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Author Topic: ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down  (Read 7339 times)

Spinachcat

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #30 on: August 17, 2020, 03:19:12 AM »
IP theft is real and happens often. I've heard plenty stories about playtesters stealing designs. Sometimes not even bothering to reskin the game. In our game design meetup, there's been lots of horror stories shared. And just like Omega said, you're in a bind because you MUST playtest your game, and you need playtesters outside of your own circle. And there's no way to bind them legally.

Shasarak

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #31 on: August 17, 2020, 04:03:31 AM »
From what I hear, Monopoly was stolen from the original designer so perhaps IP theft is just a tradition in board games?
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VengerSatanis

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #32 on: August 17, 2020, 10:19:59 AM »
Quote from: Morblot;1145131
Who the fuck is this Tenkar dude and why should I care? I know he writes some shitty blog I never read. What else does he do?


Tenkar's Tavern is today what Grognardia was a decade ago.  It's probably the biggest hub of OSR "activity" in the blog-o-sphere.  Besides his blog, he has a podcast (surprise, surprise) and works closely with Frog God Games and a couple other major OSR publishers.  Personally, he and I were on good terms for awhile... until he denounced me for being za'akier.

VS

VisionStorm

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2020, 10:52:32 AM »
Quote from: capvideo;1145127
Calling this precedent would be difficult, because DTRPG has already done this. They've been doing it since at least 2014 when they took down a card game making fun of the GamerGate karens.

Not saying I agree with them taking down this one, I don't. But this is nothing new for them.


Difference here is that this is the first time that I'm aware of that they've taken something down promoting ideas associated with "left-wing" politics. If I recall correctly that card game was made by people on the GamerGate side (I think Grim Jim was one of the people involved; don't recall). Other times they've taken stuff down has been for being non-woke. This is the first I've heard they've taken a "woke" game down, hence, a "precedence" has been established. Now ANY type of game can go down.

JeffB

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2020, 11:05:17 AM »
Quote from: VengerSatanis;1145231
Tenkar's Tavern is today what Grognardia was a decade ago.  It's probably the biggest hub of OSR "activity" in the blog-o-sphere.  Besides his blog, he has a podcast (surprise, surprise) and works closely with Frog God Games and a couple other major OSR publishers.  Personally, he and I were on good terms for awhile... until he denounced me for being za'akier.

VS


That's an insult to James M and Grognardia!!! :D.

I never understood why Tenkar had any following whatsoever on his website- His BLOG is borderline useless, on a rare occasion he will have something newsworthy (Like Gail) I recently tried listening to his Podcasts... and lets just say CHA was his dump stat.  Nothing personal against the man, I just don't understand the allure.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2020, 11:07:58 AM by JeffB »

FelixGamingX1

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2020, 11:25:09 AM »
Quote from: Omega;1145199
Ohhhh you want paranoia?

Here. Let me "help" you.

Many a year back I had a playtester steal one of my playtest race designs and sell art prints of it as his own creation. He still plays the victim painting me the one making false claim. joy.
Years before that theres a popular board game you may or may not have heard of. Supremacy. That was stolen during playtest and sold to a publisher. The original designer never saw a dime.
Over on BGG theres designers who tell people that is "ok for playtesters to steal a design because game designs arent protected.".

No. Im not making any of this up and there is so much more.

Problem is. You need playtesters to make sure your design isnt broke. You need eyes on your design in case something like the above or worse does happen.


Wow! Yeah man BGG in general is just garbage. Had to get in contact with their host because people were uploading spoilers and engaging in defamatory ways about me and my games without any sort of proof to back their shit up. Mods refused to take images down upon request, till I resorted to more extreme measures. You really need to monitor their site from time to time if you're a publisher. I think it's a fucking joke 9/10 users have game designer badges and nothing to show.
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cenmarik

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #36 on: August 17, 2020, 11:40:18 AM »
Couldn't an NDA be used for something like that? With an agreement that the person(s) could be held liable for a similar design for Xyrs? (Much like people who are barred from working in a certain profession for Xyrs.) Also, if they provide proper feedback they (for example) would receive a free copy when it hits? I'm not a lawyer, so any feedback from knowledgeable people would be enlightening.

