Quote from: jeff37923 on November 16, 2021, 03:39:44 AM
I'll pay attention when you produce something more than hype.

I hope the rest of your day gets better, you grump . I appreciate OP did not come here to sell a Kickstarter or link to OBS.

For IOgames, this thread re-enforces something you likely already know. It is better to be everything to a select group of people than to try to please everyone. Plant your flag, and plant it deep. Good luck with Other Earths and your game.

Quote from: FingerRod on November 16, 2021, 07:27:39 AM

For IOgames, this thread re-enforces something you likely already know. It is better to be everything to a select group of people than to try to please everyone. Plant your flag, and plant it deep. Good luck with Other Earths and your game.

Thank you for your kind words! We know our IP won't be satisfying to everyone, and we are completely okay with that. We trust that many out there will see the merit in our work when the time comes.

Quote from: IOgames on November 16, 2021, 02:58:49 AM
To answer your first point. We wanted to create a game that allowed for a variety of play styles and in game objectives. We found that the best possible way to do that was to incorporate different elements of different genres. In Other Earths you will be called upon in some instances to go down the hole and kill the monster, and in other instances you'll be sent to retrieve energy resources from another timeline teeming with nuclear fallout and hazardous terrain, and in other instances you can get embroiled in a gang war for control of sections of the city.

Sure fine, but I can do all that with any one of a dozen generic systems already on my shelf. The ability to jump between say five fairly bland and cliche'd sounding milieux is not five times better than being stuck in one. What makes your setting original and compelling beyond what any of us could homebrew in 5 minutes?

Quote from: IOgames on November 16, 2021, 02:58:49 AM
Also as a sidenote, our decision to limit ours playable races to 3 of the classic DnD fantasy races was done partially for simplifying the character creation process, and also partially to eliminate the need for players to purchase custom miniatures in order to play the game. And if they wanted to generate their own miniatures through 3d printing it is easy to find pre rendered assets of those 3 races versus some race we conceive of. So there are logistical reasons for that decision.

So... minis are strongly encouraged? Actually required?

Presumably that is dwarves, elves, halflings (assuming humans aren't a fantasy race, heh). I get the minis rationale, but you are giving yourself an uphill battle here to seem distinctive or exciting.

If you do limit it to the classic 3-stack, what are you doing to make them interesting to play? Are they genuinely alien creatures, or just humans in suits with some preset abilities?

Quote from: IOgames on November 16, 2021, 02:58:49 AM
In terms of conflict there is an overarching narrative that is completed through the campaign. Our main goal is to make the player feel capable of acting in the world, but also feel like an every man character. They are not some unstoppable powerhouse that can change the course of large events on a whim, but they are players in the game, and assist in the outcome of events orchestrated by the factions or major players in the world.

Are you saying there is going to be a set campaign path? Can the PCs determine the outcome of the conflict?

Quote from: IOgames on November 16, 2021, 02:58:49 AM
The language used for the 1-5 system can sound a bit narrow but in practice we've found it to offer a good deal of balance to the gameplay. It is also based off of the math of how likely it is to roll 5 successes with a pool of 7 dice. And as said earlier the player is not supposed to be an unstoppable action hero, so when you start getting into level 5 difficulty checks we wanted a system that would limit the rate of successes at those levels.

I'm not intimately familiar with the Mythras system, but I'm sure there are some similarities. I will say our system has existed since Joshua first developed it well before when Mythras released, but the game itself was still in its conceptual infancy so the system never got beyond his table until recently. as I stated earlier I'm going to refer to Joshua for all dice system related questions because he's more intimately familiar with it.

I hope these answers help out. Obviously I can't do a full dive into the content and all the nitty gritty of the game just yet, but we are going to continue to release material as we get closer to January, and hopefully we can satisfy any and all concerns!

I get that you are not mainly the rules guy, but a new system is another uphill battle to sell to people. Few of us can be bothered learning new mechanics and even fewer new mechanics these days really accomplish anything that existing ones don't do. I am not alleging you have copied Mythras, as it is a d100 roll-under game which is clearly far removed from yours. However in general this kind of progressive or granular task resolution has been a thing since at least the Ringworld d100 game in the early 80s (others can probably cite earlier examples, and anyway people probably started doing it playing OD&D in the 70s), so my advice is don't try and claim that as an innovation.

I am going to be blunt: I am not seeing anything so far to get me interested, and a few things to put me off. Hone your elevator pitch. There is a world of difference between the feeling of this wonderful excitement you probably have bubbling inside right now, and successfully conveying it to other people.

Out of interest what production values are you aiming for, on a scale of 1=stapled photocopied sheet to 10=Symbaroum?

