Quote from: zend0g;718528As someone that started playing just as 1st edition was rolling off the presses, the idea of purely random wandering monsters was already on its deathbed. You can see this in modules like the A* Slaver series (1980) where random monsters are based on the module's theme. In N1 Against the Cult of the Reptile God (1982), a low level party (1st level) makes a four day journey from Hochoch to Orlane. What is funny is that just bout any roll on the outdoor encounter table will overwhelmingly slaughter them. But hey, let's not let rules get in the way of a good adventure.

You are assuming here, that any encounter means 'enemy'. It is quite possible to encounter quite a bit with no one getting killed from either side.

Reasonable motivations and survival instinct will go a long way towards making quite a few encounters non-combative.

Quote from: RPGPundit;718510Exactly.  Avoiding needless prep is a nice side-effect, but the real purpose of random tables of all kinds (not just encounter tables) is that it keeps the GM from 'knowing what to expect' and then proceeding to thrust those expectations unto the players.

Another side-effect is the disjointed feel to the game that can come from the Gm 'not knowing what to expect'.

Quote from: Arminius;717508Obviously the opposite of random encounters is scripted, which entirely negate player choice. But I think GMs who improvise encounters (occurrence and nature) based on whim are relatively less likely to satisfy players who enjoy strategizing and balancing risks. Conversely if you rigidly adhere to a random encounter procedure, you're bound to upset players who find themselves in a really bad situation just because they were unlucky.

Note that it is not a binary situation. The non use of a random table doesn't mean what the referee decides the characters encounter is scripted. Like adjudicating combat actions it could be the plausible result of the circumstances the players have created by either going to a particular location or as a result of their choices.

On the whole Random encounters in Paizo's APs issue. What many RPGs or adventure product forget to explain is that the idea of the game to pretend you are a character in a different place or time. That the one if the referee job is to present the circumstances of the character AS IF THE PLAYERS ARE REALLY THERE.

Random encounter tables support this by simulate the random hustle and bustle of life in a given area or situation.

As for random tables in an adventure path messing up the XP path I only few that as a small problem. If random tables are being used it is likely the players are having their characters doing things outside of the detailed locales and events. The mistake many make is to keep the later modules frozen in time. Instead the referee needs to note which of the later plot elements would occur in the absence of player action and pull the trigger on them when the time comes.

Also work into his patter during a session a sense that the world has a life of its own and continues to move on its own. As others like Lord Vreeg and Benoist said a "World in motion"

Quote from: Sommerjon;718575Another side-effect is the disjointed feel to the game that can come from the Gm 'not knowing what to expect'.

For some of us, not knowing what to expect is the primary source of fun in rpg play. Knowing generally what will happen and the sequence of events is like watching a movie you have already seen. It can be fun but usually not as fun as seeing it for the first time.

Quote from: Sommerjon;718575Another side-effect is the disjointed feel to the game that can come from the Gm 'not knowing what to expect'.

That would be the sign of a poor GM; which means that if he instead made up his own ideas it would probably be just as disjointed. Or boring. Or any other host of sins.

Quote from: estar;718577Note that it is not a binary situation. The non use of a random table doesn't mean what the referee decides the characters encounter is scripted. Like adjudicating combat actions it could be the plausible result of the circumstances the players have created by either going to a particular location or as a result of their choices.

If it's already been determined that you're standing behind a door, then I'm not going to toss dice to see who's standing there. I would hope we could take such common sense as granted.

Quote from: RPGPundit;718599That would be the sign of a poor GM; which means that if he instead made up his own ideas it would probably be just as disjointed. Or boring. Or any other host of sins.

Never found it to be a sign of poor Gming, more a sign of, Gary is rolling on the arctic forest/hills random chart again, easily to see that from the past G,H,I,J encounters.

If you like a game of Players vs Gm Charts more power to you.

Quote from: Sommerjon;718634Never found it to be a sign of poor Gming, more a sign of, Gary is rolling on the arctic forest/hills random chart again, easily to see that from the past G,H,I,J encounters.

If you like a game of Players vs Gm Charts more power to you.

I have always dabbled, myself.  Neither a slave to the charts nor ignoring them completely.  If I feel I NEED an encounter, charts.  If charts are dumb I roll again or try and spin the result into something less dumb.

Quote from: Sommerjon;718575Another side-effect is the disjointed feel to the game that can come from the Gm 'not knowing what to expect'.

It is a skill though. You develop it through using the charts, and learning how to work them into the game. I personally am fine with GMs going either way. I you don't like them, more power to you and your table. For me, I find it adds more of what i like to the game (and i say that as someone who looked down on random encounters for years). Like anything else though it has potential downsides.

Quote from: RPGPundit;718510Exactly.  Avoiding needless prep is a nice side-effect, but the real purpose of random tables of all kinds (not just encounter tables) is that it keeps the GM from 'knowing what to expect' and then proceeding to thrust those expectations unto the players.

This really is a massive part of the RPG experience, even the GM is exploring and adventuring alongside the group.

Quote from: RPGPundit;716325Properly done random tables of all kinds are the very foundation-stone of sandbox play.

For me, random encounters* are nothing more than a way to add that odd bit of happenstance to a scenario and/or campaign.

* I 'd like to emphasize the random part of it. Truly random encounters can be good, neutral or bad for the PCs. Hell, they could be good, neutral or bad for the monsters, too. A second group of evil monsters might just start attacking the monsters the PCs were hiding from, for example.