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Author Topic: HBO's Watchmen  (Read 7055 times)

CarlD.

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HBO's Watchmen
« on: October 21, 2019, 08:27:24 PM »
I've heard good things about the show's premiere; that's its really good, gripping TV that reignites the decades old comic story with some new focus on different aspects that were perhaps understated in the original series. Anyone else seen it and have thoughts to share?
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GeekyBugle

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« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2019, 11:07:12 AM »
Quote from: CarlD.;1111135
I've heard good things about the show's premiere; that's its really good, gripping TV that reignites the decades old comic story with some new focus on different aspects that were perhaps understated in the original series. Anyone else seen it and have thoughts to share?


If by "really good, gripping TV that reignites the decades old comic story with some new focus" you mean it's woke, boring and nothing at all like the original Watchmen, then yes it's all of that and then some.

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Omega

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« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2019, 11:10:46 AM »
Wokemeh? :)

CarlD.

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« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2019, 12:47:54 PM »
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1111391
If by "really good, gripping TV that reignites the decades old comic story with some new focus" you mean it's woke, boring and nothing at all like the original Watchmen, then yes it's all of that and then some.

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What problems do you have with it?
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Ratman_tf

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« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2019, 12:59:02 PM »
Watchmen was one of those stories that's told without much room for adding stuff without turning it into a farce.



I'm only interested in rubbernecking to see how bad it is.
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GeekyBugle

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« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2019, 01:14:55 PM »
Quote from: CarlD.;1111420
What problems do you have with it?

Like I said, its woke, boring and has zero to do with Watchmen besides the name.

Woke: Soulsister whose personality is black wahmen, she's the good "retired" cop who comes to the rescue when the police force can't, of course she totally can. White supremacists had to be the bad guys, the cops are a fascist force.

Boring: Failed to catch my attention, failed to sell me into it, failed to tell enough of a story.

Zero to do with Watchmen: Watchmen was a deconstruction of the superhero genre, it told a hypothetical story about a world with superheroes and how those superheroes would impact the world, it was very political but not preachy, it showed flawed humans with superpowers, it had an interesting plot and concept. This is something with the same name but inherits exactly zero from the original, hell even the movie was closer to the comic books than this. In Watchmen the villain was 3d, here the villains are 1d caricatures. Watchmen had a depth of plot missing here altogether, Watchmen had female characters, this has a female 1d cutout. Watchmen had "good guys" who were shades of grey, this has a soulsister who has no depth.

But if you go by what the shillmedia says it's the greatest thing since sliced bread.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

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Kiero

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« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2019, 01:19:50 PM »
So no comparison to The Boys, then?
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CarlD.

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« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2019, 06:16:34 PM »
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1111428
Like I said, its woke, boring and has zero to do with Watchmen besides the name.

Thanks.

As for why I ask: "Woke" really doesn't mean allot to me. Boring is subjective so I was hoping to get more detail as too why it was boring and I was curious what changes had been made.

And the politics in a series don't generally bother me. The original series was and Alan Moore's work in general often has social and political commentary woven in. Personally, I like that especially in "gritty" low end superheroes.

I'll have to see if its get annoying beat you over the head level for me. Which I suspect is quite a bit lower than allot of the posters on this site. But that's why I like to ask around: to get a wide array of opinions.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2019, 08:18:59 PM by CarlD. »
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Omega

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« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2019, 12:22:55 AM »
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1111391
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Isnt she the daughter of one of the black heroes who was killed by bigots? If yes then she might be appropriate if the show is set after the movie? New and old heroes stepping up again?

Omega

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« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2019, 12:40:54 AM »
Quote from: GeekyBugle;1111428
Zero to do with Watchmen: Watchmen was a deconstruction of the superhero genre, it told a hypothetical story about a world with superheroes and how those superheroes would impact the world, it was very political but not preachy, it showed flawed humans with superpowers, it had an interesting plot and concept.

er... small note... Aside from Dr Manhattan, and possibly Ozymandias, virtually none of the heroes in that setting actually have powers. It is more a deconstruction of street level pulp heroes at that point.

And Moore seems to have wanted mostly to deconstruct Ditko's Randivistic black and white moral code heroes since quite a few are based off various Ditko creations. The Question and Blue Beetle obviously. Captain Atom and Nightshade as well I believe?

HappyDaze

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« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2019, 12:48:31 AM »
I just watched the first episode. I doubt I'll watch any further. Nothing really pulled me in--not the characters, the visuals, the action--nothing. Whatever story they're trying to tell just isn't for me.

