This is a site for discussing roleplaying games. Have fun doing so, but there is one major rule: do not discuss political issues that aren't directly and uniquely related to the subject of the thread and about gaming. While this site is dedicated to free speech, the following will not be tolerated: devolving a thread into unrelated political discussion, sockpuppeting (using multiple and/or bogus accounts), disrupting topics without contributing to them, and posting images that could get someone fired in the workplace (an external link is OK, but clearly mark it as Not Safe For Work, or NSFW). If you receive a warning, please take it seriously and either move on to another topic or steer the discussion back to its original RPG-related theme.
NOTICE: Some online security services are reporting that information for a limited number of users from this site is for sale on the "dark web." As of right now, there is no direct evidence of this, but change your password just to be safe.

Author Topic: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form  (Read 2929 times)

Pat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • P
  • Posts: 2764
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #180 on: May 04, 2021, 05:50:43 AM »
Well, lets see. Sorts stars make millions, tens of millions while teachers get paid shit. Why? Because most wealthy sports stars are males who entertain mostly male audiences, while teachers just help educate our future generations and most guys don't give a fuck about that. Hell, a porn star with big tits makes more than a qualified teacher, again she entertains men. Sportstars entertain the male patriarchy and are rewarded accordingly. Many people who perform vital jobs (We would live without sports stars) get paid very little because the corporate patriarchy sucks up all the money but sports stars entertain the patriarchy and are paid lavishly for it.
That's all aeconomic nonsense. Sports don't make money because muh men while teachers don't because muh women. The reason sports stars make money is because they're entertainers, and the most popular entertainers make disproportionately more money, regardless of whether their audience is men or women. The same applies to entertainment that appeals to men, and to entertainment that appeals more to women, like romance novels. By contrast, teaching is a personal service, and not subject to the vagaries of popularity to nearly the same degree, so what they're paid is more stable across the profession, without the extreme outliers. Plus, teachers make decent money, or very good money when you count the value of non-wage remuneration, like summers off, medical coverage, and pensions.

And "vital" has nothing to do with what things cost. The classic example in nearly every economics 101 textbook is water is a lot more vital to life than diamonds, but costs far less. That's because there's an abundance of water, and once people have enough to drink and wash in, they don't feel a need to keep stockpiling it. At that point, they become more interested in shiny things. The prices of things aren't based on essential characteristics, they're based on the amount of money the next person who is wants to buy something is willing to pay. This is called the marginal cost.

Marchand

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • M
  • Posts: 187
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #181 on: May 04, 2021, 06:19:58 AM »
Well, lets see. Sorts stars make millions, tens of millions while teachers get paid shit. Why? Because most wealthy sports stars are males who entertain mostly male audiences, while teachers just help educate our future generations and most guys don't give a fuck about that. Hell, a porn star with big tits makes more than a qualified teacher, again she entertains men. Sportstars entertain the male patriarchy and are rewarded accordingly. Many people who perform vital jobs (We would live without sports stars) get paid very little because the corporate patriarchy sucks up all the money but sports stars entertain the patriarchy and are paid lavishly for it.

It's about 300 years since John Law explained the paradox of diamonds and water in terms of relative supply and demand (and about 250 since Adam Smith nicked the idea).

Anyway long experience suggests basic econs doesn't matter to most socialists. The point is think they know better than you how to spend your money. The excuse used to be class warfare and/or the technical superiority of central planning, until that fell over. The "patriarchy" is the latest excuse.
"If the English surrender, it'll be a long war!"
- Scottish soldier on the beach at Dunkirk

"Sorry, we don't have the facility to take you all prisoner."
Lt-Col John "Johnny" Frost, responding to German offer to discuss surrender terms, Arnhem, Sept 1944

Armchair Gamer

  • Enemy of Love and Gaming
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • A
  • Posts: 2312
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #182 on: May 04, 2021, 09:06:09 AM »

So you have any evidence that we do?

   The delusion might be not the denial of patriarchy, but the affirmation of meritocracy. :) From my point of view, we live in a tumultuous oligarchy careening towards a diablocracy (in multiple senses of the term), but this is getting rather far afield from the hobby.

VisionStorm

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1235
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #183 on: May 04, 2021, 09:21:57 AM »

So you have any evidence that we do?

   The delusion might be not the denial of patriarchy, but the affirmation of meritocracy. :) From my point of view, we live in a tumultuous oligarchy careening towards a diablocracy (in multiple senses of the term), but this is getting rather far afield from the hobby.

Pretty much what I figured as well. But since no specifications were made it's hard to tell which is it.

matt swain

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 69
  • BANNED
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #184 on: May 04, 2021, 12:34:59 PM »
Well, lets see. Sorts stars make millions, tens of millions while teachers get paid shit. Why? Because most wealthy sports stars are males who entertain mostly male audiences, while teachers just help educate our future generations and most guys don't give a fuck about that. Hell, a porn star with big tits makes more than a qualified teacher, again she entertains men. Sportstars entertain the male patriarchy and are rewarded accordingly. Many people who perform vital jobs (We would live without sports stars) get paid very little because the corporate patriarchy sucks up all the money but sports stars entertain the patriarchy and are paid lavishly for it.
That's all aeconomic nonsense. Sports don't make money because muh men while teachers don't because muh women. The reason sports stars make money is because they're entertainers, and the most popular entertainers make disproportionately more money, regardless of whether their audience is men or women. The same applies to entertainment that appeals to men, and to entertainment that appeals more to women, like romance novels. By contrast, teaching is a personal service, and not subject to the vagaries of popularity to nearly the same degree, so what they're paid is more stable across the profession, without the extreme outliers. Plus, teachers make decent money, or very good money when you count the value of non-wage remuneration, like summers off, medical coverage, and pensions.

And "vital" has nothing to do with what things cost. The classic example in nearly every economics 101 textbook is water is a lot more vital to life than diamonds, but costs far less. That's because there's an abundance of water, and once people have enough to drink and wash in, they don't feel a need to keep stockpiling it. At that point, they become more interested in shiny things. The prices of things aren't based on essential characteristics, they're based on the amount of money the next person who is wants to buy something is willing to pay. This is called the marginal cost.

Ahh, the typical conservative reply to any criticism, "That's just nonsense!" No point to trying to reason with a contard...
RPG.net is a cancer on the left and a disgrace to reasonable progressives that should be denounced and shunned by anyone considering themselves a progressive.

matt swain

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 69
  • BANNED
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #185 on: May 04, 2021, 12:36:36 PM »
Well, lets see. Sorts stars make millions, tens of millions while teachers get paid shit. Why? Because most wealthy sports stars are males who entertain mostly male audiences, while teachers just help educate our future generations and most guys don't give a fuck about that. Hell, a porn star with big tits makes more than a qualified teacher, again she entertains men. Sportstars entertain the male patriarchy and are rewarded accordingly. Many people who perform vital jobs (We would live without sports stars) get paid very little because the corporate patriarchy sucks up all the money but sports stars entertain the patriarchy and are paid lavishly for it.

It's about 300 years since John Law explained the paradox of diamonds and water in terms of relative supply and demand (and about 250 since Adam Smith nicked the idea).

Anyway long experience suggests basic econs doesn't matter to most socialists. The point is think they know better than you how to spend your money. The excuse used to be class warfare and/or the technical superiority of central planning, until that fell over. The "patriarchy" is the latest excuse.

Contards seem ok with central planning as long as it;'s by a corporation and not an elected government.
RPG.net is a cancer on the left and a disgrace to reasonable progressives that should be denounced and shunned by anyone considering themselves a progressive.

matt swain

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 69
  • BANNED
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #186 on: May 04, 2021, 12:37:20 PM »

So you have any evidence that we do?

   The delusion might be not the denial of patriarchy, but the affirmation of meritocracy. :) From my point of view, we live in a tumultuous oligarchy careening towards a diablocracy (in multiple senses of the term), but this is getting rather far afield from the hobby.

You got it.  The best term to describe america today might be "kratocracy".

https://www.governmentvs.com/en/what-is-kratocracy/model-87-0
« Last Edit: May 04, 2021, 12:39:18 PM by matt swain »
RPG.net is a cancer on the left and a disgrace to reasonable progressives that should be denounced and shunned by anyone considering themselves a progressive.

HappyDaze

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • H
  • Posts: 3298
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #187 on: May 04, 2021, 12:53:25 PM »

So you have any evidence that we do?

   The delusion might be not the denial of patriarchy, but the affirmation of meritocracy. :) From my point of view, we live in a tumultuous oligarchy careening towards a diablocracy (in multiple senses of the term), but this is getting rather far afield from the hobby.

You got it.  The best term to describe america today might be "kratocracy".

https://www.governmentvs.com/en/what-is-kratocracy/model-87-0
Well, if Kratos wants to rule, who's going to stop him?

Pat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • P
  • Posts: 2764
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #188 on: May 04, 2021, 01:00:42 PM »
Well, lets see. Sorts stars make millions, tens of millions while teachers get paid shit. Why? Because most wealthy sports stars are males who entertain mostly male audiences, while teachers just help educate our future generations and most guys don't give a fuck about that. Hell, a porn star with big tits makes more than a qualified teacher, again she entertains men. Sportstars entertain the male patriarchy and are rewarded accordingly. Many people who perform vital jobs (We would live without sports stars) get paid very little because the corporate patriarchy sucks up all the money but sports stars entertain the patriarchy and are paid lavishly for it.
That's all aeconomic nonsense. Sports don't make money because muh men while teachers don't because muh women. The reason sports stars make money is because they're entertainers, and the most popular entertainers make disproportionately more money, regardless of whether their audience is men or women. The same applies to entertainment that appeals to men, and to entertainment that appeals more to women, like romance novels. By contrast, teaching is a personal service, and not subject to the vagaries of popularity to nearly the same degree, so what they're paid is more stable across the profession, without the extreme outliers. Plus, teachers make decent money, or very good money when you count the value of non-wage remuneration, like summers off, medical coverage, and pensions.

And "vital" has nothing to do with what things cost. The classic example in nearly every economics 101 textbook is water is a lot more vital to life than diamonds, but costs far less. That's because there's an abundance of water, and once people have enough to drink and wash in, they don't feel a need to keep stockpiling it. At that point, they become more interested in shiny things. The prices of things aren't based on essential characteristics, they're based on the amount of money the next person who is wants to buy something is willing to pay. This is called the marginal cost.

Ahh, the typical conservative reply to any criticism, "That's just nonsense!" No point to trying to reason with a contard...
First of all, I'm not even vaguely conservative. I just understand basic economics. And I didn't just reply with "that's just nonsense", I explained why you're wrong. You just replied with an insult.

And for someone who complains about being a victim and people being mean to you so much, it's kind of ironic you call people names in almost every post.

Lynn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1839
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #189 on: May 04, 2021, 01:18:41 PM »
Well, lets see. Sorts stars make millions, tens of millions while teachers get paid shit. Why? Because most wealthy sports stars are males who entertain mostly male audiences, while teachers just help educate our future generations and most guys don't give a fuck about that. Hell, a porn star with big tits makes more than a qualified teacher, again she entertains men. Sportstars entertain the male patriarchy and are rewarded accordingly. Many people who perform vital jobs (We would live without sports stars) get paid very little because the corporate patriarchy sucks up all the money but sports stars entertain the patriarchy and are paid lavishly for it.

You said it with 'stars.' Sports stars, like other stars, are entertainers. They have individual value that's determined within their vertical entertainment industry, just like Scarlett Johansson does in film.

