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Was it the non-stop rotation of new releases and the expense of keeping up?

Did you enjoy the game itself?

I ask because I used to play until everyone I knew stopped because of the expense. Then a few years ago a friend died and left me his cards. Mostly they were trash (not worth money) but I wanted to use them to game in memory of the good times we had.

I started putting together decks following the "Peasant" format (all common cards except for 5 uncommon) and made enough so that I could loan my opponent their choice. This worked pretty well. I was able to get a few old friends to play and we had fun for quite some time. We considered "Pauper" which is nothing but commons but that ends up with a small handful of decks that just outright beat everything else. It was felt that a small number of decks gets stale too fast.

Unfortunately, life stepped in and the family with the bulk of the players moved to another state. That led me to trying to play at game stores.

Wizards of the Coast has done a good job of brainwashing players into thinking that "Standard" (only the latest cards) is the only version of the game to play. When playing the official "Standard" games at the stores there are prizes. The attitude that I get from a majority of players at the stores is that if there is no prizes (and winning points), it's not worth playing. Kind of like people's opinion of games with no leveling mechanic.

Within about the last year a new format has been introduced and supported (prizes given for official game winning) called "Modern". This is a format using a larger range of cards (cards since the 8th release on later).
This has gotten a few more people to not burn-out chasing the latest cards but since there are only a few deck builds that "win", the price of cards has spiked. So now instead of paying a lot to buy the new cards, you pay a lot to buy specific old cards. Great for Wizards and re-sellers.

The players that liked Magic but didn't want to chase "money cards" created their own format called "Elder Dragon Highlander". This is where you use a single card of anything but basic lands and 100 cards total. You can use every card ever printed, except for a few that would drain the fun from the game. This is great for people to use cards they collected over the years.
Wizards of the Coast has tried to co-op this player created format by giving it the name "Commander".

Another format that players created is called "Cube". This is a format where one person brings a group of 360+ cards pre-selected to work together and the players build decks to duel with from these cards.
Again a way to play that keeps the games fresh, uses the cards you already may have, and doesn't continue to drain vasts amounts of money.

So, to pick up from the title, have people that have quit yet liked the game, tried other forms of play? Has anyone returned to playing? If so, why?
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I used to play semi-seriously, went to Nationals a bunch of times, played in a Pro Tour, won money at a couple of Grand Prix and stuff like that. I quit playing sometime in 2004/5, partly because of changing priorities, partly because other people in my team were also starting to lose interest, and partly just because the nature of the game was changing (I used to like blue control sort of decks, but creature decks started becoming way more important). I never found the money to be an issue because I could trade for the things I wanted or just sell on the booster packs I was winning.

Myself and some of the old gang have played the odd pre-release since then but that's about it. Cube sounds like fun but I haven't tried it yet. Legacy is cool though, I've been playing some proxy legacy games with one of my old teammates recently but the price to get dual lands again is pretty off-putting, plus there aren't really any local legacy tournaments as far as I can see.

I used to play seriously, was even state champion...but the bottom line is it's just a game, and shelling out that kind of money for a game when there a jillion others to play eventually got to me.

That, and I just didn't have space for so many thousands of cards, another "just a game" issue.

I started playing in '96-'97 and stopped sometime in 2003ish.

I was really enamored with the idea of a fun quick casual game that you could break out and play whenever.

Of course after a while fun was sacrificed at the alter of serious business.

As is a common tale in geekdom.

1995-2004. Great game. Too time and money intensive.

My friends and I played Magic:tG back in the 90's when it was still hot. I forget when I quit, it was after Ice Age, soon after 5th edition came out I think. There were several reasons why we quit. Simple burnout was part of it. And yes, the expense issue, paying lots of money for just a few useful cards was annoying. Trying to remember all the new rules and what each card did was becoming overwhelming.

I went to a local convention and played in a small tourney. I can't prove it but I suspect the guy I played against was cheating somehow. Maybe he knew how to shuffle that controlled which cards came out on top despite any cut. I don't know, but the whole experience left a bad taste in my mouth.

For me, the big flaw in the game is the rarity of the cards (although I know this was WoTC's big money clincher.) Let's face it, the rare cards make fancy decks winners, particularly tournament worthy decks. The best cards are rare ones and the more one has the higher chance of winning. I know many deny this, I've heard the denials many times. But the truth is there. The game then becomes a money race: those willing to shell out the most money to buy packs or individual cards have the advantage. Not unlike a rich sports franchise. Sure, skill and experience are important too but acquiring the rare 5 Star cards is vital. (Not unlike WoW: the guy decked out head to toe in Epics will have the decisive advantage over the same level opponent in greens.) Making all the cards equal in distribution would have gone a long way in solving this problem. At a certain point I just refused to partake in the rat race.

I also didn't like what the game did to the gamer community. Maybe it's just my perception but before M:tG came out gamers seemed more honest. At a convention I could leave my books at a table, go to the bathroom and return pretty secure that nothing had been touched. (One time at Gen Con a guy at a table I was at left his AD&D Players Hand Book behind after the game had ended. I picked it up and went through the convention hall looking for him. Took 15 minutes but I found him and handed it back.) After M:tG came out I heard plenty of stories of cards being stolen, sometimes box loads of them. Suspicion and anger increased. I saw guys become surly if anyone came within a yard of their precious, plastic wrapped cards. I didn't like it. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe it was always that way and I was naive and never noticed.

I haven't played in years but still keep two large crates in my closet with all my cards in them. Who knows if or when I'll ever play again. Sometimes when I'm in Barnes & Nobel or a department store I'll see new sets of M:tG cards being sold and I'll feel a familiar itch. But no, I never do buy them.

An excellent game that breathed new life into a hobby I love. It will always have a place in my heart.

I think me and my group of friends and M:TG just grew apart. We started playing when we were in our mid-teens and some years later, we would rather spend our time and money on beer and parties than cards. RPGs were just the cheaper, and to us, more fulfilling game experience. Mind you, that the last couple of expansions we went through was Fallen Empires and Homelands didn't make leaving the game behind harder.

There are still a bunch of boxes filled with cards in closet at my parents house. There best one I picked out a couple of years and sold for the price of a pair of (semi)expensive sunglasses. We weren't hardcore collectors or players.

On one hand, I think it's a brilliantly designed game and I appreciate that it still brings so many people into the folds of tabletop gaming.  On the other hand, it's all my long-time nerd friends play anymore, and I don't, so, mreh.

Honestly, other than the occasional board-game or my co-worker's fortnightly (first time I've ever used that word...) Pathfinder game, most of my gaming is bite-size video-game sessions after work to unwind.  Usually casual League of Legends (ARAM) or "competitive" Counter-Strike with some old high-school buddies.  It's just become harder to justify the time and money commitment to keep up with Magic.  

Granted, having multiple chronic health issues that sap your constitution and energy don't help, either, when you're investing most of the remaining fuel in work-related pursuits.  It becomes even more important to pick-and-choose where to invest your leisure time (socializing, chores, studies, exercise, etc.).

Quote from: DKChannelBoredom;750098I think me and my group of friends and M:TG just grew apart. We started playing when we were in our mid-teens and some years later, we would rather spend our time and money on beer and parties than cards. RPGs were just the cheaper, and to us, more fulfilling game experience. Mind you, that the last couple of expansions we went through was Fallen Empires and Homelands didn't make leaving the game behind harder.

My friends took the opposite path.  They've shifted away from "playing pretend" type games and more towards abstract things like Euro-games and MtG.  Which I can understand, since they have clearer goals and things like "winners," but I just don't get much out of moving chits around to solve abstract problems -- I get enough of that discrete problem-solving stuff out of work and studies.  And video-games, I guess, especially now that there are so many weird abstract indie type games.

Quote from: Doughdee222;750097I also didn't like what the game did to the gamer community. Maybe it's just my perception but before M:tG came out gamers seemed more honest. At a convention I could leave my books at a table, go to the bathroom and return pretty secure that nothing had been touched. (One time at Gen Con a guy at a table I was at left his AD&D Players Hand Book behind after the game had ended. I picked it up and went through the convention hall looking for him. Took 15 minutes but I found him and handed it back.) After M:tG came out I heard plenty of stories of cards being stolen, sometimes box loads of them. Suspicion and anger increased. I saw guys become surly if anyone came within a yard of their precious, plastic wrapped cards. I didn't like it. Maybe I'm wrong, maybe it was always that way and I was naive and never noticed.

I imagine this more a reflection of how parenting changed over this same time period.  Those of us who hit adulthood in the 90s were the last generation whose parents trusted them.  E.g. able to travel places alone, set your own schedule, etc.  I think the kids not trusting each other is a result of their never being trusted themselves. So as this mentality makes its way into the hobby, everything just gets tainted by it.

Generation has nothing to do with it.  Teenagers and kids have always engaged in petty theft.  MtG just gives you something that's easy to steal, and it just happens to be something kids like.

I was playing Magic around 1994. It was okay. I like the game, the idea of building decks and the variety of game play that comes out of that. I'm just not into the collecting and the hunting of particular cards and all that jazz - it's something I did for a while at that time, but wouldn't do again today. I don't like the way hardcores play either. It's something I'd play like any card game, sitting, playing a bit, and then moving on. The investment in time, energy and money to get a decent deck running is just too much for me.

I like the idea of having a basic deck, a bunch of boosters, and then building something remotely functional to play on the go, but that's something you'd have to rebuy over and over to keep fresh with your buds, so ... no. Not realistically sustaining.

Quote from: Greentongue;750061The players that liked Magic but didn't want to chase "money cards" created their own format called "Elder Dragon Highlander". This is where you use a single card of anything but basic lands and 100 cards total. You can use every card ever printed, except for a few that would drain the fun from the game. This is great for people to use cards they collected over the years.
Wizards of the Coast has tried to co-op this player created format by giving it the name "Commander".

This is the only format I play now, and only in multiplayer. Great crazy fun, lots of interactions, lots of decision points and tough calls that feel really rewarding when you win.

Quote from: Benoist;750112I like the idea of having a basic deck, a bunch of boosters, and then building something remotely functional to play on the go, but that's something you'd have to rebuy over and over to keep fresh with your buds, so ... no. Not realistically sustaining.

This is where "Cube" fits. One person collects a bunch of cards and everyone else pulls from that collection to build 40 cards decks "on the go".

A cheap but fun way to start a Cube is by using only commons.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/the-cube-forum/cube-lists
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Quote from: Doughdee222;750097I haven't played in years but still keep two large crates in my closet with all my cards in them. Who knows if or when I'll ever play again. Sometimes when I'm in Barnes & Nobel or a department store I'll see new sets of M:tG cards being sold and I'll feel a familiar itch. But no, I never do buy them.

An excellent game that breathed new life into a hobby I love. It will always have a place in my heart.

The cards my friend had left were the ones that were not stolen while he was at a convention. He was a smoker (which killed him) and trusting someone else to watch the cards while he took a smoke break didn't end well.

I've found that game stores have "regulars" and they are pretty trust worthy. Conventions and Tournaments have a lot of people that feed off of strangers. That is also true outside of just MtG players.

I've been happy that I got back into playing and have set a $10 per week budget. It goes far if you are not playing "Standard" and is no worse than other forms of entertainment.
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it came a bit later to the UK we played from Dark through to Weatherlight- ish.
My mates all grouped in to buy a full set of legends which cost them a pretty penny then we kind of all owned a colour and built to that pattern.

We played Jyhad as well and that was probably a btter game for us due to multi player.

We hit a couple of tournaments but all that did was turn us off tournaments because to us at least you got the worst of nerdom, the guys that lacked the social skills to get into a D&D game (that is a pretty low bar). It probably didn't help that we played for fun so our decks weren't very serious and we were really just interested in seeing cool cards, drinking beer and getting away from our wives and gilrfriends for a day. So Decks like "Things you find in a Field", "No Manna Deck", "There must be a way to make these genies work" probably lacked the focus that other players might expect which was fine except these fuckers took themselves pretty seriously :D

Now don't get me wrong we were not novices and we played the fuck out of Magic. To the point where on long car journeys we could play virtual magic (MtG, no cards in hand, any card can only be played once and you can "draw" any card you like from your "deck", all cards are imaginary but have to be published cards of course) where we all knew by memory the existing 2000 or so cards. However, we just didn't take it very seriously.

Now a few years back I noticed that Magic had churned out dozens of new sets. We were in a tricky state game wise and we couldn't get regular gaming due to Real life so I started buying a box of boosters then running sealled deck games with one of the guys when they could make it. so did that for a bout 2 years until I moved out to Singapore.

If I play again and no doubt I will, I will play EDH (I even picked up some of the Commander decks on my last US trip) or CUBE.

Never understood card games. Well, "Shithead (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shithead_(card_game))" I get. Munchkin I get. M:TG, Pokemon, Yugioh, Fantasy Flight's LCGs (Cthulhu etc) I cannot get into. I just blank.

What is it about these games that is attractive? I have never ever played M:TG and this is a very serious question.

I mean, earlier in the thread someone said "fun, casual, pick-up game" or similar. Unpack that for me, because from the outside it seems like a min/maxers wet dream crossed with a game company selling Cardboard-Crack. Not something I feel I have missing from my life.

Quote from: BarefootGaijin;750200Never understood card games. Well, "Shithead (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shithead_(card_game))" I get. Munchkin I get. M:TG, Pokemon, Yugioh, Fantasy Flight's LCGs (Cthulhu etc) I cannot get into. I just blank.

What is it about these games that is attractive? I have never ever played M:TG and this is a very serious question.

I mean, earlier in the thread someone said "fun, casual, pick-up game" or similar. Unpack that for me, because from the outside it seems like a min/maxers wet dream crossed with a game company selling Cardboard-Crack. Not something I feel I have missing from my life.

I won't get into all the details of the game, I presume you know the basic structure of it (You play a wizard who taps into various lands for colored mana then uses that mana to summon creatures and cast spells, all in an effort to kill your opponent(s).) Because cards are used and there are lots of them of different types the players can set up any sort of structure for a game. For example: "This game we'll play with single color decks (there are five colors)." or "No creature summoning." or "We'll have 50 hit points (instead of the usual 20.) Etc. etc.

Because the structure can be played around with the game can be both "a min/maxers wet dream" or a casual pick-up game. We could play 5 rounds of "Make the best deck you can!" then switch to something silly like "An all Goblin deck!" We could spend a half hour digging through our piles of cards and making a new deck or we might have one set aside we made the other day for immediate play.

It's the near endless variety of cards that can make the game so addicting, and when you don't have something you will want it and so invest more cash into it. ("Wow, that's a cool card, I'll have to go to the store and pick a couple up." or "I read about this killer deck in a magazine, I'll have to invest $300 to get all the cards I don't have to make it.") One deck might be a White and Red all spell deck. The next you make might be Green and Black mostly creature deck. One deck you might count on killing your opponent with damaging spells, the next you win by removing cards from his deck until he has zero left and loses by default.

A "fun, casual pick up game" could mean anything from a silly "I'll kill you with nothing but sharks!" to something more serious "This deck does A, B and C, in that order." You could meet your buddy, pull out a premade deck and start playing immediately with a quick time limit. Or you could take hours researching and building some gonzo deck. Some people take it seriously and memorize all the cards and invest thousands of bucks into it and go to tournaments, others... don't.

Hope this helps.

I should also add that much of what makes M:tG addicting is the strategy and options one must weigh with each turn. Do you make an all-out attack or hold somethings in reserve for defense.

I'll illustrate with an example: Let's say it's mid game, you have 6 lands on the table so you have access to 6 mana points. You have three creatures on the table defending you and four cards in your hand. Two of those cards are creatures, one is small and requires only 2 mana to summon, the other is larger and requires 6. You could tap all your lands and summon the large creature, that sure would be nice to have available, but then you'd have nothing left over for bonus attack or defense (until next turn.) Or you could summon the smaller creature and have 4 left over. Or you could summon nothing and keep all 6 for other uses. One card in your hand will heal 3 points of damage, but costs 3 to use. You could heal yourself for 3 points or hold it until a critter is damaged/killed and use it to save its life. The last card you have in your hand stops your opponent's spell from being thrown, destroys it utterly. What to do? Where should you spend your mana points?

You also have the three creatures already out and ready to go. Do you attack with all three or hold one back in defense? Depends on what your opponent has available for defense. Does he have any mana left in reserve? He has only 2 cards in his hand, possibly nothing useful at the moment. Decisions, decisions...

And that's every turn you make those kinds of judgements. The strategies and permutations are endless. What color(s) are you playing? What is he using? Some colors are strong on defense, others strong on attack. Some have better creatures, others better attack spells. It helps to learn all this stuff and formulate strategy on that knowledge. Creatures can be all sorts of sizes and have special bonuses. One might have 3 attack and 6 defense while another is 4 attack and 4 defense. One might be able to throw a point of damage at anything you choose. Another could have a fire breath that can be pumped up by expending extra mana ("He 3/3 but I'll tap 4 mana and make him 7/3.") All that has to be taken into consideration too.

You can see how it goes.

Both non-stop rotation and expense of keeping up.

I quit MtG and L5R because of that. Most of the rest of the CCGs just died on their own. The only one I still collect and play is Vampire, because it is a very well made game -- and the only one that completely upends the CCG paradigm (no set rotation, strongest cards are commons, no card limits, cards replenish instead of fussing about card draw, multiplayer, etc.). But even Vampire has returned to torpor, so we'll see if it can return from the grave a second time.

Outside of that I'd totally get into an LCG like Netrunner. But I have other priority buys before then, as I know that'd be at least a cool $200+ to get a set of what I want. However being fixed distribution really cuts down on rarity power creating a Pay-to-Win environment.

Quote from: Doughdee222;750209I won't get into all the details of the game, I presume you know the basic structure of it (You play a wizard who taps into various lands for colored mana then uses that mana to summon creatures and cast spells, all in an effort to kill your opponent(s).)

News to me! Shows how much I haven't been paying attention. But thank you for clearing up a few things.

Quote from: Opaopajr;750218Outside of that I'd totally get into an LCG like Netrunner. But I have other priority buys before then, as I know that'd be at least a cool $200+ to get a set of what I want. However being fixed distribution really cuts down on rarity power creating a Pay-to-Win environment.

That was part of why I tried the Cthulhu LCG. No real need to pay-to-win. Problem for me was I played it and found it incredibly boring and I eventually sold it on. YMMV etc etc.

I played Magic from Legends all the way up to Ice Age and then I got bored with it , with Ice Age the cards weren't really doing anything new and there were other card games coming out. I sold most of my Magic cards for £20 about 10 years ago. I wasted far too much money on card games , I don't play any of them now and I wish I had spent the money on RPGs or even books. I think Marvel Overpower was my favourite and perhaps the best CCG I played but the later expansions were hard to find.

Quote from: BarefootGaijin;750200What is it about these games that is attractive? I have never ever played M:TG and this is a very serious question.

For me:
I like to play games with people. You can pick cards that are easy or hard.
I like to collect things. There are thousands of unique cards.
I like to make things. Thousands of unique cards makes deck building practically limitless.

MtG scratches all those itches. I can spend way too much time just building and altering a deck as new ideas are sparked. There are so many cards now that it is easy to find new ones I don't have to keep the cards fresh. All I need is one random person that is interested in playing and I have a game.

As was mentioned, with your own player group you can have an extreme range of games that can be played with the cards. This is only limited by imagination and willingness to try something different.
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I stopped playing M:tG when the first expansion came out, and I saw what a neverending money treadmill it would become.  Gave all my cards away - don't even want to think about what they'd be worth today.

I consider playing on a "limited" basis every now and then but... I just don't see that "limited" basis holding, and I too easily see myself getting sucked back in.

I confess I never played or never wanted to play.

As soon as I heard about the "collectible" aspect, my instant reaction is "The more money I spend the better my odds of getting "good" cards to help me win?  Oh holy FUCK no."

The very idea repulsed me instantly.

Quote from: Old Geezer;750515I confess I never played or never wanted to play.

As soon as I heard about the "collectible" aspect, my instant reaction is "The more money I spend the better my odds of getting "good" cards to help me win?  Oh holy FUCK no."

The very idea repulsed me instantly.

To be fair, I've seen some pretty nasty decks based on nothing but Common cards.

But, yeah.

The combine it with expansions meaning that those cards you've collected?  Yeah, you need more now.

Quote from: robiswrong;750506I consider playing on a "limited" basis every now and then but... I just don't see that "limited" basis holding, and I too easily see myself getting sucked back in.

If you can set limits, it is a great game still. I hold myself to a $10 a week budget which is affordable to me. So far I've done that for over two years with only a couple of splurges.

Yes, you can make fun decks with just the cheap cards and if the people you play with have the same "level playing field", Life is Good.
Getting that buy in from a group is not easy, much like finding a consistent RPG group. Once the "arms race" starts, things turn sour fast.
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I enjoyed playing magic for a couple of years when it was fairly new.

I stopped playing because I could not afford to spend any money on it, and realized I would spend money I did not have.

So I gave all my cards to a friend and went cold turkey.

Game is fun as hell though.

M:tG is very popular at the game store where I play. One of the players in my group's Pathfinder game is also something of a Magic fan, and sometimes gets distracted by the Magic players (but he's a bit of a yahoo, just like I am - we both admit it).

I never got into Magic; I could have as a middle schooler back in 1992-93 but I (1) was more non-social than I am now and (2.) had heard something about having to give the winner your cards. Which is untrue, but at the time my afraid-of-socializing 12 year old self believed it. (Plus my mom wouldn't have sprung for spending the money.)

Quote from: Peregrin;750108Generation has nothing to do with it.  Teenagers and kids have always engaged in petty theft.  MtG just gives you something that's easy to steal, and it just happens to be something kids like.

At the store we occasionally have problems with theft. But back when it was a larger hub for the game there was as much of a problem of cheating - it was one of the groups who brought in a lot of the other groups, and had a "we're better than everyone" attitude.

Last I heard they were all sitting at one of their homes doing their own game, but this was after the owner and his judge had some sort of blow-up.

I remember buying MtG many years ago when it first came out.
I was in the Virgin Store checking out the RPG section (when they used to stock RPGs) and when I went to the front desk to pay, I noticed a little stack of cards and 1st edition MtG by Garfield games.

It spread pretty quickly amongst my social circles (other people I knew also discovered it at the same time) and I had a great time with it.
After a couple of years I got bored with it and I moved to another country anyway and I gave them all away (I guess I collected a few hundred cards by then.

I thoroughly enjoyed the game for the couple of years I played it. It got boring after a while though and it was sucking up RPG gaming time, to the point where some of the various RPG groups I played and ran games for played MtG in preference to RPGs.

I believe some friends from those years are still playing MtG today. Which is fine, there must be something to it to keep someone at it for that many years.

Anyway, my favourite deck build was blue and White for all the defensive stuff white had and the quirky effects Blue had.

A few year ago I visited those friends from years back and they had literally 1000s of cards in boxes and one of them gave me a few hundred cards to build decks with that I played with my kids for a while.
They were very old cards and I bet some of them were my original cards I gave away many years ago.
Playing MtG with my kids was fun and they enjoyed it too, but other things drew  us away from it after a while.
 I still have those old cards in a box somewhere and I might drag them out again and give it a go one day.

My girlfriend tried it a few times with cards some friends of hers gave us.
She liked the pictures but wanted more 'story' out of it.
Neither of us liked the 'collectible' aspect (manufactured scarcity) and lost interest quickly.

I played a little bit of it when it first came out, but saw how the game got turned into a greed machine. Stores cracking open starter sets to steal the rares out, then closing them up again. Laughing when people bought the entirely common starter.

I've jumped in and out several times, but each time I run up against mechanics that just destroy the game. Annihilator was the worst I think i've seen. Last year I dropped my cards off at the shop, got some trade for it and grabbed an RPG or three with the money.

There are way better CCGs. Vampire: The Eternal Struggle, for example. Middle Earth: The Wizards was a lot of fun. Ani-Mayhem as well!

 I do enjoy the idea of a card game like MTG, I just wish they would release a "non-collectible" version (a fixed set).

started playing near the end of "the dark" and revised edition, quit midway through the urza series (trilogy of releases?).  had only played with my gaming group at the time, and one of the guys would buy singles to create fast killer decks.  became no fun as we weren't going to spend the $$$ to try & keep up.  

ended up trading my collection in at my local comic store for store credit.  

was fun splitting a booster box with another guy a couple of times, though.  like xmas morning going through all those packs :)

ETA--wow, ani-mayhem, still have those.  ME:TW, too.

Quote from: Greentongue;750061Was it the non-stop rotation of new releases and the expense of keeping up?

Did you enjoy the game itself?

I played from beta to sometimes after Ice Age.  I even went to the Ice Age unveiling and played in the release tournament (or whatever it was called).  I eventually sold all my valuable cards and overall I think the experience ended up paying for itself.  It was fun, but I never really liked the collectible aspect of it, even if that's what ended up making it more or less free in the end.

I thought Jyhad/Vampire was good and I think the CCG version of Illuminati (INWO) was actually more fun that the boxed version (still a great game) because it played faster.  

Overall I loved deck building in CCGs and I'd probably enjoy a game where there was deck building but not collecting.  Though I haven't looked into that and the OMNI verison of Illuminati needed more than 1 of each card for that.

Quote from: Coffee Zombie;751938I do enjoy the idea of a card game like MTG, I just wish they would release a "non-collectible" version (a fixed set).

This where "Cube" fits. It is one of each card that you like and that you think are balanced together. You then play "normal" MtG by drafting 45 cards (3 "packs" of 15) from just that pre-selected set. I have an all commons Cube.  It is fun and cheap to build, especially if you already have most. Since you build the Cube yourself, you can put whatever you want in it. The only concern is to keep it balanced.

A separate "mana base" of lands to pull from lets you build a 40 card deck (23 spells + 17 lands) to play with.
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Quote from: Brander;751992I think the CCG version of Illuminati (INWO) was actually more fun that the boxed version (still a great game) because it played faster.

Oh yes. INWO was a great and very fun game. Me and my friends bring out our old decks, build from cards we bought in cheap cheap bulks back when the CCG-bubble burst, a couple of times a year. It's hardly a balanced game but the combinations and overall feel of cheeky gonzo satire really gives a great game.

So INWO, and the On The Edge, the Over the Edge rpg spinoff ccg, I still play once in a while.

I used to play Raw Deal, which was a horrible experience for newbies; when they rebooted it, the new version was fantastic, but there were a few toxic communities who hated the new version, and then the game died.

Quote from: Doughdee222;750209A "fun, casual pick up game" could mean anything from a silly "I'll kill you with nothing but sharks!" to something more serious "This deck does A, B and C, in that order." You could meet your buddy, pull out a premade deck and start playing immediately with a quick time limit. Or you could take hours researching and building some gonzo deck. Some people take it seriously and memorize all the cards and invest thousands of bucks into it and go to tournaments, others... don't.

It's worth pointing out, as with any other game; if you're both expecting the same type of game - casual or serious - then you'll get a good game, probably. If your expectations are different, it will be shit and awful. You need to play at your level, and with others at your level.

Quote from: Coffee Zombie;751938I do enjoy the idea of a card game like MTG, I just wish they would release a "non-collectible" version (a fixed set).

Have you tried Dominion or other deckbuilding games, or any of FFG's LCG's (Non-random, small, expansions each month)? I've heard very good things about FFG's Netrunner.

I really liked MtG but I just couldn't afford to keep up with my friends when they decided to adhere to tournament rules. I kinda hated playing the deck building arms race also. I just lilked making fun theme decks and seeing how they'd play.

I much prefer non collectable card games.

I played in 94-95. The game is fun, but I just couldn't keep sinking money into it. Especially since I was a kid and I didn't exactly have tons of money.

I got into a couple more CCGs after that too, and its hard to stay into more than one unless you got a good bit of cash.

The massive money sink and the stacks and stacks of commons and uncommons. The sheer waste of it. Then came the revisions and bannings and etc and getting the hell out was the solution.

I've always played at home with my friends. What I never liked was the direction Wizards took to power down spells and defang control decks. That was my favorite part of the game. Before you had ridiculous decks because players could build synergies between not necessarily strong cards, but now the focus is on dropping singularly powerful cards that just win on their own. The strategy is dumbed down. And then there were the M10 rule changes, and removing combat damage from the stack...

My group basically plays in a metagame frozen in time without any of those changes because we never liked them, and we stopped playing strictly by tournament rules a long ago because of it.

Quote from: Simlasa;751841My girlfriend tried it a few times with cards some friends of hers gave us.
She liked the pictures but wanted more 'story' out of it.
Neither of us liked the 'collectible' aspect (manufactured scarcity) and lost interest quickly.

That's pretty much like me, I wanted more story, and more social interaction with the people. Its like watching chess masters who are so worried about the game they forget they're playing with people. I can sit at home and play innumerable video games  against people who don't talk, don't interact or at least not well.  IF I  play a game with other people in person, I want the interaction to be more than just "X damage to Y."

Played Magic twice in my lifetime. Once during 4th Edition/Ice Age till 5th came out with four friends. Just all sitting around a table playing endless multiplayer games of three or four hours. And then I started again during the Odyssey block up untill the Time Spiral block. That was in a club house with a lot more players. We shared one card collection with three players and that quickly made use better than most casual players, but just not good enough for Pro Tour Qualifiers.

I found it very expensive and 90% of all the cards are pure shite. So you had to buy the cards you liked best instead of booster packs. I bought them on Ebay all over the world. Even in China, Taiwan and Singapore. Pretty cheap and always reliable. The American border procedure sucks ass btw. I takes almost three weeks to get your cards instead of a week and a half from China.

One day we started playing coop pc games instead of going to Magic and we never returned. We are doing this now ever since. Played a lot of Left 4 Dead and Borderlands. And Civilization V.

I always wanted to roleplay and heard one dude he played them all and he liked vampire the masquerade the best. So I bought the Bloodlines PC game. I loved it and started hanging around WW and Shadownessence fora on the internet in 2007. It took me one year before finally buying the game (I had my doubts about Requiem, it didn't appeal to me as much as VtM) and started posting on those two fora. And I complained about the lack of lore and ended up in endless flamewars being accused of being an grumpy grognard, who just didn't like any change.

I never liked the audience on those fora. Just not my crowd. I tried other Dutch fora like Mandragon.be and 4GM.nl, where I met 3ric. Mandragon stopped and we both quit 4GM. I didn't have a WW forum account anymore and then Shadownessence stopped (it started again), so I ended up here. Best forum experience so far.

We still play Magic once in a while. It's usually with one big pile of cards. Everyone takes cards from the same pile. No lands, you just place a card upside down on the table and it counts as a five mana superland. Really fun and you have to think well about which cards are gonna end up as lands. Recently I made everyone start playing Heartstone which is like Magic with only sorceries and creatures.

I always wanted to roleplay since we played Warhammer Fantasy in the late nineties. I like it isn't competitive. I was a bit fed up with people at Magic tournaments trying to screw you, because of the rules.

There is one world I'd really like to see as an RPG - Ravnica. It was how I always played Planescape, I admit.

I really liked the game. It was way too expensive so I stopped, though. Same thing with 40k.

I got in the Unlimited/Revised era.  Antiquities, Fallen Empires and Ice Age were the expansions I had the most of.  We did a lot of group play.  Like a lot of people I knew, RPGs vanished for a year or so and we went full-bore into Magic.  Never got Homelands and kind of dropped out of Magic and went back to RPGs.  The collectible side was fun, but I thought Jyhad was a much better game with all the politicking.

Quote from: Rincewind1;778038There is one world I'd really like to see as an RPG - Ravnica. It was how I always played Planescape, I admit.

Great factions. Very appealing. The giant city setting is awesome as well. I always thought this would make a great PC sandbox game.