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Author Topic: Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?  (Read 856 times)

3rik

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Dark Souls™ - The Board Game by Steamforged Games Ltd — Kickstarter

Have any of you seen this? What do you think: boring ameritrash grind or exciting emulation of the video game series? And what about the miniatures?
It's not Its

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CRKrueger

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2016, 02:58:29 PM »
About the trend in general...awesome.  The RPGish boardgames can serve as a gateway to RPGs.
About Dark Souls specifically...yeah, sue me, I never played it. :D
Some of the minis I might have to wait a while to have use for, but they look awesome and at 32mm scale are very usuable for RPGs in general.

One thing I wish Kickstarter would include is a question or poll or something so we could get data on how many people would have bought the Monolith game or this one if the scale was 15mm or 54mm or something not standard miniature range.

I know for sure there's people who buy these massive mini games who are going to hardly ever play the game and simply want the minis for RPGs or skirmish wargames, but we need put a dollar amount on it.
Even the the "cutting edge" storygamers for all their talk of narrative, plot, and drama are fucking obsessed with the god damned rules they use. - Estar

Yes, Sean Connery's thumb does indeed do megadamage. - Spinachcat

Isuldur is a badass because he stopped Sauron with a broken sword, but Iluvatar is the badass because he stopped Sauron with a hobbit. -Malleus Arianorum

"Tangency Edition" D&D would have no classes or races, but 17 genders to choose from. -TristramEvans

JesterRaiin

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2016, 03:39:07 PM »
Quote from: CRKrueger;897220
The RPGish boardgames can serve as a gateway to RPGs.

Or the exact opposite of it. Been seeing people I-shit-you-not who abandoned CoC to play Arkham "the devourer of floors" Horror.
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CRKrueger

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2016, 05:40:39 PM »
Yeah, the opposite works too, if people see RPGs as possible entry points to the larger audience games, then RPGs still have value to the larger audience industries like Cardgames, Boardgames, Novels, Video Games, etc...

We need to get RPGs to the point where they are considered a respectable and viable tie-in product for transmedia IP's.  They have a function as a Venn set that intersects with every other form of entertainment known, but I don't think they are considered to have the value they do.

I know people who do cardgames but not boardgames, or buy video games but don't read a lot.  I've never met a single RPGer who doesn't do all of the above to some degree.  If I can sell you a RPG, chances are I can sell you a cardgame, boardgame, movie, book, comic, or video game on the same material, and turn you into a proselytizer.

Roleplayers take such a weird pride in not being worth anything to corporations customerwise, they ignore the fact that they probably are a very key demo out of scale with their numbers.
Even the the "cutting edge" storygamers for all their talk of narrative, plot, and drama are fucking obsessed with the god damned rules they use. - Estar

Yes, Sean Connery's thumb does indeed do megadamage. - Spinachcat

Isuldur is a badass because he stopped Sauron with a broken sword, but Iluvatar is the badass because he stopped Sauron with a hobbit. -Malleus Arianorum

"Tangency Edition" D&D would have no classes or races, but 17 genders to choose from. -TristramEvans

Thornhammer

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2016, 12:10:34 AM »
I'm in for the base set, possibly an expansion later.

3rik

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2016, 07:07:58 AM »
Was hoping for some sensible commentary on what is known about the mechanics of the game.
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JesterRaiin

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2016, 10:04:06 AM »
Quote from: CRKrueger;897246
We need to get RPGs to the point where they are considered a respectable and viable tie-in product for transmedia IP's.

Wait, wait. Whoooooa there, Hulk. Why should we want to achieve that? I mean, it's nice to see the hobby grow & such, but come on, we're no crusaders and there's no crusade to be won...

"If it's not appearing, it's not a real message." ~ Brett

3rik

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2016, 12:07:49 PM »
There's cool looking miniatures and a co-op mode. Also, my wife is a HUGE fan of the video games and after thoroughly reading the Ask-Me-Anythings thinks we should jump in at the basic level plus at least one add-on.
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CRKrueger

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2016, 04:00:54 PM »
Quote from: JesterRaiin;897363
Wait, wait. Whoooooa there, Hulk. Why should we want to achieve that? I mean, it's nice to see the hobby grow & such, but come on, we're no crusaders and there's no crusade to be won...
What does a crusade have to do with it?  The common wisdom is "there's no money in PnP RPGs".  What they really mean is "just about everything else we could do with our idea would make more money than a PnP RPG".  That may be true, but to ignore the market and audience of PnP Roleplayers is to ignore a demographic that probably intersects with every other form of IP expression, whereas many of those other, more profitable, IP expressions don't necessarily intersect.  Videogame, cardgame, boardgame, novel - sure, we'll make those. PnP RPG - Why bother?  You bother because if you sell them that PnP RPG, there's a good chance you might sell them the others too, because a high percentage of PnP RPGers do all of that as well.  "There's no money in PnP RPGs" as a mantra does us no good.

For the OP: I've been playing around with the first Dark Souls and checked out some of the KS videos.  It looks like they are doing a pretty good job of interpreting the gameplay.  I wonder if you have a player actually play the Bosses though, with all the move cards they can play might be more fun, but the Bosses are so brutal, it looks like you kind of need the "stuck on 5 moves that repeat in order you have to memorize and come up with a specific counter for that you learn after 35 deaths" model from the video game.
Even the the "cutting edge" storygamers for all their talk of narrative, plot, and drama are fucking obsessed with the god damned rules they use. - Estar

Yes, Sean Connery's thumb does indeed do megadamage. - Spinachcat

Isuldur is a badass because he stopped Sauron with a broken sword, but Iluvatar is the badass because he stopped Sauron with a hobbit. -Malleus Arianorum

"Tangency Edition" D&D would have no classes or races, but 17 genders to choose from. -TristramEvans

JesterRaiin

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2016, 04:16:23 PM »
Quote from: CRKrueger;897600
What does a crusade have to do with it?

A crusade is one of these joint operations where people work together to achieve some common, higher goal. Yes, blood and carnage is involved, but it's irrelevant to the topic, I've chosen it for its idealistic agenda, because I perceive "we must do something about that" as highly idealistic opinion. :)

Quote
(...) "There's no money in PnP RPGs" as a mantra does us no good..

I see no problem in RPGs becoming less mainstream than they are now. There are too many games, bad players and tension already. A purge of sorts could lead to more healthy reality, I guess.
"If it's not appearing, it's not a real message." ~ Brett

CRKrueger

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #10 on: May 13, 2016, 06:51:01 PM »
Eh, I always saw taking pride in being "a niche of a niche of a niche of a niche" as just another form of elitism, just one that doesn't require being Elite at anything.  Either that or having a highschool flashback and doing the sackcloth and ashes thing for being one of the downtrodden.  I'm not suggesting #RPGCallToAction #RPGsMatter, I'm just saying that there's a benefit to being mainstream other than the gloriously bland recipes the larger corps will feed us, I'm talking about benefits like development dollars for things like actual usable software, not kludged together SDKs in a box.
Even the the "cutting edge" storygamers for all their talk of narrative, plot, and drama are fucking obsessed with the god damned rules they use. - Estar

Yes, Sean Connery's thumb does indeed do megadamage. - Spinachcat

Isuldur is a badass because he stopped Sauron with a broken sword, but Iluvatar is the badass because he stopped Sauron with a hobbit. -Malleus Arianorum

"Tangency Edition" D&D would have no classes or races, but 17 genders to choose from. -TristramEvans

JesterRaiin

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2016, 06:49:09 AM »
Quote from: CRKrueger;897632
Eh, I always saw taking pride in being "a niche of a niche of a niche of a niche" as just another form of elitism, just one that doesn't require being Elite at anything.  Either that or having a highschool flashback and doing the sackcloth and ashes thing for being one of the downtrodden.  I'm not suggesting #RPGCallToAction #RPGsMatter, I'm just saying that there's a benefit to being mainstream other than the gloriously bland recipes the larger corps will feed us, I'm talking about benefits like development dollars for things like actual usable software, not kludged together SDKs in a box.

Come on.

"Non-mainstream"/"niche hobby" is merely a status. "Elitism" is an attitude. While the former might begot the latter, they aren't one and the same and one doesn't immediately lead to another. In fact, it's not uncommon for the majority to think itself "elite". So, worry not, there's no risk to become "better than all those unwashed simpletons", or more precisely the risk stays pretty the same.

I'm thinking about other aspect of the hobby. It produces way too many weak things, be it games, sourcebooks or adventures and attracts too many people that doesn't make good players, but who are, oh so eager to dictate how games are supposed to be played, who should be included and what themes are unwelcome. It's like an empire, too big for its own good. And it still demands more.
"If it's not appearing, it's not a real message." ~ Brett

CRKrueger

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #12 on: May 15, 2016, 05:56:14 PM »
Quote from: JesterRaiin;897729
I'm thinking about other aspect of the hobby. It produces way too many weak things, be it games, sourcebooks or adventures and attracts too many people that doesn't make good players, but who are, oh so eager to dictate how games are supposed to be played, who should be included and what themes are unwelcome. It's like an empire, too big for its own good. And it still demands more.
Yeah but the choices are...
1. A mainstream in which all media, except PnP RPGs, are becoming more and more integrated taking advantage of advancements in technology.
2. A mainstream in which all media are becoming more and more integrated taking advantage of advancements in technology.