GeekyBugle

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« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2019, 10:46:20 AM »
Quote from: Omega;1111511
er... small note... Aside from Dr Manhattan, and possibly Ozymandias, virtually none of the heroes in that setting actually have powers. It is more a deconstruction of street level pulp heroes at that point.

And Moore seems to have wanted mostly to deconstruct Ditko's Randivistic black and white moral code heroes since quite a few are based off various Ditko creations. The Question and Blue Beetle obviously. Captain Atom and Nightshade as well I believe?


Comedian doesn't seem to get old and seems stronger than humanly possible. So that makes 3 out of six, since you can't argue that being able to dodge bullets isn't indicative of some superpower. Tell me again about how virtually none of the heroes has superpowers?

And I already said it was a deconstruction of the genre, so I don't know what your argument there is.
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Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

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CarlD.

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« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2019, 02:17:45 PM »
Having seen the 1st episode, I enjoyed the show. It painted an interesting picture of an alternate America (similar the original miniseries) in some way darker (more violent, racial tension reaching a violent boiling point with the likes of the 7th Calvary and weird a(the 'squid storm/transdimnsional attacks). It left me curious about the background both of the characters and the setting, judging from the previews it appears to be heading some where big. I'm not sure why the main character was dismissed as "soulsista" (aside from the obvious I guess which is some ironic given themes in the show), she struck me as developed as any others characters with a personality and background that I want to see more off and motivations that were understandable. I liked her and the other characters seem interesting as well.

The police seem less "fascist" then besieged, forced by events and shaped by an alternate culture to adopt the techniques of masked vigilantes but still with rules of engagement (they have tighter control over the use of lethal force than cops in the real world

Its an original setting with new character so there is no gender/race swapping that I'm aware off. Has this story been done in another venue? It seems to stick to what some have demanded: No character with altered but new ones created. *shrug*

Though, I suppose the world might be considered "left" leaning (increased fire arms restrictions and enviormental laws are suggested as existing at least in part though the antagonists are pretty well armed... ) OTOH, Nixon is heralded as one of the great presidents and the 'culture wars'seem to have gone hot, its no utopia and the characters have flaws as well.

Edit:The music is great too.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2019, 05:41:04 PM by CarlD. »
"I once heard an evolutionary biologist talk about how violent simians are; they are horrifically violent. He then went on to add that he was really hopeful about humanity because "we're monkeys who manage *not* to kill each other most of the time.""

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GeekyBugle

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« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2019, 02:41:34 PM »
Quote from: CarlD.;1111595
Having seen the 1st episode, I enjoyed the show. It painted an interesting picture of an alternate America (similar the original miniseries) in some way darker (more violent, racial tension reaching a violent boiling point with the likes of the 7th Calvary and weird a(the 'squid storm/transdimnsional attacks). It left me curious about the background both of the characters and the setting, judging from the previews it appears to be heading some where big. I'm not sure why the main character was dismissed as "soulsista" (aside from the obvious I guess which is some ironic given themes in the show), she struck me as developed as any others characters with a personality and background that I want to see more off and motivations that were understandable. I liked her and the other characters seem interesting as well.

The police seem less "fascist" then besieged, forced by events and shaped by an alternate culture to adopt the techniques of masked vigilantes but still with rules of engagement (they have tighter control over the use of lethal force than cops in the real world

Its an original setting with new character so there is no gender/race swapping that I'm aware off. Has this story been done in another venue? It seems to stick to what some have demanded: No character with altered but new ones created. *shrug*

Though, I suppose the world might be considered "left" leaning (increased fire arms restrictions and enviormental laws are suggested as existing at least in part though the antagonists are pretty well armed... ) OTOH, Nixon is heralded as one of the great presidents and the 'culture wars'seem to have gone hot, so its no utopia.


Are you this dishonest always or just on the days that end with a Y?

Did I ever said there was any race/gender swapping in this show? The answer is fuck no, so why would you bring it up?

I think I know why you did it, but I would like your confirmation. You did it to paint me and anybody who doesn't like this show as an evul wacist.

And if you didn't do it for that reason then I fail to see what my complaints about other shows are relevant here.

As for how I see a character, unless you think yourself the arbiter of the actual objective truth, (which you probably do) my subjective opinion is just as valid as yours.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

GeekyBugle

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« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2019, 03:24:27 PM »
Those critics really showed the fans. 0.25 on the key demo, about 800k people saw it, and they are already saying it will be only one season, this smells like all the woke comics getting cancelled on the first issue and printing up to 5-6 issues they already had done and paid.

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Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell