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Author Topic: Marvel Heroic Roleplaying is done  (Read 10153 times)

VectorSigma

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Marvel Heroic Roleplaying is done
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2013, 09:56:17 PM »
Quote from: Black Vulmea;648985
I was reading the lamentations thread over at Big Purple about this earlier, and I was struck by two things: first, a lot of anger directed at Marvel, with one poster going so far as to imply that 'a lot of Marvel fans wouldn't forget this insult,' and second, that the terms of the license were too restrictive on MWP.

Newsflash, kids: Marvel wants to make money off the license, and if the game didn't move enough product, this is what happens. There weren't enough gamers interested in either the game or the supplement[strike]s[/strike], period. The market has spoken.


Similar conversations on various G+ threads this evening.

I'm flabbergasted that people can't understand this whole thing.  MWP and Marvel signed an agreement of some sort.  It wasn't working out (profit-wise? we presume, but we don't know), so MWP and Marvel did not renew the agreement.  Making Marvel "the bad guy" in this saga is anti-corporate oppressed-nerd BS.  Everyone involved in the deal is an adult.

Despite MHRPG being a darling in certain circles, it was weirdly packaged and not marketed outside of regular rpg channels.  Given that, it could _never_ make enough money for Marvel to get excited about it.
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Tommy Brownell

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Marvel Heroic Roleplaying is done
« Reply #16 on: April 24, 2013, 10:08:11 PM »
Quote from: Black Vulmea;648985
I was reading the lamentations thread over at Big Purple about this earlier, and I was struck by two things: first, a lot of anger directed at Marvel, with one poster going so far as to imply that 'a lot of Marvel fans wouldn't forget this insult,' and second, that the terms of the license were too restrictive on MWP.

Newsflash, kids: Marvel wants to make money off the license, and if the game didn't move enough product, this is what happens. There weren't enough gamers interested in either the game or the supplement[strike]s[/strike], period. The market has spoken.


I'm not particularly ANGRY at Marvel...but after three aborted Marvel RPG runs in a row, I can't imagine ever getting excited about another Marvel RPG again, regardless of the promises, mechanics or designers.
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Black Vulmea

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Marvel Heroic Roleplaying is done
« Reply #17 on: April 24, 2013, 10:51:38 PM »
Quote from: Tommy Brownell;649019
I'm not particularly ANGRY at Marvel...but after three aborted Marvel RPG runs in a row, I can't imagine ever getting excited about another Marvel RPG again, regardless of the promises, mechanics or designers.

Which three are we talking about here? TSR's run was something like seven years, with boxed sets, dozens of supplements and adventures, and a slew of Dragon articles. MWP managed a game book and an adventure.

In any case, I'm sure Marvel will be thinking twice about licensing roleplaying games in the future, at least to niche publishers with boutique systems.
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Marvel Heroic Roleplaying is done
« Reply #18 on: April 24, 2013, 10:59:04 PM »
Quote from: Piestrio;648993
Comic fans rival Star Wars fans for sheer bitchy-ness.

If I had a nickel for everything someone swore off comics "FOREVER!" after some "insult" I'd probably be more profitable than Marvel or DC


I'm still angry at Marvel for replacing Giant-Man and the Wasp with that Namor creep in Tales to Astonish back in '65.

I got over it though.

Eventually.

Gabriel2

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« Reply #19 on: April 24, 2013, 11:06:09 PM »
Do comic fans even overlap with RPG fans anymore?  All the younger people I know who are into Pathfinder or whatever are completely disinterested in comic books.  Meanwhile, all the older people I know who are still into RPGs can't stand modern comics.  It's completely different from the 80s and early 90s where all RPG fans were into Conan or X-Men or some other comic title.
 

Rincewind1

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Marvel Heroic Roleplaying is done
« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2013, 11:11:53 PM »
Quote from: Gabriel2;649041
Do comic fans even overlap with RPG fans anymore?  All the younger people I know who are into Pathfinder or whatever are completely disinterested in comic books.  Meanwhile, all the older people I know who are still into RPGs can't stand modern comics.  It's completely different from the 80s and early 90s where all RPG fans were into Conan or X-Men or some other comic title.


I'd be into Hellblazer, if modern writers didn't turn it into a steaming pile of reboots and goo. Papa Midnite's story being retconned to show him as a Victum of White Menz Evil, then depicting him as Snoop Dog 2.0 was the ultimate blow to Hellblazer for me. When I picked that story up, I expected a bloodthirsty tale of a man crazy for power, ultimately sacrificing his sister in order to become a Houngan, not the pile of garbage it turned out to be.

Jokes aside - yeah, I think we are. I never was much into superhero comics (with the exception of the last Czarnian), preferring the European comics.
Furthermore, I consider that  This is Why We Don't Like You thread should be closed

Sacrosanct

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« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2013, 11:12:36 PM »
I've been thinking about this for a long time (at least a few years), and I'm always surprised when I see a mainstream IP still in the RPG market.  I imagine IP holders, many who don't know or play RPGs in the least bit, want a substantial amount of money for a license.  And the RPG market simply isn't big enough to support that.

All the cool IPs from the 70s and 80s are owned by large corporations now (like TMNT), so I don't see any of those coming back either.

Time for some creative person to create another cool IP to go off of
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Rincewind1

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« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2013, 11:14:18 PM »
Quote from: Sacrosanct;649045
I've been thinking about this for a long time (at least a few years), and I'm always surprised when I see a mainstream IP still in the RPG market.  I imagine IP holders, many who don't know or play RPGs in the least bit, want a substantial amount of money for a license.  And the RPG market simply isn't big enough to support that.

All the cool IPs from the 70s and 80s are owned by large corporations now (like TMNT), so I don't see any of those coming back either.

Time for some creative person to create another cool IP to go off of

Some don't. Or in other cases, such as FFG getting the Warhammer and now Star Wars, the RPGs are just the icing on the cake. I suspect that Warhammer was sold under a condition of producing an RPG, but I'd not wager on that - GW never cared much for the RPG after the 90s.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2013, 11:33:12 PM by Rincewind1 »
Furthermore, I consider that  This is Why We Don't Like You thread should be closed

Tommy Brownell

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« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2013, 11:27:52 PM »
Quote from: Black Vulmea;649036
Which three are we talking about here? TSR's run was something like seven years, with boxed sets, dozens of supplements and adventures, and a slew of Dragon articles. MWP managed a game book and an adventure.

In any case, I'm sure Marvel will be thinking twice about licensing roleplaying games in the future, at least to niche publishers with boutique systems.


Marvel SAGA, Marvel Universe (published by Marvel themselves and having the smallest number of releases) and Marvel Heroic.
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Bland Joe Dwarf

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« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2013, 11:30:24 PM »
I agree with the feeling here, the books had very high production values and the designers were clearly passionate about them, but were clearly based on a absurdly wrong business strategy.

Centering the game around Marvel events, not having many of the iconic characters on the core book, not having even character creation rules in it, and making the power rules too similar, those were its faults.

Of course, even if they didn't make these, IMHO, mistakes, we aren't sure Marvel wouldn't have pulled the plug as well, as Marvel Saga and Marvel Universe were also cut short.

On the other hand, Green Ronin's policy for the DCA book is apparently solid, as they have just released the last planned book, and used it to spearhead the new M&M edition, for which they are releasing genre books (Supernatural Handbook,  and the upcoming Cosmic Handbook, for instance), which always seemed to me a good decision, from when I picked 2nd Ed onward.
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Gabriel2

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« Reply #25 on: April 24, 2013, 11:40:30 PM »
Quote from: Bland Joe Dwarf;649050
Marvel Universe were also cut short.


That was a mercy killing, and also no loss.  That was absolutely unplayable drek.  I'd even posit the hypothesis that it poisoned any potential audience against any future Marvel game.  I know the craptacularity of Marvel Universe definitely contributed to me not picking up Marvel Heroic out of curiousity.
 

YourSwordisMine

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« Reply #26 on: April 24, 2013, 11:58:26 PM »
Good.

Glad to see another license no longer tied to such a shitty system...

Maybe MWP will finally realize what a stinking pile of donkey dung Cortex really is...

Nah... wont happen...

alas...
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« Reply #27 on: April 25, 2013, 03:08:15 AM »
Quote from: VectorSigma;649012

Despite MHRPG being a darling in certain circles, it was weirdly packaged and not marketed outside of regular rpg channels.  Given that, it could _never_ make enough money for Marvel to get excited about it.



Well, I had to get my copy from Amazon as there was no proper distrubtion to the EU/UK for this game, which was not a good sign with hindsight.

And frankly given that they included the core rules with every major event (the premium edition - and the annihilation premium edition includes more character generation stuff, which is a bit of a rip), it was rather pointless buying the core book ultimately. Breakout was never going to set the fans ablaze in terms of fan service.

I don't think it's fair to call it a collectible product, but while this makes me a little sad, I suppose given the distribution it was inevitable. I don't think it does MWP any favours at all: this has hardly been out five minutes!
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« Reply #28 on: April 25, 2013, 03:25:49 AM »
First of all, 'Other games', seriously? That's just sad.

I didn't pick up MHR as the mechanics seemed a little too fiddly for my tastes. Also having found a great fit with ICONS my curiosity for other supers games (and there have been a number of well regarded ones released recently) is limited. But still, it deserved a longer run.

Also, whether comics books sales are in decline or roleplayers still read comics kind of misses the points. Marvel these days is about the movies, and they've been among the biggest movies in recent times. The genre has never had a higher profile.
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Raven

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« Reply #29 on: April 25, 2013, 03:41:46 AM »
Quote from: Piestrio;648993
Comic fans rival Star Wars fans for sheer bitchy-ness.


I'd include D&D fans for the NerdWhine trifecta.

Anyway sucky news for MWP, those working on the line and for fans of the game (I liked it myself, although it was a trial at first)

I liked the event-based nature of the releases but fuck was Civil War not divisive enough already? They should have led with Age of Apocalypse or Secret Wars or something.

I'm more concerned that we might never see another Marvel game. I can't imagine tabletop rpg's are even a tiny blip on the Mouses radar, and even if they were who could afford it now?