#2 is going to give us VTTs developed like real software and have PnP RPGs be included when the big players decide to bring in 3d and AR tech that will give us home entertainment systems that we can use to play tabletop RPG sessions with players all over the globe without the GM having to be a programmer in whatever-the-fuck-they-use-in-ten-years.

#1 won't.
Even the the "cutting edge" storygamers for all their talk of narrative, plot, and drama are fucking obsessed with the god damned rules they use. - Estar

Yes, Sean Connery's thumb does indeed do megadamage. - Spinachcat

Isuldur is a badass because he stopped Sauron with a broken sword, but Iluvatar is the badass because he stopped Sauron with a hobbit. -Malleus Arianorum

"Tangency Edition" D&D would have no classes or races, but 17 genders to choose from. -TristramEvans

JesterRaiin

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2016, 05:48:49 AM »
Quote from: CRKrueger;897984
Yeah but the choices are...


These aren't choices. Nobody has to choose anything here, nobody is forced to do that. What you're saying about are possibilities, arbitrary selected from whole spectrum of possible scenarios that might or might not happen. And this is where things start to get interesting.

Popularity equals more people, more people equals more tastes, opinions, assumptions and this, in turn, leads to the evolution of a hobby in an unpredictable way. As far as I'm concerned, RPGs might evolve into WHFRP 3rd-like abominations, not quite RPGs, not quite board games, very much a collective hobby following similar rules to the ones featured in video/mobile gaming. For example, "pay to win", or "initially locked content".

So, your call to arms might pave the way for a hobby you yourself don't recognize as RPG anymore.

Impossible? Well now, grognards, OSR die-hards and "but there's no immersion in that" guys might disagree with that. ;)

Just for the sake of clarity: I'm not sure whether it's obvious, but I take a jab at "careful what you wish for".
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CRKrueger

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Dark Souls - The Board Game Kickstarter: What do you think?
« Reply #14 on: May 17, 2016, 02:18:02 AM »
Quote from: JesterRaiin;898089
These aren't choices. Nobody has to choose anything here, nobody is forced to do that. What you're saying about are possibilities, arbitrary selected from whole spectrum of possible scenarios that might or might not happen. And this is where things start to get interesting.

Popularity equals more people, more people equals more tastes, opinions, assumptions and this, in turn, leads to the evolution of a hobby in an unpredictable way. As far as I'm concerned, RPGs might evolve into WHFRP 3rd-like abominations, not quite RPGs, not quite board games, very much a collective hobby following similar rules to the ones featured in video/mobile gaming. For example, "pay to win", or "initially locked content".

So, your call to arms might pave the way for a hobby you yourself don't recognize as RPG anymore.

Impossible? Well now, grognards, OSR die-hards and "but there's no immersion in that" guys might disagree with that. ;)

Just for the sake of clarity: I'm not sure whether it's obvious, but I take a jab at "careful what you wish for".


You're getting lost in the english and inferring an active advocacy there common use does not imply.  Simply stopping a second to think and realize that "there is little money in ttRPGs" is not the same thing as "ttRPGs have no value to IP authors" is all that needs to occur for ttRPGs to become more mainstream.

As far as the dangers of mainstream, you're kidding, right?  All new games are WFRP3?  Got news for ya, that's already happened.  Pick a major IP that has an RPG..now name one that isn't a "define OOC mechanic as roleplaying" narrative shitshow.  Even 5e is just 4e restructured enough to actually be D&D this time around.  I don't care what kind of non-roleplaying they are going to call roleplaying next, that ship has sailed.  All I want is for it to get big, because then the money and tech dev dollars will flow, and people will find out that all those cool storytelling ooc mechanics don't translate to computer well at all, so instead they'll focus on what you can do with tech - visual representation and graphics.  Narrative zones will look like pure ass (and not the good kind) in 3d or AR.  What will look good?  Normal distances and actual representations of things.  Grow the industry by selling everyone CorSavFateD20 for all I care.  Just drag the hobby kicking and screaming into the 21st century with tech and in 20 years I'll be able to retire to a "Old Gamer's Home" and play RQ6 Monster Island with Butcher with the Kaiju in full color hi-def 3D. :D
Even the the "cutting edge" storygamers for all their talk of narrative, plot, and drama are fucking obsessed with the god damned rules they use. - Estar

Yes, Sean Connery's thumb does indeed do megadamage. - Spinachcat

Isuldur is a badass because he stopped Sauron with a broken sword, but Iluvatar is the badass because he stopped Sauron with a hobbit. -Malleus Arianorum

"Tangency Edition" D&D would have no classes or races, but 17 genders to choose from. -TristramEvans