FelixGamingX1

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #37 on: August 17, 2020, 11:54:52 AM »
Quote from: cenmarik;1145251
Couldn't an NDA be used for something like that? With an agreement that the person(s) could be held liable for a similar design for Xyrs? (Much like people who are barred from working in a certain profession for Xyrs.) Also, if they provide proper feedback they (for example) would receive a free copy when it hits? I'm not a lawyer, so any feedback from knowledgeable people would be enlightening.


EULA on everything you create! The text alone is good deterrent and if people get wise you can just hire representation to do a desist order or take it to litigation in most extreme cases. The problem is we shouldn't have to do it because the point is to game and have a good time but there are idiots out there that always cross the boundaries. On the 3D game I'm creating the stakes are way higher so there's already one huge EULA coming along with it. None of that decompiling or reverse engineering nonsense unless granted written permission by me. Fortunately for 99.9% of customers all you need to do is buy and play like any other product.
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trechriron

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2020, 05:56:05 PM »
NDAs are important. I have friends agree to the "FNDA" on a Discord I control to get access to my designs. F = friends, family, foes, and fiends!! Always NDA.

I have signed and agreed to many FNDAs over the years. It doesn't offend me at all. Creators should protect their shit. It's important.
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Spinachcat

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #39 on: August 17, 2020, 11:52:50 PM »
NDAs aren't worth the paper they're printed on (or the pixels) UNLESS you have the money to spend on legal muscle.
And even then, you can easily dump loads of money on lawsuit and win little to nothing back.

In our local playtest design group, we have private teams of people trusted by designers and then public playtests when the game is ready to go to press. Several published designers shrug off the IP theft issue because the amount of effort protecting designs isn't worth the end result. They've told me horror stories about the Chinese market where you can find barely reskinned versions of many successful Western games and the designers never see a dime. Even worse, a couple designers say that their own printers in China are cranking out extra copies and selling them on Amazon in the USA. They proved the issue by showing how Amazon had brand new copies being sold by 3rd party sellers, but the designer was selling the game directly so nobody should have any new copies except the designer.

Quote from: VengerSatanis;1145231
until he denounced me for being za'akier.


How dare he say that!!!

That's an insult to za'akiers!!! :D

Fergurg

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #40 on: August 18, 2020, 12:49:25 AM »
Quote from: moonsweeper;1144856
Oh fuck...

$100 internet bucks says DTRPG jumped on this so hard for exactly ONE reason...They just set the precedent for removal of ANYTHING they might view as 'political'

...and they can point this out and say they did it to an SJW-oriented/leftist product, so they obviously are able be fair about it...


I'll take that bet. Sure, they censored a leftist, but it's clear that they didn't know that. If they knew that ACAB was a phrase invented and used by Antifa, this product would have been their Pick of the Week.

Omega

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #41 on: August 18, 2020, 06:46:25 AM »
Quote from: FelixGamingX1;1145248
I think it's a fucking joke 9/10 users have game designer badges and nothing to show.


Not that many. But it feels so high because BGG allows way too often WIPs and PNPs up as real games, even vaporware. For a time the cracked down on this after a few contests required your WIP to have a game page. But its started up again in the last year or so. Tons of dead entries of games that essentially dont exist. Or games that were taken down by designers in WIP stage as they got greedy at a hint of publishing. Lots of that going on. Theres opposition. But it tends to go overboard. BGG is a mess on so many levels. Moreso if you have the misfortune to have seen whats going on covertly over there.

Its alot like RPGnet. You can putter around for years and never see anything amiss. Or BOOM ram right into it and regret ever visiting.

Pat
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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #42 on: August 18, 2020, 08:39:26 AM »
Quote from: Fergurg;1145323
If they knew that ACAB was a phrase invented and used by Antifa...

Nah, they just stole it. ACAB originated in prison and skinhead culture.

moonsweeper

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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #43 on: August 18, 2020, 04:43:41 PM »
Quote from: Fergurg;1145323
I'll take that bet. Sure, they censored a leftist, but it's clear that they didn't know that. If they knew that ACAB was a phrase invented and used by Antifa, this product would have been their Pick of the Week.

Oh I am sure they are quite aware of it...but it is just a nobody on that side which can be sacrificed for the "greater good."
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ACAB - Erik "Karen" Tavern gets OBS module taken down
« Reply #44 on: August 23, 2020, 08:01:23 AM »
As I was saying.

I wrote to DT complaining over this 'ban'. I basically heard nothing back, so I've sent them another mail. I'll keep you chaps informed should I get a response.
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