5E - making static spells more active?

Bren · August 24, 2014, 02:46:02 AM

From Trollsmyth's blog.

Quote from: TrollsmythCheck out this bit from the spell flesh to stone (page 243 for those of you playing along at home):
A creature restrained by this spell must make another Constitution saving throw at the end of each of its turns. If it successfully saves against this spell three times, the spell ends. If it fails its save three times, it is turned to stone…
Yep, turning someone to stone is no longer a quick, save-or-die roll. I think all the old save-or-die spells have been changed this way. Mearls said he wanted to end the anticlimax of facing down the ancient dragon in its lair, only to have it fail a save in the first moment of combat and end the fight right there.
I’m not sure how much I agree with that goal, but it certainly makes those spells a lot more exciting and dramatic in combat.

I think this is an interesting mechanic for a save-or-something kinds of spells especially when the target of the spell is either a PC or a significant adversary. Allowing the target a chance to fight off the effect of the spell keeps the player(s) interested in the spell effect beyond the single round of casting. I will also be looking to see where I can use this idea for other games.

Necrozius · August 24, 2014, 07:19:33 AM

I like it too because it actually makes me think of dramatic visuals (the cursed character's skin gradually turning grey and colorless) and it gives the target something to do as they struggle with the magic. Like, if they feel like things are going badly, they can take steps to end up somewhere effective or dramatic (the PC positions him/herself defensively in front of an ally when they finally turn to stone). Or with their hands around the neck of the enemy spellcaster. Or firmly holding their fabled magic sword ("No-one shall wield Stormbringer except meeeeeeee---").

Omega · August 25, 2014, 12:06:21 AM

Quote from: Necrozius;782276I like it too because it actually makes me think of dramatic visuals (the cursed character's skin gradually turning grey and colorless) and it gives the target something to do as they struggle with the magic.

That didnt help Conan's family or those warriors in Clash of the Titans... aheh...

Your idea of dramatic is different from someone elses.

5e Petrification is more like the Hammer Horror movie "The Gorgon" style of slower more agonizing petrification.

crkrueger · August 25, 2014, 12:57:09 AM

It allows old schoolers to introduce all kinds of attacks with real consequences.
It's a very cinematic aesthetic that lends itself well to dramatic tension and description in a combat.
It also comes with built-in defense against the special snowflake brigade (Dude, you failed your save THREE times, what the hell you expect?)

Someone over there has their thinking cap on and is truly examining the game from the point of multiple playerbases at once.

1of3 · August 25, 2014, 05:31:49 AM

But, you know that this way of handling spells came up in 4e?

Gold Roger · August 25, 2014, 06:54:44 AM

Yep, I think this is one of the things wotc got right when they developed 4e.

It also allows groups so inclined the time to look for creative solutions.

I rememberback in 3rd edition times I once had an altar that turned those that stole from the offerings into ophidians. Naturaly, one PC couldn't resist and failed his throw.

I described how the transformation started with his hand and spread along the limb.

Long story short, he cut of his arm and was spared further effect.

Necrozius · August 25, 2014, 07:34:16 AM

Quote from: Omega;782435That didnt help Conan's family or those warriors in Clash of the Titans... aheh...

Your idea of dramatic is different from someone elses.

5e Petrification is more like the Hammer Horror movie "The Gorgon" style of slower more agonizing petrification.

Fair enough! I like both styles. My reaction was just the initial, first impression.

Exploderwizard · August 25, 2014, 10:45:54 AM

Quote from: Gold Roger;782466Long story short, he cut of his arm and was spared further effect.

And in 5E this will be an easy fix because the arm will grow right back after a good nights sleep.

Bill · August 25, 2014, 12:17:51 PM

Quote from: Exploderwizard;782500And in 5E this will be an easy fix because the arm will grow right back after a good nights sleep.

That is a good example of why I am tempted to track critical hit damage, or damage below zero, as hp you can't heal back as quickly.

Something like that.

It's like in 1E dnd when a fighter that has low hp, like 4 as his max, heals up to full fast.

RPGPundit · September 02, 2014, 12:20:14 AM

I had already done something along these lines in my Albion game (and Arrows of Indra) with regard to Poison. In that the saving throw was done some time after the exposure (the time depending on the poison), meaning that life and death would become an uncertainty for the character involved after exposure. Time to try to save themselves, or time to try to do one last heroic/villainous thing, etc.

It's so much better than "Save and be instantly fine" vs. "fail and die immediately".

Omega · September 02, 2014, 12:38:22 AM

Quote from: Exploderwizard;782500And in 5E this will be an easy fix because the arm will grow right back after a good nights sleep.

We are really starfish...

This is me and the rest of the adventuring group...

Will · September 02, 2014, 12:53:35 AM

Quote from: Exploderwizard;782500And in 5E this will be an easy fix because the arm will grow right back after a good nights sleep.

Given there's a regenerate spell that specifically mentions regrowing limbs, I think this is an unsupported assertion.