4th OSG Confession - I'm OK will levels now.

Llew ap Hywel · August 19, 2017, 05:23:23 AM

Quote from: Dumarest;985043Personally I don't care for levels but it wouldn't stop me from playing a game that is otherwise good.

This healthy attitude is why I'm still playing D&D, good times with a good group make a mediocre game great.

The Exploited. · August 19, 2017, 07:22:50 AM

Quote from: Voros;985129Generally agree but I think I'm having issues thinking of a good game that actually has levels besides D&D. Ever since CoC they seemed unneccesary.

I do think they are a big part of the long term appeal of D&D though.

I think for that big player progression, the long D&D type game you mentioned, They seem to be a staple. In games like Otherdust, they are there but they don't have all that much of a mechanical effect. So, they are not the be all and end all. I mean you could play away at level 3 for years and be happy with just a good game.

The Exploited. · August 19, 2017, 07:23:22 AM

Quote from: HorusArisen;985147This healthy attitude is why I'm still playing D&D, good times with a good group make a mediocre game great.

Can't ask for much more then that!

The Exploited. · August 19, 2017, 07:26:51 AM

Quote from: Spinachcat;985140I am meh on levels, but players seem to love them.

Even when we played GURPS and HERO, the players wanted XP in chunks. AKA, we would play until the GM gave us 10 XP to spend and we'd "level up" our PCs.

I'm perfectly fine with games that don't have them... Yeah, I remember the chunking up effect too. Our old group for Vampire did something similar, we'd all wait and then level up - despite there being no levels. It's just that old RPing mentality.

The Exploited. · August 19, 2017, 07:29:39 AM

Quote from: S'mon;985143I love levels & levelling up - except in 3e D&D style "build" games where you are supposed to choose tons of stuff and a bad choice will permanently cripple your PC. And 4e suffers from the "running to stay still" issue where the world seems to level around the PCs. But levelling in 0e-2e and 5e D&D is great fun.

I think most people do as it's a tangible reward. I've no experience with the later versions of D&D, to be honest. But the way everyone seems to love 5e I'll have to check it out at some point.

Gronan of Simmerya · August 21, 2017, 02:50:31 PM

ZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...............

Crom's hairy nutsack, I come back from GenCon to THIS old chestnut? Is it 1976?

Psikerlord · August 22, 2017, 03:05:22 AM

I like levels ala dnd (preferably up to about 10th-12th, not beyond coz weird shit happens) and I also like no levels (ala Shadowrun).

I definitely want to see PC improvement/progression however as the game rolls on. I get bored if there's no progression.

Johnnii · August 22, 2017, 04:11:17 AM

Interesting, because for me it's the same but total opposite.

I started with a BRP variant (swedish game) in my early teen years as well. Started playing D&D around 18
(3rd edition) and stayed on d&d and d20 for almost ten years. After that, I went back to another BRP variant and then other level-less RPGs. So now, I rarely want to touch any game that has D&D-type levels in it.

The Exploited. · August 22, 2017, 08:38:09 AM

Quote from: Psikerlord;985863I like levels ala dnd (preferably up to about 10th-12th, not beyond coz weird shit happens) and I also like no levels (ala Shadowrun).

I definitely want to see PC improvement/progression however as the game rolls on. I get bored if there's no progression.

I'd be the same man, but I think Levels have a great sweet spot. But once it passes that threshold things start to break down, like physics in a black hole.

There's got to be some form of progression as you say, otherwise, everything feels too static. And levels give you that instant hit.

The Exploited. · August 22, 2017, 08:41:31 AM

Quote from: Johnnii;985866I rarely want to touch any game that has D&D-type levels in it.

I was the same for years as well... I thought they were ridiculous. Although, I saw recently the way some games were working within the parameters of the system and they definitely opened my eyes a bit (like Beyond the Wall).

But I like a lot of games that have no such leveling system as well.

cranebump · August 23, 2017, 08:46:51 PM

I'm running a new campaign with a pair of newbs and two 4E refugees, using Black Hack, with a tweak or two. After the funnel, already have players discussing character backgrounds and such via email. They're taking what they did in the funnel, and retconning those actions into who the character was/is. The ain't a lot of mechanics in the Hack, so this is where the rubber meets the road. Player imagination, which relates to your comment about differentiation through RP and what the "story" that comes from character actions, rather than encoded widgets. Good stuff (and levels are just fine with me).

danskmacabre · August 23, 2017, 11:54:03 PM

Levelling is more rewarding and good light fun.
As pointed out, Sine Nomine games use levelling and it's less noticeable than say, DnD, which is good in it's own way.

I've generally split what I run atm between Sine Nomine games (mostly SWN) which are more gritty levelless gaming (although it has levels) and DnD 5e, which is light, fun, old fashioned DnD in style where whole levelling thing is right in your face.

RPGPundit · August 29, 2017, 04:22:09 AM

Levels are the worst method of advancement; except for every other method.

The Exploited. · August 29, 2017, 06:36:52 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit;987545Levels are the worst method of advancement; except for every other method.

This is it they do the job.

Bren · August 29, 2017, 09:50:40 PM

Put me in the I don't much care for levels camp.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;985710Crom's hairy nutsack, I come back from GenCon to THIS old chestnut? Is it 1976?

It's always 1976 somewhen.

Quote from: RPGPundit;987545Levels are the worst method of advancement; except for every other method.

Simple methods for simple minds.