Quote from: KoltarJust much more believable.
- Ed C.

If Spiderman 3 is the reality you live in, sure.

Quote from: SettembriniIf Spiderman 3 is the reality you live in, sure.

Still haven't seen that one....
 Reality I live in the current BSG is better written and acted than the earlier one. I even discuissed it with Richard Hatch. He reluctantly agreed that he is getting better material as Tom Zarek than he ever did as the original Apollo.


- Ed C.

Quote from: KoltarStill haven't seen that one....
 Reality I live in the current BSG is better written and acted than the earlier one.

That, my friend, has got nothing to do with the believability of the depicted fiction.

And yes, New Galactica has surely high production efforts in certain areas. I´m pretty positive though, that they spend less on special FX than the old one did, but this is not my point here.

Quote from: RPGPunditUh huh. Whatever. Lorne Greene was the guy who LED. The guy who was RIGHT. He was the one who always held the high ground, who always guided everyone and kept everything together.
 
Your new adama is a morally-relativist twisted-copy just like your Starbuck, your Boomer, and your Apollo (and, I would presume your Tigh if he even exists); all just making a mockery of the original series by making it into the exact moral OPPOSITE of what the original series was.
 
The original series was all about humanity seeking hope against impossible odds. The new series is apparently about humans being suicide bombers, everyone betraying everyone else, men being wimps, women smoking cigars and being the only ones allowed to be tough, and the Cylons being not "really bad" guys.
 
RPGPundit

Disagree.
 
I agree with Koltar: better written, better acted, more believable at all, so I do care about them.
 
And mate, you have to see Adama leadership here to talk about hope against impossible odds, and being the badassest while you're at it. He's not a moral relativist AT ALL. He knows what's good and evil: it just happens that sometimes, doing the right thing is hard. And he's not a mannequin as the former Adama was.
 
Men are not wimps here: here, everyone is badass. Cylons are great. Humans are great. Space battles are showers of awesomity.
 
This BSG is not a parody of the former. It's not a remake. It's an entirely different series. Watch it as what it is. Mate, if you loved Rome you have to love this, really.
 
And Spiderman 3 is Thy Greatest Abomination Unto Thy Eyes of Thy Lordeth. Don't ever bring bak again.

Quote from: RPGPunditFrom what I've heard,

You have some detailed opinions about something you haven't even seen. I've seen it. In the new series, Adama isn't really anything like what you say. He shares many of the qualities of the Lorne Green version, but he's more obviously a military man. Greene's Adama always struck me as a civilian, despite his position. The new Adama really seems like he was a seasoned officer in charge of a powerful military vessel. Is he as black and white as the original? Well, no, he's more realistic - I mean, fuck, the Greene version was practically walking on water - but he certainly doesn't strike me as the Goth paragon you paint him as.

I´ve only seen the pilot, but in that, Adama is holding a speech that basically says: "I´m not sure if we humans do deserve to live at all."

If that´s "realistic" to you, I pity you.

That´s not military thinking, that´s Starbucks-sitting-sixteen-year-olds-with-che-guevara-t-shirt-who-ponders-if-he-maybe-stops-eating-meat.


Alas, I´ve only seen the pilot, but that speech (and the childish treatment of alcoholism and pathetic wannabe portrayal of military goings) was enough to kill the franchise for me.

The pilot wanted to be adult, but firmly remained adolescent. And that´s the main problem here. Don´t know if the show redeemed itself after the pilot.

The old series was a kid´s show, that was light hearted, but had elements to turn it int a family show.

Quote from: SettembriniThe old series was a kid´s show, that was light hearted, but had elements to turn it int a family show.

A retarded kid's show, you'll mean. I watched the old series when I was very young, and I founf the robodog an insult to my intelligence. Actually, I hated Phoenix (Dirk Benedict) in the A - Team just because he reminded me of that crock of shit.

Quote from: KoltarAs for complete disclosure :  As a young teen I watched the Original BSGweek to week, two thirds the way through it I felt very disappointed. The writers of the oBSG wasted so many oppurtunities.


- Ed C.

You wan to know why you were disappointed? Because american tv in the seventies and early eighties was horrible. For christ sakes Dukes of Hazard was a prime time hit! Not exactly shakespear there. Television was dumbed down. (Some might argue that hasnt changed) Then you compare it to television from the UK in the same period. They brought you shows like The Sandbaggers. Far more intelligent, and well written television.

I was 13, then 14 at the time, reading things like ANALOG and F & SF magazine for fun on the weekends.

So, yeah even at that age I knew it was something that could have been done much better.


- Ed C.

Quote from: Ronin... Then you compare it to television from the UK in the same period. They brought you shows like The Sandbaggers. Far more intelligent, and well written television.

