Quote from: DeadUematsu;332663I don't see what the problem is. People making collaborative adventures and then playing them is a sin now?

I would say you are going to get shitty results if you only are given an hour to do so, and then told you cannot run what you have just written but must hand it off to another to run (who has no idea what you have been working on since they were part of another team). I view it not as a sin (nice hyperbole on your part I might add), but as a recipe for disaster because the results generated by this pressure cooker method are going to be all over the map in their worth as adventures.

You get out of a RPG session what you put into it. When the DM does not have enough prep time to create an adventure, you cannot expect very good results even from experienced gamers as DMs.

Quote from: jeff37923;332620I was joking. Please tell me you are not drinking PBR. Anything but that, that or Miller High Life. Please tell me you are not drinking PBR or Miller High Life.

I have no problem admitting, sir, that I enjoy both PBR and the High Life. The High Life especially. I have spent many a night with the Girl on the Moon as I imbibed the light, crisp wonders of the High Life. It's my favorite of the mass-produced domestic beers. I know it's all hip to rag on those beers, but I like a lot of 'em. Doesn't mean it's all I like...now that I'm back east of the Mississippi, I miss (for example) Fat Tire, and stuff like Karl Strauss' Barley Wine and Russian Imperial Stout.

Quote from: Koltar;332626The first messed up thing I saw that jumped outat me was on the front page.  Its annoyingly titled - Step2A: Pick A Boss.
...
 Let me guess, WotC guys, HASDBRO giving you pressure to make it sound like WoW because thewy think thats what sells?

Or are they giving up the over 25 years old market entirely?

- Ed C.

What makes you think that the demographics of the MMO market is dominated by the under 25 year olds?

QuoteComputer games used to be aimed at pubescent boys hooked on violence, or, as Bobby Kotick, the chief executive of Activision, describes them, "guys who can't get a date on Saturday night".

However, times have changed: 40 per cent of purchasers of one of Mr Kotick's most popular games are women.

One of these "most popular" games in question run by Kotick is World of Warcraft. And the precise quote is that gaming is "no longer about 16 to 24-year-old males who can't get a date on Saturday night", but about men and women in their 30s - people with regular income.

That, and the reference you cited in the GameDay material to a "team coordinator" "responsible for gathering up the worksheets" seems to indicate that WotC aren't going for students at all.

@Jeff: From what Koltar posted, two people working on one encounter for one hour seems like a fair amount to put something solid together. Also, the person who will then run the adventure is a part of the group creating the adventure, not somebody who picks it up cold, get your facts straight. Finally, Koltar's reaction is way out of line for what's being proposed and nothing looks like it's a recipe for disaster so far. As for the rest of your reply, I am just going to roll my eyes and sigh.

Yeah, so far I'm not seeing anything to get panties bunched up about. At all. Sounds like a decent way to try something a bit different from normal.

Quote from: jeff37923;332669I would say you are going to get shitty results if you only are given an hour to do so ... a recipe for disaster because the results generated by this pressure cooker method are going to be all over the map in their worth as adventures.

I don't think time is necessarily the greatest detractor in this scenario. If I had an hour with gamer friends of mine, we could cook up something half decent. What will be harder to get round is the fact that in the set up of previous Game Days you had a clear separation of guys who'd prepped for the event (DMs running the module, getting it and the minis) and guys who'd attend the event purely from a consumerist perspective (I go there to play, don't even have to create a character, and get some freebies afterwards). I'm not sure how this DMG2 day event sits with people of the latter bent. Factor in team leaders and worksheets, and this may rub these passive people the wrong way - rub them like... work. Querying (apparently unprompted) creative input doesn't sit easily with everyone, after all. I'm saying that as someone who gets pissed when offered free cinema tickets at a pre-screening event, and then having to stay behind to volunteer an opinion or two. See, I just want the ride, not the effort when going to promotion events.

On the other hand, kudos to WotC for trying to run a Game Day on the DMG 2 at all. It clearly couldn't have been player-oriented (PC-oriented) to begin with, and WotC didn't pretend they could wriggle their way out of that. God knows, maybe this sort of event even gets a guy or two to DM who otherwise would have not felt like before. That's precisely the thing the hobby needs.

Quote from: Windjammer;332674That, and the reference you cited in the GameDay material to a "team coordinator" "responsible for gathering up the worksheets" seems to indicate that WotC aren't going for students at all.

Its a Role Playing Game, not an MMO.

Its a Role Playing Game, not a team building exercise at a corporate retreat.


- Ed C.

Where's the damn Forger terminology you promised.

Regards,
David R

Linky!
 
http://www.isa.pl/magic/pliki/DMG2-Game-Day-Adventure-Creation-Instructions.pdf

Quote from: Koltar;332684Its a Role Playing Game, not an MMO.

Its a Role Playing Game, not a team building exercise at a corporate retreat.


- Ed C.

Seriously, how does using the term "boss" or that adventure-building exercise (because that's what it is) invalidate anything a RPG stands for, Koltar? You have people on this site harping a billion other things more off-putting and THIS is what draws your ire?

The rest of "Step 1" on to the "Step 2A: Pick A Boss" :

QuoteSTEP 1: DETERMINE YOUR THEME
Time: 10 minutes
Adventure Setting: A cavern network above a waterfall, about 5 miles from a nearby village.
   Before you begin passing out the encounter worksheets and breaking into smaller teams to work on the 2 encounters, choose a theme for your adventure. Why are the adventurers going to the caverns? Some sample themes are provided below, or make up your own!
·   Rescue a kidnapped villager. A villager from a nearby village has gone missing, and the adventurers have been hired by the villagers to find the kidnapped person(s). The trail of the kidnappers leads them to the cavern complex.
·   Eradicate the raiders. Raiders from the caverns have plagued the village and nearby farms of late, and the adventurers have been promised a reward from the villagers for ridding the countryside of their menace.
·   Investigate a strange cult. At night, villagers often see torchlit figures traveling to the cavern complex near the waterfall. Those that dare get close enough to the caverns hear strange chanting sounds and occasional screams.
·   Seek out a valuable treasure. For many years, the villagers have spread tales of a great treasure that lies hidden within the nearby caverns. However, no one that has ventured forth to claim the treasure has returned. The adventurers arrive to test their mettle against the dangers that await and claim the treasure for their own.

STEP 2: SELECT MONSTERS FOR ENCOUNTERS
Time: 20 minutes
You won't use all the monsters provided in the kit for the 2 encounters. However, we've provided you with enough monsters to pick and choose what you'd like to use for the adventure. The kit provides you with the following monsters and quantities (stats for the monsters are at the end of this document):
·   x1 doomdreamer: level 8 controller (leader)
·   x1 duergar cleric of Asmodeus: level 7 controller (leader)
·   x3 duergar guard: level 4 soldier
·   x1 foulspawn hulk: level 12 brute
·   x1 foulspawn mangler: level 8 skirmisher
·   x1 hoard scarab larva swarm: level 7 lurker
·   x3 minotaur thug: level 9 skirmisher
·   x1 scarecrow stalker: level 6 soldier

Cool Themes: A few good themes include the two foulspawn, which are aberrant creatures corrupted by the mad plane known as the Far Realm; the duergar cleric and his guards, which are a race of dwarves tainted by infernal forces, and the doomdreamer (a human that follows the insane tenets of Tharizdum, the chaotic evil deity of entropy and annihilation) with his minotaur thugs.

STEP 2A: PICK A BOSS
The doomdreamer (good for a hard adventure) and duergar cleric of Asmodeus (good for an easy or average adventure) make great "boss villains, " since they're both leaders and could be the masterminds behind your theme. The doomdreamer likes to use the minotaur thugs as muscle, and the duergar cleric often uses the duergar guards for protection. If your theme doesn't involve a leader-type, you don't have to choose one.

Its NOT a "BOSS" its a Mastermind damnit.

Thats fucking WoW/MMO terminology in there.

Oh and the "themes"  - what, they didn't like the word plot? or idea? or hook?

- Ed C.

Quote from: Malleus Arianorum;332693Linky!
 
http://www.isa.pl/magic/pliki/DMG2-Game-Day-Adventure-Creation-Instructions.pdf

Thank You Malleus Arianorum.

Its just screwed up .
 Its really screwed up.


- Ed C.

So I read the PDF and I have to say, I see nothing wrong with it. Koltar, you're being ridiculous.

Hmm.  It's not terrible.  It lays things out neatly and sequentially for new DMs.

Its glaring problem is just the universal symptom of 4E: it presumes that "adventure" is synonymous with "combat excursion for DDM".

I dunno. What I see is a sort of mad-lib dungeon. [This] means I done wrote it.
 
Adventure Theme
Write out the theme of the adventure below.
Rescue a kidnapped villager.
A villiager [professor, diplomat, author, and national security expert] from a nearby village [Washington D.C.] has gone missing, and the adventurers have been hired by the villagers to find the kidnapped person(s) [Condoleezza Rice]. The trail of the kidnappers leads them to the cavern complex.
 
Adventure Read-Aloud Start
Explain to the players why their characters have come to the caverns in the space below. The DM will read this text to the players when they are ready to begin the adventure.
 
Traversing the wilds, you come upon a waterfall spilling over the
edge of a cliff face about 30 feet high. At the top of the cliff, a cave entrance is visible. What lies beyond is [Condoleezza Rice who you should rescue and not kill].
 
Adventure Read-Aloud Conclusion
Give a brief conclusion that explains what happens if the characters succeed in the adventure. The DM will read this text to the players when they finish the adventure.
 
[Everyone but Condoleezza Rice and you guys are dead so you win. She's being waterboarded by a machine hooked up to the waterfall, but she doesn't think it's torture so no big hurry.] On the lower left of the map, the cavern exits out back into the countryside.