Edit because I have had a few beers and messed up the bold.

What makes our setting unique, to us at least, is the way we explore the interplay of different races and cultures who are forced to not only interact but to cooperate for survival. Like I said in a previous post, several of the cultures were virtually identical in the past until there was a historical divergence, and that changed the course of their society in major ways. We believe this gives us compelling opportunities to tell stories about both those cultures as a whole and individuals within them dealing with not only racial, but political and religious differences as well.

To this end we have created a diplomacy system that we think players will find engaging. Talking is itself a form of combat in our system. Aside from a selection of diplomacy abilities, some that are utilized through in game roleplaying, we have what we call the Alarm system. It is a way for talkers to accurately gauge and manage levels of conflict and avoid combat entirely or defuse it once it has already began. We want the cultures and races you choose to play and engage with to have an impact of gameplay. If you belong to a culture from one timeline, an NPC from another timeline will have a higher Alarm level to you by default, and it will be harder to avoid an altercation with them.


We do not require minis, nor are they even strongly encouraged. I'm sorry if I gave that impression. Nevertheless we understand that miniatures are a staple of the genre and there are players who enjoy having them and utilizing them when they play. Our main goal with this game is accessibility. If a player wants to run a game of Other Earths with miniatures, they can do so for the most part without having to go out and buy a bunch of specific minis, we of course have original creatures that we want to produce minis for eventually, but we have tried to avoid the need for too many specialized ones.


For the question on what makes them distinct. Each race not only has its own "racial bonus" based on physiological and psychological differences, but each culture from the different timelines has their own bonuses as well. So picking your race and timeline does have weight. Beyond this again I will refer back to the cultures we have crafted. We believe that they will offer a myriad of opportunities for roleplay within the game that will make each type of character feel distinct.


In terms of the campaign narrative. There are certain "key events" that will happen no matter what on a very large scale (the course of a war for instance), but underneath that high level the players have a great deal of freedom to affect things within the city. Again, we aren't trying to craft a game that makes you the Super Action Hero. You are a band of mercenaries, making your way in a city filled with other mercenaries, gangs, private armies, cults, etc. The narrative is a backdrop that keeps the setting from stagnating.


You are right. People do not want to learn new mechanics as a general rule. We understand this and readily admit that some people may be turned away from our product by that. That being said, the whole point of us making this system was twofold: 1) speed up gameplay and combat. 2) give new players a system that is accessible and easy to pick up.

This board, yourself included I assume, are passionate longtime gamers who have seen a lot of different things come and go. We definitely want to provide a rich and compelling experience for you. But we also want to consider those players who have no experience with ttrpgs, or have only played d20 systems like DnD and Pathfinder. We want to give them a system that is quick to pick up and easy to digest, and offers quicker gameplay than those d20 models.


You are right, our elevator pitch could use some honing. Part of why I appreciate this feedback is that it will help me do that going forward. I'm sorry to hear that I haven't been able to get you interested, but I have a firm belief that given the opportunity we will prove ourselves. Until then I can only be sincere in explaining our intentions.

As far as production values. Money will be the deciding factor. I would love to eventually put out a Symbaroum level product, and hopefully we will. We are planning on hard and softcover books once we get a little traction, and we want to go the extra mile to make sure they are well made and a worthwhile investment. I'll go ahead and say that I'd rather not do a physical copy if we couldn't get the production level to at least a 7 on your scale, and just stick with pdfs.

As things stand right now we are going to print with black and white art, and we are going to offer art light pdfs at first just to get people introduced to the game. The full first edition will eventually be printed in color. As far as the quality of the art, we have been working with mostly student artists and other freelancers, and we have a variety of styles in the book. We think it's all good quality and stand behind it!


Sorry that this post is so long winded. I just want to make sure that I cover all of your concerns. I hope this does help explain why we are a worthwhile project, and, if nothing else, worthy of keeping an open mind about. We are hoping to provide a system and rules that novice players will find readily accessible, and a setting and gameplay experience that veteran players will find fun and rewarding.

Quote from: Marchand on November 16, 2021, 10:07:05 AM
I get that you are not mainly the rules guy, but a new system is another uphill battle to sell to people. Few of us can be bothered learning new mechanics and even fewer new mechanics these days really accomplish anything that existing ones don't do.

I'm going to quibble with this point.  I find learning new systems trivial, and I've never been in a group that was much bothered by switching games and systems.  I'm sure it's not universal, but I know lots of folks just don't see that as a problem.  I'm always interested in seeing how a system integrates with the setting conceits and enables the desired mode of play.

