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Other Games, Development, & Campaigns => Other Games => Topic started by: Age of Fable on January 14, 2009, 05:33:19 AM

Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Age of Fable on January 14, 2009, 05:33:19 AM
I'm toying with doing a version of 'Sorcerer's Cave' this year.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Danger on January 14, 2009, 07:21:05 AM
Circus Imperium from FASA.  

Along with Space Hulk.

And throw in old school Car Wars for good measure.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Joey2k on January 14, 2009, 08:30:26 AM
Quote from: Age of Fable;278410
I'm toying with doing a version of 'Sorcerer's Cave' this year.


I'd love to see that.  Might want to spruce up the graphics a little, that red-orange background doesn't do it for me.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: DeadUematsu on January 14, 2009, 02:16:07 PM
Warhammer Quest.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Nobilis on January 14, 2009, 02:25:43 PM
Fortress America
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: CavScout on January 14, 2009, 03:03:05 PM
Quote from: Nobilis;278501
Fortress America


Seconded.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: KenHR on January 14, 2009, 03:10:26 PM
Avalon Hill's Magic Realm, with all the stuff Richard Hamblen couldn't include due to budget overruns.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Spinachcat on March 17, 2009, 05:59:35 PM
How would you retro-clone a boardgame?   I can understand the rules cloning, but what about the pieces and the board itself?   Will the idea be to print out the PDF and just construct your own?

I would love to see a new version of HeroQuest, Warhammer Quest, Space Crusade and Space Hulk.   I like Descent but its too slow.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: KrakaJak on March 17, 2009, 06:02:33 PM
Awful Green Things From Outer Space! Actually, I'd just like to find a used copy of the game in decent condition :D
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: The Shaman on March 17, 2009, 06:50:53 PM
Quote from: KrakaJak;290517
Awful Green Things From Outer Space! Actually, I'd just like to find a used copy of the game in decent condition :D
I lurved that game.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: KrakaJak on March 17, 2009, 06:59:43 PM
Tom Wham! being mentioned in the GaryCon thread is what has inspired me to find a copy of that frikkin' game. I wanted to play it but I've somehow lost it in between moves lately:(
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Age of Fable on March 17, 2009, 08:35:20 PM
Quote from: Spinachcat;290516
How would you retro-clone a boardgame?   I can understand the rules cloning, but what about the pieces and the board itself?   Will the idea be to print out the PDF and just construct your own?


Yes, it would.

You'd have to make a board and pieces that did what the originals did, but without infringing on copyrights. However HeroQuest's characters are very 'generic fantasy', and the board is pretty simple, so this would be easy enough.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: peteramthor on March 17, 2009, 08:41:34 PM
Quote from: Danger;278419
Circus Imperium from FASA.  


I will second that one.  Played it at a con a few times.  Then when I went looking it was sold out.  Then years later when I remembered it (lots of beer at that con) I went looking.  By that time out of print and impossible to find.

There was another I played long ago but forgot the name of.  You controlled ants in an anthill and fought other ants for control of resources.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Xanther on March 20, 2009, 10:55:09 PM
Quote from: peteramthor;290580
...
There was another I played long ago but forgot the name of.  You controlled ants in an anthill and fought other ants for control of resources.


Could you be thinking of Chitin? An old Metagaming microgame.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: peteramthor on March 21, 2009, 11:21:06 AM
Quote from: Xanther;291501
Could you be thinking of Chitin? An old Metagaming microgame.



The name isn't ringing a bell.  But then again most of the con games I played eventually became a blur from the drinking that came later in the night.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Age of Fable on March 21, 2009, 11:33:38 AM
the box for Chitin looks like one of these:

(http://images.boardgamegeek.com/images/pic27350_md.jpg)
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Callous on March 24, 2009, 11:26:39 PM
Quote from: KenHR;278508
Avalon Hill's Magic Realm, with all the stuff Richard Hamblen couldn't include due to budget overruns.


Yes!  And I'm hiding my 2nd ed. copy from you vultures...  :)
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: KenHR on March 25, 2009, 10:50:17 AM
Quote from: Callous;292419
Yes!  And I'm hiding my 2nd ed. copy from you vultures...  :)


I have two... :)

There is a nice fan-created print-it-yourself kit on boardgamegeek, along with a completely revised third edition ruleset (blessed by Hamblen himself...who, btw, is a massively underrated game designer, IMO).
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Age of Fable on March 25, 2009, 12:09:52 PM
Question for Magic Realm fans:

Really honestly, does it need to be so complicated, or is that bad design?
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: KenHR on March 25, 2009, 12:57:14 PM
MR does have some clunky bits, but the complication is, to an extent, necessary.

The game is designed to be what amounts to a GM-less RPG.  It allows you to choose one of 16 very unique characters and determine your own goals (money, fame, notoriety, etc.).  Some characters function best as lone wolves or antagonists toward other players.  Others work best in party or partner situations.  There is tremendous scope for inter-player negotiation and backstabbing.

The game presents a small, but complete world, with factions that are allied or at war with one another.  Characters also have relations with these groups.  You can become embroiled in inter-group conflicts, ranging from raids or quests to outright warfare.  Relationships also affect your bargaining power when buying and selling items.

You can also take on jobs from various nobles or individuals.  Treasure hoards, of course, are there for looting.  There is so much included in the game that you cannot explore it all in a single playthrough, allowing for a unique experience every time you do play.

Combat is weird (and very deterministic if you don't use the optional rules), but very fast and reflective of fights in fantasy literature.  An elegant system of action chits allow you to track wounds, fatigue, etc.  Weapons and armor all feel different.

Magic is very colorful and powerful.  I get more atmosphere from this game than from many FRPGs.

I dunno, that's just a stream-of-consciousness rundown of part of what makes the game so magical to me.  The learning curve is admittedly horrendous, but when you learn the game, there is absolutely nothing else like it anywhere.  I can't stand most fantasy board games because they're so limited and simplistic in comparison to Magic Realm (IMO, of course).
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Age of Fable on March 25, 2009, 01:54:02 PM
OK...so, which bits couldn't you have with a simpler game?
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: KenHR on March 25, 2009, 03:51:09 PM
I'm sure someone could streamline the entire game and come up with something similar (and it's not outside the realm of possibility to make it a better game).  But I think if you try to make a game with Magic Realm's scope (again, it's basically a GM-less RPG; you've got latitude to do _almost_ anything you want), you're going to end up with a fairly complicated game.  Especially if you want to cater to the wide range of playing styles allowed by each character.

I guess, without knowing how well you know the game and what specifically you're aiming at...I don't know how to answer that question.

I almost forgot to mention that RealmSpeak (http://magicrealm.dewkid.com/rspeak/realmspeak.htm) is a freeware MR simulator.  Try a few multiplayer games and see what it's like...
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Spinachcat on March 25, 2009, 04:26:58 PM
Quote from: peteramthor;290580
I will second that one.  Played it at a con a few times.  Then when I went looking it was sold out.  Then years later when I remembered it (lots of beer at that con) I went looking.  By that time out of print and impossible to find.


Circus Imperium shows up on eBay pretty regularly.   I got a few copies for $20 w/shipping as gifts for friends back in 2007.   Great game!

Quote from: peteramthor;290580
There was another I played long ago but forgot the name of.  You controlled ants in an anthill and fought other ants for control of resources.


Could it be Insecta?
http://www.fatmessiahgames.com/fmg/insecta/index.html
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: peteramthor on March 25, 2009, 09:08:53 PM
Quote from: Spinachcat;292533
Could it be Insecta?
http://www.fatmessiahgames.com/fmg/insecta/index.html


Actually I think that may be it.  The name sounds quite familiar although I think we were using predesigned bugs, probably set up already for the demo.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Age of Fable on March 26, 2009, 05:12:23 AM
I've got the computer version of Sorcerer's Cave, which is a similar theme but at the opposite end of complexity.

I was thinking of doing a clone of it later this year. But then I kept thinking of extra stuff (backgrounds for the characters, alignments, what if I added some of the more interesting locations from Talisman, and so on). I like Magic Realm's idea of 'clues' as to what's going to be there - like smoke that might turn out to be a campfire or a dragon. Also the relationships with factions. I also like the exhausting of chits to do extra things (probably would be done by tapping cards if it was remade these days), but it's I'd make it something more like 'Fate Points', where you sacrifice them to get re-rolls.

So that's where the idea came from.

I will try RealmSpeak, thanks for that.

Quote from: KenHR;292526
I'm sure someone could streamline the entire game and come up with something similar (and it's not outside the realm of possibility to make it a better game).  But I think if you try to make a game with Magic Realm's scope (again, it's basically a GM-less RPG; you've got latitude to do _almost_ anything you want), you're going to end up with a fairly complicated game.  Especially if you want to cater to the wide range of playing styles allowed by each character.

I guess, without knowing how well you know the game and what specifically you're aiming at...I don't know how to answer that question.

I almost forgot to mention that RealmSpeak (http://magicrealm.dewkid.com/rspeak/realmspeak.htm) is a freeware MR simulator.  Try a few multiplayer games and see what it's like...
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: KenHR on March 26, 2009, 08:28:47 AM
Quote from: Age of Fable;292615
I've got the computer version of Sorcerer's Cave, which is a similar theme but at the opposite end of complexity.

I was thinking of doing a clone of it later this year. But then I kept thinking of extra stuff (backgrounds for the characters, alignments, what if I added some of the more interesting locations from Talisman, and so on). I like Magic Realm's idea of 'clues' as to what's going to be there - like smoke that might turn out to be a campfire or a dragon. Also the relationships with factions. I also like the exhausting of chits to do extra things (probably would be done by tapping cards if it was remade these days), but it's I'd make it something more like 'Fate Points', where you sacrifice them to get re-rolls.

So that's where the idea came from.

I will try RealmSpeak, thanks for that.


Ah, cool!  

I firmly believe there's a way to do a Magic Realm-esque game with less complexity and smoother mechanics.  MR tried a lot of things that hadn't been tried before, so it does have its warts.

I'd have to comb through the rules (I was playing regularly for a while, but haven't picked up the game in over a year), but I think identifying where MR could be a bit leaner would make an interesting exercise...thinking it over quickly right now, I'd say the hidden orders/simultaneous move system makes for some complexity, but getting rid of that eliminates a major part of the game (and futzes with strategies, items, spells, etc. that are based on that).  But another game could use another approach to get those things back.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Hairfoot on May 15, 2009, 11:10:43 PM
I'm voting for Car Wars, but simple, fun and consistent this time.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: finarvyn on August 10, 2009, 04:15:38 PM
My all-time favorite game has to be Kingmaker by Avalon Hill, but I'd be pretty happy with a new copy of Fortress America as well. :)
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: tashkal on August 11, 2009, 07:03:04 PM
I can third, fourth, whatever Fortress America.

But what I'd really love to see? Dungeon. Never got to play that as a kid, and I wish I had. Might be crap, I'll grant you, but I'd love to know first hand. :)
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: finarvyn on August 11, 2009, 09:23:15 PM
Quote from: tashkal;320023
But what I'd really love to see? Dungeon. Never got to play that as a kid, and I wish I had. Might be crap, I'll grant you, but I'd love to know first hand. :)
I've got a copy of Dungeon. It's not crap, but it's not as good as you might imagine, either. It's a very simplistic game where you wander around, kill monsters, and take their stuff. (Heck, sounds like an early version of Munchkin! ;))

Each class of character has a few minor differences from each other class. Each monster has minimal information. Treasures are very basic. It's not a bad game for kids, but if you've played other games it tends to seem kind of lame.

At least, that's my take on it.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: kregmosier on August 11, 2009, 09:51:26 PM
ok, seriously, we need Fortress America already.

also, all the Wham stuff...all of it. (i seem to remember steve jackson reprinting a bunch of these?)

a new Car Wars (more like the old car wars, please), Divine Right, and Knights of Camelot.  i never got to play it, but i'm also wondering if TSR's Lankhamar game was any good?

good topic.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: tashkal on August 12, 2009, 06:30:16 PM
Quote from: finarvyn;320052
I've got a copy of Dungeon. It's not crap, but it's not as good as you might imagine, either. It's a very simplistic game where you wander around, kill monsters, and take their stuff. (Heck, sounds like an early version of Munchkin! ;))


Ah, okay. Guess I'll stick with Talisman, then. :D

And to go back to the topic, I just remembered one I keep thinking of buying off eBay except that shipping from England (the only place this seems to turn up!) would cost more than the game: Escape From Colditz!
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: JCrichton on August 13, 2009, 04:44:09 AM
Quote from: Danger;278419
Along with Space Hulk.

And throw in old school Car Wars for good measure.
Quote from: DeadUematsu;278495
Warhammer Quest.
All 3, please.  I have a nice set of WQ but I'd love to get my hands on the rest of the characters and expansions.  Newer versions would be fine.  :)

Hmm, come to think of it I want these reprinted.  I don't wanna make the pieces and boards myself.  :(
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Age of Fable on August 13, 2009, 05:04:56 AM
Quote from: JCrichton;320319
Hmm, come to think of it I want these reprinted.  I don't wanna make the pieces and boards myself.  :(


That was the idea. I was looking for games to do paid clones of, not free print-and-play versions.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Danger on August 13, 2009, 08:02:03 AM
Oh, how could I forget Survive! (which also was published under the name Atlantis if Boardgamegeek is to be believed)?

Fun game, fun premise, and its a hoot to see how nasty people get with each other as the clock ticks down.
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: JCrichton on August 14, 2009, 03:23:22 AM
Quote from: Age of Fable;320321
That was the idea. I was looking for games to do paid clones of, not free print-and-play versions.
Well rock on, then.  :D

I'm a boardgame super whore so OOP stuff that was always hard to get coming back would sell me instantly.  Speaking of which, I still need to get the newest release of Cosmic Encounter...
Title: what board games would you like to see retro-cloned?
Post by: Tommy Brownell on August 14, 2009, 09:15:59 AM
HeroQuest, totally...that WAS the game I used as an into to RPGs, and my son is getting old enough now...