the hobby in a worthwhile way far more than Helton has.

I can easily see the allegations being true, but I don't see that there's enough evidence in public view for Fannon to be condemned and his career torched.  I hope that doesn't happen unless there's more to the story that comes to light. So screw any idiots looking to punish PEG for not immediately throwing the guy under the bus in the bloodiest way possible. Other than that, at least we're getting quite the show out of this mess.

Ratman_tf

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #35 on: May 03, 2018, 11:19:59 AM »
I dont' care about harassment anymore. It's none of my business, and...

Quote from: Spinachcat;1036977

It's clearly a case of SJWs devouring one of their own.


... an awful lot of this going on.
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DeadUematsu

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #36 on: May 03, 2018, 11:32:40 AM »
Quote from: Spinachcat;1037240
Gamedaddy, there is no reason for gamers to not hookup at conventions. Just make it consensual and don't be creepy.

I agree with GameDaddy. Besides the fact that what is creepy is highly subjective, a fair sample of female attendees to cons subscribe to sex-based hysterics. BYOD all the way.
 

Armchair Gamer

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #37 on: May 03, 2018, 12:09:30 PM »
Fannon has now withdrawn his defense.

Headless

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #38 on: May 03, 2018, 12:49:06 PM »
Looks like someone flying high on his own success and not picking up on social cues.  

Is there enough evidence for a conviction?  No especially since no crime has suggested.  Being creepy is not against the law.  

Is there enough evidence to punish?  By withdrawing support or not buying his stuff.  I would say not.  

Would I have second thoughts about inviting him to a convention?  Yes.  Multiple accounts of him ruining other peoples fun over a period of time. In his denial we learn that he does have pictures of him having sex on his phone and he does show them to women in the hopes of picking them up.  Not illegal but creepy, even if it works its sleezy.  

I would say he is at high risk to reoffend.  That is be creepy again.

jhkim

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #39 on: May 03, 2018, 01:42:57 PM »
1) If someone has behaved like an asshole at gaming events, then it is generally fair game to talk about it.  That's part of keeping lawncrappers out of events. I think that demanding silence about incidents like these would do more harm than good. Trying to hook up by itself isn't being an asshole, but other actions are - like sending unwanted sex pics.

2) My concern would be that events are reported honestly and responsibly. That includes getting multiple accounts, checking on their background and any discrepancies, and giving the person discussed a chance to respond. Irrelevant information should be left out. Warning flags to me are relying on a single person's account and/or not giving the person a chance to respond.

3) To me, Helton's article appears to be roughly responsible. He contacted Fannon for a response and included it with the article. He got multiple accounts and corroboration. Neither Fannon nor those standing up for him seem to be saying that there were any specific lies told.

4) This doesn't mean that I think that people should boycott Pinnacle or that Fannon should never work in the industry again.


Quote from: GameDaddy;1037229
This character assassination, and that's all it is, because the testimony provided in this case so far is only hearsay, ...not even admissible in a Civil Court case. This particular case continues in a common vein with all of the other character assassinations cases I have witnessed over the last eighteen months. That is, ...a Successful Independent game publisher is accused of wrongdoing in a public forum, and is publicly humiliated. No actual trial occurs, yet the Indy Publisher suffers tremendous damage to his/her reputation in the gaming community with no actual proof of wrongdoing, and their income is also affected. Where are the photographs of the supposed victim with the wrongdoer? We don't see them. There are no recorded conversations, no Independent confirmation, no Independent third party corroboration. Nothing. ...No real evidence at all, of any wrongdoing.
This is simply wrong. Eyewitness testimony is not hearsay, and is admissible in court. A conversation doesn't have to be recorded or photos taken in order for it to be admissible as related by people who were there. The vast majority of both civil and criminal cases hinge on witness testimony.


Quote from: GameDaddy;1037229
I'm also 100% certain that there are women in the gaming Industry who have been harassed, or imposed upon. There is a couple of really simple solutions for this, just to start they should really use their iPhone and all that fine portable tech like their tablets and such, to very discreetly record one of these real losers making unwanted advances, and record themselves rejecting such an advance. If it happens once... no big deal. the nerd was probably just trying to get a date. If it happens repeatedly, take his or her A$$ to court, and get a Judgement, then publicise the hell out of that. I would support a lynching for that 100%.
So do you think that women should try to constantly secretly videotape themselves in order to attend a convention?  Or do you think that they should specifically target someone that they believe to be a harasser, and go up to them trying to get harassed while secretly videotaping it?

Either way, I have problems with this. Secretly video recording people in general is itself creepy, and the latter is essentially entrapment.

Haffrung

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #40 on: May 03, 2018, 02:11:59 PM »
Quote from: Spinachcat;1037240
Gamedaddy, there is no reason for gamers to not hookup at conventions. Just make it consensual and don't be creepy. Same rules for trying to hookup anywhere else. Our local cons have several couples who met through gaming and now have gaming kids. I'm sure plenty of sports fans meet at sports events or sports bars. And sports fandom has plenty of social inept members too, most who invariably figure out how to make the sexytime.