Quote from: Mishihari on November 17, 2021, 07:55:23 AM

Quote from: Marchand on November 16, 2021, 10:07:05 AM
I get that you are not mainly the rules guy, but a new system is another uphill battle to sell to people. Few of us can be bothered learning new mechanics and even fewer new mechanics these days really accomplish anything that existing ones don't do.

I'm going to quibble with this point.  I find learning new systems trivial, and I've never been in a group that was much bothered by switching games and systems.  I'm sure it's not universal, but I know lots of folks just don't see that as a problem.  I'm always interested in seeing how a system integrates with the setting conceits and enables the desired mode of play.

Agreed. Plus, the system does not seem too complex, and it shares DNA with many we have played. It won't kill the game, IMO... plus, if the "hype for system" could smooth out, then the cool stuff can be front and center (setting mainly). That's the tough part, I think, to position a game setting into the huge range already there.

Quote from: Mishihari on November 17, 2021, 07:55:23 AM

Quote from: Marchand on November 16, 2021, 10:07:05 AM
I get that you are not mainly the rules guy, but a new system is another uphill battle to sell to people. Few of us can be bothered learning new mechanics and even fewer new mechanics these days really accomplish anything that existing ones don't do.

I'm going to quibble with this point.  I find learning new systems trivial, and I've never been in a group that was much bothered by switching games and systems.  I'm sure it's not universal, but I know lots of folks just don't see that as a problem.  I'm always interested in seeing how a system integrates with the setting conceits and enables the desired mode of play.

I can & do switch systems with ease. I have a few other players that can do the same. I have one player that can switch to whatever, but that's because he never really learns any system. And then I have the GURPS guy that decided 30 years ago that he'd never need to learn another system (despite the fact that none of the rest of us want to play GURPS).

Quote from: soundchaser on November 17, 2021, 08:24:01 AM


Agreed. Plus, the system does not seem too complex, and it shares DNA with many we have played. It won't kill the game, IMO... plus, if the "hype for system" could smooth out, then the cool stuff can be front and center (setting mainly). That's the tough part, I think, to position a game setting into the huge range already there.

We are finding that to be the tricky part. This is one of our first forays in marketing the game. And it is quite an expansive project so we are trying to find the best way to convey what makes it worthwhile! But we are getting there.

As for the hype for system. I have spoken with Josh and he has agreed that the dice system itself is not as unique as it was perhaps when he made it many years ago, and we have accordingly softened the language on the website and our socials to reflect this new stance. But he believes that certain game mechanics we have, when used with the dice system, make for a very streamlined and enjoyable game experience, and hopefully one that new players who are not familiar with ttrpg systems and rules will find easy to approach!

This was not intended to be a hype post or a sales pitch originally, and I do apologize if it went that direction, there will be more material put up on the website in the coming days and weeks that will go into our setting and the mechanics of the game more for those who do want to learn more about it!

Quote from: Mishihari on November 17, 2021, 07:55:23 AM

Quote from: Marchand on November 16, 2021, 10:07:05 AM
I get that you are not mainly the rules guy, but a new system is another uphill battle to sell to people. Few of us can be bothered learning new mechanics and even fewer new mechanics these days really accomplish anything that existing ones don't do.

I'm going to quibble with this point.  I find learning new systems trivial, and I've never been in a group that was much bothered by switching games and systems.  I'm sure it's not universal, but I know lots of folks just don't see that as a problem.  I'm always interested in seeing how a system integrates with the setting conceits and enables the desired mode of play.

Fair enough. I actually quite like dabbling with mechanics myself. My personal experience has been selling new systems to groups has been tough.

My counsel to the OP remains, the rest of the world is not guaranteed to get excited about your game just because you think it's great, or even just because it actually is great. Think hard about what makes your game distinctive and exciting to play (not what would make it a cool setting for a film or a novel), and hone that down into 2 or 3 sentences. Hell, I might buy it.

Quote from: Marchand on November 18, 2021, 10:18:39 PM
My counsel to the OP remains, the rest of the world is not guaranteed to get excited about your game just because you think it's great, or even just because it actually is great. Think hard about what makes your game distinctive and exciting to play (not what would make it a cool setting for a film or a novel), and hone that down into 2 or 3 sentences. Hell, I might buy it.

I really appreciate the feedback and the advice! We are in the process of refining our pitch. I'm confident that if we can distill what we feel when we play the game, you will definitely want to buy it!

Quote from: IOgames on November 16, 2021, 11:09:15 AM
Talking is itself a form of combat in our system.

Ah, I see you've met my ex wife. (Ta-da, tsch.)