X-Wing Miniatures thread.

[Ddogwood]

This game made me cry.

I played the basic game a few times and loved it.  Easy, straightforward, balanced.

Then people started buying the expansion packs and the damn cards that you can hang off your ships, and I totally lost interest.  I wish they sold the basic X wing and TIE fighter outside the expensive starter sets.

I think the balance has generally improved, honestly.  4 X-wings vs. 8 TIE fighters is not a fair matchup.

I do think that the Heroes of the Aturi Cluster variant is by far the most enjoyable way to play, however.

[Gronan of Simmerya]

Your wish is granted.
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/x-wing/

...is that new? Because I missed it if not.

Okay, still pricey as hell, but that makes me happy.  And the miniatures are mouth-wateringly good.

The game actually reminds me of a LOT of old WW1 and WW2 aircraft combat games of the 60s and 70s. But they include stuff like bases that lock onto the turning circles and turning circles of heavy cardboard instead of paper.  And they've eliminated the paperwork by using all kinds of specialized components.

Expensive, yes, but I understand WHY it's expensive, and they've made the game play much more streamlined.

[Gronan of Simmerya]

I think the balance has generally improved, honestly.  4 X-wings vs. 8 TIE fighters is not a fair matchup.

I do think that the Heroes of the Aturi Cluster variant is by far the most enjoyable way to play, however.

Well, second point first, I simply hate the "deck building" aspect that a LOT of miniatures games have acquired.  YMMV.

As far as "balance," as an old miniatures gamer learning to balance a scenario is part of learning to set up a scenario.  How many P-38Js are a matchup for 5 Zekes?  If the Americans have two platoons of Shermans, what should the German force be?

I very, very strongly want a game where "An X wing is an X wing is an X wing is an X wing," and the ONLY differentiation between the ships on a team is the skill of the player.

I want a WARGAME.

[yosemitemike]

The game actually reminds me of a LOT of old WW1 and WW2 aircraft combat games of the 60s and 70s. But they include stuff like bases that lock onto the turning circles and turning circles of heavy cardboard instead of paper.  And they've eliminated the paperwork by using all kinds of specialized components.

X-Wing is based on WW1/WW2 game called Wings of Glory/Wings of War which I think is based on that older game.  X-Wing is simpler, easier to pick up and based on a popular franchise.  Wings of War/Glory takes more planning since you have to set maneuvers two turns in advance and is more scenario based without the beck building/collecting  mechanism that X-Wing has.  I have the WWII version with Spitfires and Me-190s for Battle of Britain and Wildcats vs Zeros for Pacific theater.  It might actually be a better game for you.
http://www.aresgames.eu/games/ww2-wings-of-glory-line/ww2-wings-of-glory-starter-set
http://www.miniaturemarket.com/table-top-miniatures/wings-of-war.html#/?_=1&filter.category_hierarchy=Table%20Top%20Miniatures%2FWings%20of%20Glory%2FWorld%20War%20II&page=1

Well, second point first, I simply hate the "deck building" aspect that a LOT of miniatures games have acquired.  YMMV.

As far as "balance," as an old miniatures gamer learning to balance a scenario is part of learning to set up a scenario.  How many P-38Js are a matchup for 5 Zekes?  If the Americans have two platoons of Shermans, what should the German force be?

The simple solution would be to use set scenarios and provide lists.  Have everyone play the generic pilots instead of the named ones and give set upgrades to every ship of a given type.  Maybe throw in one named pilot per squad to represent a leader.  It would avoid the crazy deck building aspect of the game and prevent people with large collections from cherry picking all the broken stuff from all the expansions they own.  By the way. all X-Wings (except for the Force Awakens one which is an upgraded version) are the same.  The differences represent different pilots.

[Ratman_tf]

I think if you restrict your purchases to the 'canon' film ships, you can still get a pretty simple game. A-Wing, X-Wing, Y-Wing, B-Wing, TIE Fighter, TIE Bomber, TIE Interceptor, TIE Advanced.
Some of the ships underperform for their points until they get some of the later upgrades, but not so badly that they aren't viable. Just meh.
Most ordinance sucks, and the Falcon can get pretty cheesy even without C-3PO. (Turret is OP!!! )

[Gronan of Simmerya]

By the way. all X-Wings (except for the Force Awakens one which is an upgraded version) are the same.  The differences represent different pilots.

I realize that, but I want ALL X-wings to be mechanically the same. I don't want a "pilot" character whose skill is different from mine.

And I may have to check out Wings of War WW2 version.  As Chirine can tell you, I've been in love with WW2 aircraft combat games since I got into wargaming, and never HAVE found one that quite grabbed me for miniatures.

[yosemitemike]

And I may have to check out Wings of War WW2 version.  As Chirine can tell you, I've been in love with WW2 aircraft combat games since I got into wargaming, and never HAVE found one that quite grabbed me for miniatures.

It's a very simple, beer and pretzels sort of game.  Handling characteristics of different aircraft are abstracted and handled very simply with the maneuver system.  Every plane comes with a small set of maneuver cards that define what maneuvers it can take and that are used as maneuver templates.  You lay them down during planning.  When you do the maneuver, you simply pick up the card, line up the mark on one end with the mark on the plane's base and then move it to the other end so it's lined up again.  The cards themselves reflect different handling characteristics.  Faster planes will have longer lines on the cards.  Planes that turn better have options for cards with more sharply curving lines.  I think it's well done and clever but it's very beer and pretzels.  If you want a simulation, this isn't it.

[Gronan of Simmerya]

As long as it takes altitude into account somehow and makes it tactically favorable to get on your enemy's six, I'm happy.

Playability is a high premium with me.

[yosemitemike]

As long as it takes altitude into account somehow and makes it tactically favorable to get on your enemy's six, I'm happy.

Playability is a high premium with me.

The altitude system is very abstract and simple.  Essentially, you add or subtract clear pegs to show altitude.  It has a simple rule for tailing.  The player controlling the tailing plane gets to look at the next maneuver card for the tailed plane so you can get a bit of information about where they will be.  In this game, that's a significant advantage.  Also, most planes only fire out an an arc in the front marked on the base so you can shoot them but they can't shoot back.  There are a few larger planes like the Stuka or the B-17 that can fire out of other arcs.  They are all slow, wallowing things.  

The older, Fantasy Flight sets don't require you to buy models.  They come with cards to represent the planes.  I haven't seen the new Ares starter sets.  I don't know if I like the new starter set so much.  It comes with four planes from different countries while the old one had a Battle of Britain theme with Me-109s and Spitfires.

[Crüesader]

Not seeing a clear answer or much on these little warplanes- do they come painted already?

[yosemitemike]

Not seeing a clear answer or much on these little warplanes- do they come painted already?

Yes, they are prepainted.

[Crüesader]

Yes, they are prepainted.

Ah.  So there's no options for unpainted ones.  

Well, I can see the play factor being higher than the modeling factor.

[yosemitemike]

Ah.  So there's no options for unpainted ones.  

Well, I can see the play factor being higher than the modeling factor.

It's a quick play game.  It's not really made for modellers.

[Crüesader]

It's a quick play game.  It's not really made for modellers.

Yeah, but I can see how a smaller-scale vehicular model game could be fun.  Especially if you were making your own weapon loadouts on aircraft and the like.  When I was young, we had these little tanks, jets, and other stuff that were all smaller than Hot Wheels- 'Mega Force'.  They had these obscenely awesome looks and stuff.  I'd honestly like to see that re-released with a game system.  

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These were my favorite.  I think they were the bad guys, though.  We used to bring them to school and have wars at our desk when the weather was too bad to have outdoor recess.  We would get our notebooks out and draw rivers and bridges and stuff like that.

[yosemitemike]

It uses a 1/200th scale which isn't very modeller friendly.  The planes are really small.  I have seen games that use a 1/72nd that are a lot more modeller friendly but they are much more involved affairs that take a lot of floor space to play.