British telly tends to be short series of programs, like six, eight, ten or twelve. Which means you can have a small team of writers or even just individual writers, and you don't dilute the genuis that makes a series good just through having to stretch the story out for 24 (or however many) episodes. For proof of why American television should take a long hard look at this, I refer you to Lost, 'new' Galactica, Desperate Housewives and Heroes; storylines that just aren't strong enough to be strung out that thinly.

The down side for translating our telly for you Americans is that your channels are so wedded to the long series idea that they don't really take to our series. And its a shame; America has produced some excellent comedy, but nothing with the wit, humour and intelligence of, say, Blackadder, Red Dwarf or Dinnerladies. You have some scintillating talent for sci-fi writing, but not once has anynone produced any science fiction television over there that compares with Blakes 7 or Day of the Triffids for grit and claustrophobic drama. And you have some excellent drama ideas, but there simply isn't any way you could produce 24 episode series as well thought out, consistently strong and utterly enthralling as, say, Life on Mars or I Claudius.

The problem is simple really; you've got a massive pool of talent, no shortage of creativity, but the model television series are made to over there spreads even that far, far too thinly.

Quote from: ImperatorA retarded kid's show, you'll mean. I watched the old series when I was very young, and I founf the robodog an insult to my intelligence. Actually, I hated Phoenix (Dirk Benedict) in the A - Team just because he reminded me of that crock of shit.

I think you mean Face, not Phoenix

StarWars d6 would be a good fit for the out-of-ship stuff.

Aerotech might work well (if slowly) for the dogfighting.

The Babylon 5 RPG (!) actually has a really good system for space combat with larger ships and would handle the Galactica and swarms of fighters very well.

Quote from: CabBritish telly tends to be short series of programs, like six, eight, ten or twelve. Which means you can have a small team of writers or even just individual writers, and you don't dilute the genuis that makes a series good just through having to stretch the story out for 24 (or however many) episodes. For proof of why American television should take a long hard look at this, I refer you to Lost, 'new' Galactica, Desperate Housewives and Heroes; storylines that just aren't strong enough to be strung out that thinly.

The down side for translating our telly for you Americans is that your channels are so wedded to the long series idea that they don't really take to our series. And its a shame; America has produced some excellent comedy, but nothing with the wit, humour and intelligence of, say, Blackadder, Red Dwarf or Dinnerladies. You have some scintillating talent for sci-fi writing, but not once has anynone produced any science fiction television over there that compares with Blakes 7 or Day of the Triffids for grit and claustrophobic drama. And you have some excellent drama ideas, but there simply isn't any way you could produce 24 episode series as well thought out, consistently strong and utterly enthralling as, say, Life on Mars or I Claudius.

The problem is simple really; you've got a massive pool of talent, no shortage of creativity, but the model television series are made to over there spreads even that far, far too thinly.

I totally agree with you on that. But I was refering to programs in the seveties and early eighties. Most of the shows were episode by episode basis. It was always the same characters and stuff. But each episode were independent in that you did have to watch the previous episode to know what was going on. The what was being written for american tv back then was dumbed down trash. While in other places it was written far better. Not diluted for the common denominator. That was my point. The reason Koltar thought the original could have been written better. Was that it could have been. But it wasnt because of how tv was written for american audiences back then.

Quote from: Dr Rotwang!Well, BSG was informed by Star Wars, which is a nice way of saying "Let's get us somma that gravy!".

Actually, oBSG was more informed by Star Trek: Originally conceived of as Bible Stories... IN SPAAAACE! It later became Mormon Stories... IN SPAAAACE!

With all the Mormon links and backstory of the old BSG, one would think that Testament d20 or something would be the best game to use.

http://www.kobol.com/archives/BG-FAQ.html#G1 (read section on "Adam's Arc")

http://www.kobol.com/archives/BG-FAQ.html#E21 (oBSG = Mormonism with the serial numbers filed... well, left intact actually)

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/billotto/Mormon_N_BSG.html (more on the Mormonism - BSG connection)

I prefer the new BSG because it hand-waves all the LDS crap and gets down to hard choices and cool, raw story.

Systemwise, I'd personally use something like Savage Worlds if I was going to play out the combat and stuff of the miniseries and early shows of the New BSG: Fast combat-minis rules and the like that SW gives are pretty hot.

If I was playing a game where all the PCs were higher-ups in the social hierarchy of the survivors, it'd be something like Primetime Adventures or AMBER.

Quote from: Andy KActually, oBSG was more informed by Star Trek: Originally conceived of as Bible Stories... IN SPAAAACE! It later became Mormon Stories... IN SPAAAACE!

OK, I'll get down with that.  I guess I meant "spurred into production by the production of" Star Wars.

QuoteWith all the Mormon links and backstory of the old BSG, one would think that Testament d20 or something would be the best game to use.

:rimshot: