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Author Topic: Are we seeing the end of combat?  (Read 15823 times)

Neoplatonist1

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Are we seeing the end of combat?
« on: October 18, 2021, 06:05:53 PM »
This business of politicizing gaming in the southpaw direction, such that all monsters must be individuals capable of free will and, so, of any alignment, has implications beyond just erasing the trope of irredeemably evil races. It also attacks the central pillar of virtually all RPGs, which is combat.

Combat is cheap drama, and, in my experience, no games deal much or at all with the psychological scars and trauma that real life combat inflicts on its participants. Game combat, therefore, trains people to think in terms of violence as a valid solution to many of life's problems (or most, in the typical game milieu), as free of psychic consequence, and as intrinsically fun.

Could this "woke" business therefore be the harbinger of the end of combat as cheap drama? Must all games then be sensitive to just how powerful getting into a fight is, with its ugly consequences of trauma, confusion, and murder, and, so, knock down this central pillar? If so, what will hold up the roof?

HappyDaze

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2021, 06:10:43 PM »
The sky is not falling. Game on.

DM_Curt

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2021, 06:16:14 PM »
Combat isn't going anywhere. It may leave particular games, which will lose sales, go "Oh Shit!" and put it back in.

Shrieking Banshee

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2021, 06:16:30 PM »
No. This blend of woke is not ultimatly anti-combat.

GriswaldTerrastone
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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2021, 06:52:22 PM »
Actually, the answer will be "yes and no."

Combat by certain groups (white straight males) will be either frowned upon or a no-no against certain other groups (e.g. women). This is why male heroes can't defeat female villains in movies nowadays (Thor needing that lava monster to finish the job).
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Shasarak

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2021, 06:58:11 PM »
How are we going to see the end of combat when the most popular class is literally called "Fighter"?

 ???
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HappyDaze

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2021, 07:06:32 PM »
How are we going to see the end of combat when the most popular class is literally called "Fighter"?

 ???
New Fighter subclass options will be based on making social media attacks against your opponents to inflict psychic damage. They will be called Twitterboys and have 12' tall suits of really shiny heavy armor and one really big oversized weapon (nonfunctional).

Ratman_tf

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2021, 07:11:17 PM »
Game combat, therefore, trains people to think in terms of violence as a valid solution to many of life's problems (or most, in the typical game milieu), as free of psychic consequence, and as intrinsically fun.

I utterly disagree with this conclusion.
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GeekyBugle

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2021, 07:39:50 PM »
This business of politicizing gaming in the southpaw direction, such that all monsters must be individuals capable of free will and, so, of any alignment, has implications beyond just erasing the trope of irredeemably evil races. It also attacks the central pillar of virtually all RPGs, which is combat.

Combat is the central pillar of virtually all RPGs? Says who? Where's the evidence to back this up?

Combat is cheap drama, and, in my experience, no games deal much or at all with the psychological scars and trauma that real life combat inflicts on its participants. Game combat, therefore, trains people to think in terms of violence as a valid solution to many of life's problems (or most, in the typical game milieu), as free of psychic consequence, and as intrinsically fun.

Bolding mine. Care to provide evidence for this extraordinary claim? Remember that extraordinary clai9ms require extraordinary evidence. I want to see a longitudinal study spawning several countries and years with ACTUAL gamers that proves this assertion, so far the only such study (about video games mind you) says you're talking BS.

Could this "woke" business therefore be the harbinger of the end of combat as cheap drama? Must all games then be sensitive to just how powerful getting into a fight is, with its ugly consequences of trauma, confusion, and murder, and, so, knock down this central pillar? If so, what will hold up the roof?

Remove the scare quotes, it is woke cultists promoting this changes.

Bolding mine. What!? Can you differentiate between make believe and reality? No one gets PTSD from RPG combat, because the only real individuals involved are humans in the real world, and if YOU want to role play such things in YOUR table by all means feel free to do so. But leave us out of your feverish dreams.
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Theory of Games

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2021, 07:43:47 PM »
No, riding the WoTC paradigm for combat is dead.

The idea of dice deciding outcomes is rough. You want dice, but what if using dice isn't as cool as rolling dice.

What if dice are a crutch? What if you don't need dice?

What if you need ALL the dice?
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GeekyBugle

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2021, 07:48:00 PM »
IMHO TTRPGs revolve around 3 pillars:

Exploration/Interaction/Conflict (Combat)

Exploration: Going to new places, this might be dungeons or wilderness (a dungeon in disguise IMHO)

Interaction: Talking to NPCs

Conflict (Combat): I call it conflict because not all is intended to be solved by violence from day one. Running or talking your way out has ALWAYS been an option. See that Bronze Dragon there? You could risk your PC's death by fighting it or you could talk to it and not risk your PC's life.
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Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

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Neoplatonist1

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2021, 08:59:06 PM »
This business of politicizing gaming in the southpaw direction, such that all monsters must be individuals capable of free will and, so, of any alignment, has implications beyond just erasing the trope of irredeemably evil races. It also attacks the central pillar of virtually all RPGs, which is combat.

Combat is the central pillar of virtually all RPGs? Says who? Where's the evidence to back this up?

Every RPG I've ever looked at has a big combat section. I have yet to find one that doesn’t. Care to submit some?

Quote
Combat is cheap drama, and, in my experience, no games deal much or at all with the psychological scars and trauma that real life combat inflicts on its participants. Game combat, therefore, trains people to think in terms of violence as a valid solution to many of life's problems (or most, in the typical game milieu), as free of psychic consequence, and as intrinsically fun.

Bolding mine. Care to provide evidence for this extraordinary claim? Remember that extraordinary clai9ms require extraordinary evidence. I want to see a longitudinal study spawning several countries and years with ACTUAL gamers that proves this assertion, so far the only such study (about video games mind you) says you're talking BS.

What RPGs do you know of that don’t have a large combat section? What psychic consequences are there for characters in D&D combat? What players of RPGs include combat while holding their nose? If it’s not meant to be fun why do games feature it?

Quote
Could this "woke" business therefore be the harbinger of the end of combat as cheap drama? Must all games then be sensitive to just how powerful getting into a fight is, with its ugly consequences of trauma, confusion, and murder, and, so, knock down this central pillar? If so, what will hold up the roof?

Remove the scare quotes, it is woke cultists promoting this changes.

Bolding mine. What!? Can you differentiate between make believe and reality? No one gets PTSD from RPG combat, because the only real individuals involved are humans in the real world, and if YOU want to role play such things in YOUR table by all means feel free to do so. But leave us out of your feverish dreams.

I’m referring to characters, not players. And, the context here is that wokies will continue to pull the thread that undoes everything that makes D&D enjoyable, in the name of their sensibilities and political agenda. See if they don't.

Neoplatonist1

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2021, 09:00:44 PM »
Game combat, therefore, trains people to think in terms of violence as a valid solution to many of life's problems (or most, in the typical game milieu), as free of psychic consequence, and as intrinsically fun.

I utterly disagree with this conclusion.

Well, perhaps you'd like to expand on your disagreement.

Reckall

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2021, 09:10:23 PM »
Actually, the answer will be "yes and no."

Combat by certain groups (white straight males) will be either frowned upon or a no-no against certain other groups (e.g. women). This is why male heroes can't defeat female villains in movies nowadays (Thor needing that lava monster to finish the job).

Amazingly enough, in Asian shows males kill females just fine.
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Reckall

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Re: Are we seeing the end of combat?
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2021, 09:13:08 PM »
This business of politicizing gaming in the southpaw direction, such that all monsters must be individuals capable of free will

If the monsters freely will to test their warhammers on your skull, violence will erupt fast.

The only game, in my knowledge, where if you enter combat you have already lost is Call of Cthulhu.
For every idiot who denounces Ayn Rand as "intellectualism" there is an excellent DM who creates a "Bioshock" adventure.