It is weird how it seems to be only geek conventions that have erupted with hysteria, and where consensual hook-ups are regarded as so unlikely or dangerous that they shouldn't even be attempted.

On a boardgame forum about a year ago there was a discussion on the topic of harassment and flirting at conventions. There seemed to be consensus that a gaming convention was no place to pursue romantic interests (the thread was thick with SJWs). When I suggested flirting and maybe pursuing romantic interests is perfectly natural and healthy behaviour any place there are large numbers of people on vacation and staying away from home, the virtual fainting and pearl-clutching would have put a 1890s church sermon about sex out of wedlock to shame.

You don't see this hysteria around other types of gathering. About music festivals or softball tournaments. What in fuck is it about modern nerd culture that makes so many people people so neurotic and anxious about anything to do with sex? You would think that as nerd culture became more mainstream, nerds would behave more like normal people. But George RR Martin frequently attests to how wild and raunchy the early Hugos conventions in the 70s and 80s were, booze-soaked affairs with hook-ups (many that turned into long-term relationships) galore. So there's something new going on here.

It's like a Venn diagram, and where the Nerd circle overlaps the Millennial circle you get pearl-clutching hysteria.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 02:15:44 PM by Haffrung »
 

VengerSatanis

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #41 on: May 03, 2018, 02:44:24 PM »
Quote from: Spinachcat;1037151
Explain. Link. Detail.



Blogged about it:

https://vengersatanis.blogspot.com/2018/05/sean-patrick-fannon-sexual-harassment.html

VS

Mistwell

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #42 on: May 03, 2018, 03:04:53 PM »
Quote from: jhkim;1037312
3) To me, Helton's article appears to be roughly responsible. He contacted Fannon for a response and included it with the article. He got multiple accounts and corroboration. Neither Fannon nor those standing up for him seem to be saying that there were any specific lies told.

Clarification: Helton did not contact Fannon at all, and attempted to publish the article earlier with no response or even notice to Fannon. Morrus saw the article in editorial review and said wait a second hold on there, have you asked Fannon his side of this or if he has a response? He vetoed the article as it was, and insisted Fannon be contacted and given an opportunity to respond, prior to publication. So given no choice, Helton did that.

Also, Fannon is in fact calling out some of what was said as a total fabrication from a person with a known vendetta against him. Whether that is true or not is left up for everyone to decide for themselves, but he definitely called at least some of it a lie.

You also said,

Quote
This is simply wrong. Eyewitness testimony is not hearsay, and is admissible in court.

Yes, except the sources here are anonymous and are unwilling to be identified, face the accused, or be subject to questioning from the accused. Which would make it not admissible. The right to face your accuser and question them is fundamental to eyewitness testimony and due process, baring extremely unusual circumstances (like the witness is dying or has died, or is a young child).  I mean, we have an entire Constitutional bill of rights amendment just about this right, to make it really super clear how important it is (sixth amendment - confrontation clause).
« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 03:11:24 PM by Mistwell »

Spinachcat

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #43 on: May 03, 2018, 03:13:56 PM »
Quote from: jhkim;1037312
1) If someone has behaved like an asshole at gaming events, then it is generally fair game to talk about it.  That's part of keeping lawncrappers out of events. I think that demanding silence about incidents like these would do more harm than good. Trying to hook up by itself isn't being an asshole, but other actions are - like sending unwanted sex pics.

I agree with you. I don't demand silence. I want exactly the opposite. I want the WOMEN to speak for themselves loud and proud without any white knighting.

I want the women to come forward and say this happened to me, at this place, at this time. AKA, the basics of the #MeToo LoLzfest.


Quote from: Haffrung;1037320
You don't see this hysteria around other types of gathering. About music festivals or softball tournaments. What in fuck is it about modern nerd culture that makes so many people people so neurotic and anxious about anything to do with sex?

VERY good question.

Anyone have an idea?


Quote from: Haffrung;1037320
But George RR Martin frequently attests to how wild and raunchy the early Hugos conventions in the 70s and 80s were, booze-soaked affairs with hook-ups (many that turned into long-term relationships) galore. So there's something new going on here.

I can heartily confirm that ComicCon, Gallifrey and other California GeekCons have their share of extremely raucous after parties.

I've attended many and left a few before the bow-chicka-wow factor was obviously kicking into high gear.

So yes, geeks can drink, suck and fuck galore...all three in semi-public places. But something seems to go screwy with modern gamers?

BTW, LARPers hook up big time. In the 90s, I knew guys into Vampire mostly for the post-LARP parties.

Ratman_tf

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Chris Helton ENWorld and Witch Hunts - Buyer Beware
« Reply #44 on: May 03, 2018, 03:49:07 PM »
Quote from: Spinachcat;1037334
VERY good question.

Anyone have an idea?

Shot from the hip. Nerds get bullied. Bullies are attracted to nerds as soft targets.
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
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