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Author Topic: More Spider-Man!!!  (Read 452 times)

Jackalope

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« on: September 13, 2008, 08:16:24 PM »
Tobey Maquire has inked a deal with Sony to star in Spider-Man 4 and Spider-Man 5, which will be filmed back to back over the course of a year.

Here's to hoping they get Alfred Molina (Doc Ock) and Bryce Dallas Howard (Gwen Stacy) and James Cromwell (Captain Stacy) back and do the Death of Captain Stacy, because after 3 movies, it's time to do a "Everybody Thinks Spider-Man Is A Criminal" story.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2008, 08:21:50 PM by Jackalope »
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Werekoala

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« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2008, 08:21:22 PM »
Sweet. Now hopefully they won't try to shoehorn three villains into one movie and give them the development they deserve.
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Jackalope

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« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2008, 08:25:39 PM »
Quote from: Werekoala;247522
Sweet. Now hopefully they won't try to shoehorn three villains into one movie and give them the development they deserve.


We can only pray that they learned their lesson with Spider-Man 3, which really needed one less villain -- it was like they took two really good movies, edited them down and jammed them together.  Bad move.  One Villain Per Movie generally ought to be the rule.

They've spent the last two movies introducing and expanding the role of Dr. Curt Connors.  The Lizard must be a villain for one of the next two movies.
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Drew

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« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2008, 05:54:52 AM »
Quote from: Jackalope;247524


They've spent the last two movies introducing and expanding the role of Dr. Curt Connors.  The Lizard must be a villain for one of the next two movies.


After taunting us for three movies it's only fair that they deliver.

I'd also like to see the Vulture in there somewhere, but I suspect Raimi would rather go for a more ostentatious villains like Kraven or Mysterio.
 

Jackalope

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« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2008, 06:15:30 AM »
Quote from: Drew;247629
After taunting us for three movies it's only fair that they deliver.

I'd also like to see the Vulture in there somewhere, but I suspect Raimi would rather go for a more ostentatious villains like Kraven or Mysterio.


Mysterio is my favorite Spider-Man villain after Green Goblin, but as much as I'd liek to see him in a movie, I don't think his "powers" would translate to the big screen.  Using special effects to depict his...special effects?

Though Mysterio could lead to the creation of the most perversely self-referential movie ever, which could be kind of cool.

Imagine if they loosely used the "Spider-Movie" plot (which has been used in both Amazing and Ultimate, and is a self-reference), and feature a maverick film maker, Quentin Beck (played by maverick film maker Quentin Tarantino!  Self reference!) determined to get the real live Spider-Man to do stuntwork in his film.  So he creates the Mysterio identity, stages some crimes to lure Spider-Man out in an area where has hidden camera crews, and gets footage of fight scenes for his movie which are also coincidentally the fight scenes that a Spider-Man movie must have (ULTIMATE SELF REFERENCE OVERLOAD!).

Meanwhile, violating my own one villain per movie rule (but it's okay, because Mysterio doesn't need much depth, and Connors has already been introduced), Curt Connors turns into the freaking Lizard.  Connors reveals his formula to Peter, and Peter is interrupted in his attempt to persuade Connors not to use himself as a guinea pig by a Mysterio appearance.  Just as Peter is realizing that Mysterio is all for show, a stageprop villain, the Lizard goes on a rampage.

So the whole movie is a meditation on how the media distracts us from real issues in our lives.

Damn.  I wanna see that movie.
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TonyLB

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« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2008, 10:52:08 AM »
I am glad of new movies.  3 was a real stinker, of course, but hopefully a quick shock will be enough to put them back on the right path.

I will confess that the major element that I've seen that is tied to all of the ... well ... stupid in 2 and 3 is Toby doin' heroic/super things without his mask on.  Like "Oh, let's have a whole subway car full of people see Spiderman unmasked and not worry about it," or "Hey, let's have Toby rescue someone from a burning building, not spiderman," or "Hey, let's give Evil-Toby a super-powered jazz DANCE SEQUENCE for no readily understandable reason whatsoever."

I do sorta wonder whether this is an issue of star-power overcoming good movie scripting.  It is my hope that we can have a Spiderman 4 where we get a lot of wise-cracks and flashy heroism from Spiderman, and a lot of pathos and quiet heroism from Peter Parker, and not a whole hell of a lot of direct overlap.

But that's me.
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Jackalope

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« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2008, 03:23:40 PM »
Quote from: TonyLB;247659
I do sorta wonder whether this is an issue of star-power overcoming good movie scripting.


This phenomenon annoys me as well.  I suspect that they do this because they want you to see Tobey's face so you can see him emote.
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TonyLB

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« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2008, 08:29:54 PM »
Quote from: Jackalope;247735
This phenomenon annoys me as well.  I suspect that they do this because they want you to see Tobey's face so you can see him emote.
Ex-ACT-ly ... and if the story is done right then you shouldn't need to see his face to know what he's feeling.

C'mon:  "Nice to have a fan."  Great line, wonderfully delivered, through the mask.  BETTER through the mask.  Let your imagination fill stuff in.
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Jackalope

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« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2008, 03:45:23 AM »
Quote from: TonyLB;247773
Ex-ACT-ly ... and if the story is done right then you shouldn't need to see his face to know what he's feeling.

C'mon:  "Nice to have a fan."  Great line, wonderfully delivered, through the mask.  BETTER through the mask.  Let your imagination fill stuff in.


I think it's the agents and the studios that make these decisions more than the writers.  The agents are terrified that if no one sees their clients face, then it's a waste of time.  Studios are afraid that they'll upset audiences who came to see Tobey Maquire.

I am still fucking amazed that they never showed V's face in V for Vendetta.  You never know it's Hugo Weaving under the mask.  But at the same time, how many normal people do you think know that Hugo Weaving played V?  When i see his credits listed, it's always Agent Smith and Elrond, never V.

Likewise, who played Darth Vader?  James Earl Jones or David Prouse?  People tend to think of James Earl Jones, but David Prouse's body language is a HUGE part of the character.

Oh, in other news:  Sam Raimi has signed on to direct 4 and 5, and Bryce Dallas Howard, while not signed yet, has expressed interest.

Also, the movie is expected to be released in 2011 (AUIGH!!), and the script being written by Kevin Anderson (not Sam & Ivan Raimi, unlike the first three) will be a two-parter.  Both films will be shot back to back.
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CavScout
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« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2008, 03:50:32 AM »
Quote from: Werekoala;247522
Sweet. Now hopefully they won't try to shoehorn three villains into one movie and give them the development they deserve.


This.
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himsati

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« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2008, 10:29:15 AM »
My pick: Kraven and the Lizard. Goo from Venom gets mixed into Doc Conner's formula (tip to the 3rd movie at least) and he turns into the lizard. Kraven comes to hunt him and Spidey is stuck in the middle. Eventually Kraven turns his focus on Spiderman. If you want a third villain, throw in a brief "comedy bit" with Shocker or Mysterio (sorry, he's a classic villain but he can also be great comedy relief) using Bruce Campbell. Villain gets away in the beginning (have the fight be part of the opening credits) and at the very end of the movie Spidey catches up with him (much like some of the comics were done prior to the MacFarland era). Three villains but not three villains (which might get the studio off their backs to concentrate on the story):  Lizard already has some development, the Shocker/Mysterio is a brief bit not much more than a double-cameo for Bruce Campbell, and you have plenty of time to focus on Kraven and do remaining development on the Lizard.
 
Personally Kraven's Last Hunt would be my fave to go into the theatre, but having the guy kill himself at the end would probably not go over well with movie-goers and their kids...
 
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Jackalope

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« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2008, 03:46:13 PM »
Quote from: himsati;247892
If you want a third villain, throw in a brief "comedy bit" with Shocker or Mysterio (sorry, he's a classic villain but he can also be great comedy relief) using Bruce Campbell.


It would be awesome if they opened the movie with Bruce Campbell as Shocker robbing a bank, and had Spidey just show up and kick the crap out of him.  No explanation of who Shocker is, no backstory, total throwaway character, but gives Bruce his required cameo and will total thrill True Believers.
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jgants

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« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2008, 04:36:44 PM »
Quote from: Jackalope;247995
It would be awesome if they opened the movie with Bruce Campbell as Shocker robbing a bank, and had Spidey just show up and kick the crap out of him.  No explanation of who Shocker is, no backstory, total throwaway character, but gives Bruce his required cameo and will total thrill True Believers.


I wish more supers movies would do stuff like that.  It's not necessary to see the background of every single villain that appears, nor does every one have to be a major menace (two great decisions in Dark Knight - Joker doesn't have a background, and Scarecrow got a brief cameo where Batman handed his ass to him).
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Jackalope

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« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2008, 05:23:52 PM »
Quote from: jgants;248008
I wish more supers movies would do stuff like that.  It's not necessary to see the background of every single villain that appears, nor does every one have to be a major menace (two great decisions in Dark Knight - Joker doesn't have a background, and Scarecrow got a brief cameo where Batman handed his ass to him).


Dude, you just pointed out two of my favorite elements of The Dark Knight.  When The Joker first explains how he got his scars, I was like "Lame."  Then he explains it again, differently, and I realize the first story was bullshit, and we're not going to get an origin for the Joker!  That's fucking AWESOME.  No connection to Batman, no origin, just this freak who came out of the woodwork.

And then the throwaway appearance of the Scarecrow.  I give mega-props to Cillian Murphy for being willing to do that.  

The Spider-Mythos is full of throwaway villains that they could just toss in.  Shocker, Kangaroo, Rocket Racer, Prowler, White Rabbit, The Grizzly, etc.  None of these characters deserve full treatment in a movie, but how cool would it be to see a scene where Mary Jane is fretting about Peter while she watches him on TV, and close observers notice that he's fighting the Vulture or the Scorpion?

Movies typically open with a scene that establishes the "ordinary," the state the protagonist finds himself in before the story or plot begins.  When writers want to show that the protagonist's normal life is one of action, the story starts with the hero doing some amazing thing.  Like The Dark Knight starts with Batman taking out Scarecrow.  Irrelevant to the larger plot, but it establishes the ordinary for Batman.

Spider-Man 4 needs to start with a scene like this.  After three movies, they need to establish that Spidey is a full-fledged crime fighter and that he exists in a world where not every freaking villain has some personal connection to him (though that is, of course, an important part of the Spidey mythos, as his most important enemies DO have that personal connection).
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