Teachers are public employees, governed at the state level, and a profession made up of both men and women. As compared with many professions, their recompense may seem low. Within their market though, if they go to administration or become a superintendent, the roof is off (a roof I will add, which is agreed upon by Teacher's Unions). Also, depending on the location, they may have much better than average benefits. In the case of going the path of administration, our district superintendent makes much more than the mayor. 

Most teachers don't want competitiveness, by the way, and rather have their more stable and predictable matrix.
Lynn Fredricks
Entrepreneurial Hat Collector

Ratman_tf

  • Alt-Reich Shitlord
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6220
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #190 on: May 04, 2021, 01:33:14 PM »
Well, lets see. Sorts stars make millions, tens of millions while teachers get paid shit. Why? Because most wealthy sports stars are males who entertain mostly male audiences, while teachers just help educate our future generations and most guys don't give a fuck about that. Hell, a porn star with big tits makes more than a qualified teacher, again she entertains men. Sportstars entertain the male patriarchy and are rewarded accordingly. Many people who perform vital jobs (We would live without sports stars) get paid very little because the corporate patriarchy sucks up all the money but sports stars entertain the patriarchy and are paid lavishly for it.
That's all aeconomic nonsense. Sports don't make money because muh men while teachers don't because muh women. The reason sports stars make money is because they're entertainers, and the most popular entertainers make disproportionately more money, regardless of whether their audience is men or women. The same applies to entertainment that appeals to men, and to entertainment that appeals more to women, like romance novels. By contrast, teaching is a personal service, and not subject to the vagaries of popularity to nearly the same degree, so what they're paid is more stable across the profession, without the extreme outliers. Plus, teachers make decent money, or very good money when you count the value of non-wage remuneration, like summers off, medical coverage, and pensions.

And "vital" has nothing to do with what things cost. The classic example in nearly every economics 101 textbook is water is a lot more vital to life than diamonds, but costs far less. That's because there's an abundance of water, and once people have enough to drink and wash in, they don't feel a need to keep stockpiling it. At that point, they become more interested in shiny things. The prices of things aren't based on essential characteristics, they're based on the amount of money the next person who is wants to buy something is willing to pay. This is called the marginal cost.

Ahh, the typical conservative reply to any criticism, "That's just nonsense!" No point to trying to reason with a contard...

He went into detail and explained why your response was nonsense. Crying about it won't help you.

The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

This Guy

  • You Know?
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • T
  • Posts: 530
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #191 on: May 04, 2021, 02:04:24 PM »

Also, no, we don't live in a patriarchy, we live in a meritocracy.

Cool delusion bro.

So you have any evidence that we do?

Here's an article I haven't read that exists to annoy you: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violence_against_women_in_Mexico
I don't want to play with you.

Rob Necronomicon

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 53
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #192 on: May 06, 2021, 07:27:26 AM »
Read the pitch... I felt ill and dirty. I need a shower.
"Attack minded and dangerously so." - W.E. Fairbairn.

https://www.instagram.com/robnecronomicon/

Anon Adderlan

  • Shit Just Got Emu!
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1411
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #193 on: May 07, 2021, 02:27:06 PM »
Read the preview. Very similar to the system used in Free League's Alien. Strangely very gear and combat focused. Every species logo incorporates vagina imagery. The feminine Tiefling looking race is based on a porn comic and all three sexes feature operational mammaries. It's a fetish RPG, but nowhere near as extreme as Bellum Maga or MSF High. In fact like many such RPGs I see nothing inherent in the game itself which pushes the themes and agenda it claims to have. And if you're really looking for Poe there's no better an example than ValiDate, a dating sim which features such obnoxious representations of minorities that I still wonder if it isn't some sort of cunning troll.

Ultimately though I have no problem with this sort of fantasy, and people vastly overestimate how much RPGs influence beliefs and behavior beyond the table.

Welp someone told 4chan.

Archived for when it goes away.

The idea of an alien invasion being thwarted because they find humans just too sexy to control themselves around is rather intriguing however.

Sociopaths are experts at avoiding looking like assholes. This is why sociopaths always come to power in such systems.

Sociopaths and Narcissists are the entire problem, and the best I can recommend is for people to learn how to spot and expel them, especially empaths who think they can save everybody.

calling out Asperger's here is bullshit. Plenty of posters here are assholes without Asperger's and plenty of people with Asperger's are super nice.

Aspie here. While that's true, the fact we don't intuitively pick up on social cues means we're constantly in danger of unintentionally violating social boundaries, and some of these triggers are so insipid that we don't just get frustrated trying to honor them, but literally exhausted as simple social interactions can become massive expenses in emotional labor, and eventually resentful that we're being forced to put in this work just to participate in society.

Theoretically the condition also frees us of the kind of social biases which make one vulnerable to influence, but in my experience those on the spectrum become particularly obsessed with certain things, often political. It's partly about a need for order, and mastering one domain is about the only way you can even attempt to put the world in context.

The central force against corruption is that the system should keep assholes out of power.

How?

Important positions would be thrust upon those with the highest reputation and if people found power seeking behavior as distasteful as they do now-a-days, then your standard modern day politician (with few expectations) would never attain high office.

So when does capability enter the equation, if at all?

The point is think they know better than you how to spend your money.

The justification for all authoritarianism really.

When you have the tech to take dirt apart and turn it into food, clothing, housing, etc what happens to economics?

Same as always: Someone ends up controlling who can access the tech and dirt.

So why not write your own SFRPG based on your views and try to kickstart it?

Create a scifi future setting where there are heroic straight conservative libertarian shitlords battling against the ravening hordes of libtards, SJWs, feminazis, LGBTQ monsters, socialists, communists, NAMBLA members, etc?

Maybe even call it "Shitlords of the stars!"

It would likely be pulled from #Kickstarter, and then the goalposts would shift to "Why not create your own platform?".

How do you feel about sites such as YouTube, Twitter, and Reddit that implement similar algorithmic reputation systems? Do you feel that these systems consistently surface the best & most useful content and reward the best people? How would what you're proposing differ in a meaningful way from other existing algorithmic rating systems?

If someone kills someone else and gets -10,000 reputation, is that just as bad as littering 10,000 times? What if someone is falsely convicted of a crime, do prosecutors get negative reputation for a prosecution that's later overturned? If you're mentally ill and behave erratically sometimes, is that your fault or...? What if you own a business but your wife cheats on you and then spreads a bunch of lies about you that hurts your reputation?

This type of pie-in-the-sky thinking seems very much driven by people who either don't work with technology or haven't meaningfully grappled with the consequences of it. The world is a lot more complex than it's possible to boil down into our models, and the more we try to force the world to align with the model the more negative effects this will have.

I think there's a solid case to be made that centralization in technology inevitably leads to totalitarianism. Given enough time, the people who are willing to act unethically for their own advantage will be able to use these mechanisms to their own advantage.

And RPGs are exactly the kind of thing uniquely suited to exploring such dilemmas.

Check this out.

Check this out as well.

That and circlejerk their politics. speaking of which, here, have a dystopia: Enjoy your Fnarg bro

Checked out. Thanks for sharing.

Popularity contests are precisely why the United States is not a Democracy.



The full editorial worth a read too.

Chris24601

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • C
  • Posts: 1707
    • View Profile
Re: ChangedStars: Poe's Law in RPG Form
« Reply #194 on: May 07, 2021, 03:54:53 PM »
The idea of an alien invasion being thwarted because they find humans just too sexy to control themselves around is rather intriguing however.
Isn't that basically the entire plot resolution for Macross/Robotech?

The aliens are so overwhelmed by the concept of sex and the blaring of 80's pop rock through their speakers that they literally stand around drooling as we blow them to kingdom come!