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a show that Westerners will denounce

Started by riprock, May 20, 2008, 05:58:25 AM

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riprock

#15
May 21, 2008, 01:33:13 PM
Quote from: John MorrowI've lived in Japan and looking at the opening and ending and I'm curious why you claim "This is a show aimed at 40-year-old Japanese mothers."  From watching the opening and ending on YouTube as well as looking at the air time (Saturday night at around 1AM), that doesn't look like that's the intended audience to me.

When you were in Japan, did you gather actual data on the TV-watching habits of 40-year-old women, or are you just taking a wild guess?
"By their way of thinking, gold and experience goes[sic] much further when divided by one. Such shortsighted individuals are quick to stab their fellow players in the back if they think it puts them ahead. They see the game solely as a contest between themselves and their fellow players.  How sad.  Clearly the game is a contest between the players and the GM.  Any contest against your fellow party members is secondary." Hackmaster Player\'s Handbook

Koltar

#16
May 21, 2008, 01:34:48 PM
I really doubt "westerners" will denounce this show - most of them won't even hear about it.

To be truthful Anime-fans are considered that "new Geek-group" or subculture.
 Most people don't even notice it...and won't notice the show you refer to.

To them, "SPEED RACER" isn't anime - its just that fun cartoon they grew up with wjen they were kids.


- Ed C.
The return of \'You can\'t take the Sky From me!\'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUn-eN8mkDw&feature=rec-fresh+div

This is what a really cool FANTASY RPG should be like :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-WnjVUBDbs

Still here, still alive, at least Seven years now...

riprock

#17
May 21, 2008, 01:34:48 PM
Quote from: John MorrowYes, it's not all that uncommon to hear American anime fans talk about how anime is considered a legitimate and adult in Japan yet that's not quite what I found when I was there.  In fact, my Japanese co-workers razzed each other as otaku (a name that they didn't want to be called) if they seemed to know too much about anime or manga.


Logical fallacies: Missing the point, straw man.

When was I in America?

When did I say that anime is regarded as "legitimate and adult"?

Counterpoint: The pop entertainment produced by Hollywood is not exactly universally lauded as high art in America, yet America doesn't seem to mind making money and propaganda coups from it.  Neither does Japan object to getting profits and soft power from anime.
"By their way of thinking, gold and experience goes[sic] much further when divided by one. Such shortsighted individuals are quick to stab their fellow players in the back if they think it puts them ahead. They see the game solely as a contest between themselves and their fellow players.  How sad.  Clearly the game is a contest between the players and the GM.  Any contest against your fellow party members is secondary." Hackmaster Player\'s Handbook

Ian Absentia

#18
May 21, 2008, 01:43:02 PM
Quote from: ThornhammerCan't denounce it because I won't watch it.
But isn't the fact that you won't be watching the show, itself, a denunciation?

!i!

J Arcane

#19
May 21, 2008, 01:58:44 PM
This thread feels like a response to an argument that never happened, in an attempt to stir up imagined controversy where none was present.

"Westerners" won't "denounce" a show they don't give a flying fuck about, have never heard of, will almost certainly never see, and are unlikely to even reach the same outlandish conclusion you seem to have leaped to.

I'm not sure what the hell response you're expecting on this one, but I advise that if you're gunning for a good troll, you ought to take it to an audience that cares.
Bedroom Wall Press - Games that make you feel like a kid again.

Arcana Rising - An Urban Fantasy Roleplaying Game, powered by Hulks and Horrors.
Hulks and Horrors - A Sci-Fi Roleplaying game of Exploration and Dungeon Adventure
Heaven\'s Shadow - A Roleplaying Game of Faith and Assassination

John Morrow

#20
May 21, 2008, 02:26:01 PM
Quote from: riprockIn short, I think the show depicts an ideal wish-fulfillment family from the perspective of a 40-year-old housewife, as explained in the original post.

Beyond the fact that you made some errors in your assumptions, it does not follow that becuase you think it depicts and ideal wish-fulfillment family from the perspective of a 40 year-old housewife that it was made for that market.
Robin Laws\' Game Styles Quiz Results:
Method Actor 100%, Butt-Kicker 75%, Tactician 42%, Storyteller 33%, Power Gamer 33%, Casual Gamer 33%, Specialist 17%

John Morrow

#21
May 21, 2008, 02:34:24 PM
Quote from: riprockWhen you were in Japan, did you gather actual data on the TV-watching habits of 40-year-old women, or are you just taking a wild guess?

If you knew anything about Japan, Japanese television, and how it is scheduled, you wouldn't be asking that question.  Go spend some time reading a Japanese television schedule.  Pay particular attention to what each show is about, when it's on, and what it's programmed against.  Let me know if you see any patterns.
Robin Laws\' Game Styles Quiz Results:
Method Actor 100%, Butt-Kicker 75%, Tactician 42%, Storyteller 33%, Power Gamer 33%, Casual Gamer 33%, Specialist 17%

John Morrow

#22
May 21, 2008, 02:36:26 PM
Quote from: riprockLogical fallacies: Missing the point, straw man.

I really hit a raw spot with you, didn't I?

Quote from: riprockCounterpoint: The pop entertainment produced by Hollywood is not exactly universally lauded as high art in America, yet America doesn't seem to mind making money and propaganda coups from it.  Neither does Japan object to getting profits and soft power from anime.

And that's relevant to your claim that this show is aimed at 40 year-old housewives how, exactly?
Robin Laws\' Game Styles Quiz Results:
Method Actor 100%, Butt-Kicker 75%, Tactician 42%, Storyteller 33%, Power Gamer 33%, Casual Gamer 33%, Specialist 17%

Ian Absentia

#23
May 21, 2008, 02:50:26 PM
Quote from: J Arcane"Westerners" won't "denounce" a show they don't give a flying fuck about, have never heard of, will almost certainly never see, and are unlikely to even reach the same outlandish conclusion you seem to have leaped to.
Being a Westerner who was totally unaware of this show, you would say that, wouldn't you? Of course, now that you know about it, you're pretty much obligated to seek it out, watch it, then defend it feebly, aren't you? Your kind makes me sick. How do you face yourself in the mirror every morning?

!i!

J Arcane

#24
May 21, 2008, 02:54:46 PM
Quote from: Ian AbsentiaBeing a Westerner who was totally unaware of this show, you would say that, wouldn't you? Of course, now that you know about it, you're pretty much obligated to seek it out, watch it, then defend it feebly, aren't you? Your kind makes me sick. How do you face yourself in the mirror every morning?

!i!
So what you're saying is I've been spending my whole life denouncing all kinds of things without even realizing it?!

It's all so clear to me now!  I'm the keeper of the cheese, and you're the lemon merchant.  The little creatures of nature, they don't know that they're ugly.  I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me, why didn't you believe me?!
Bedroom Wall Press - Games that make you feel like a kid again.

Arcana Rising - An Urban Fantasy Roleplaying Game, powered by Hulks and Horrors.
Hulks and Horrors - A Sci-Fi Roleplaying game of Exploration and Dungeon Adventure
Heaven\'s Shadow - A Roleplaying Game of Faith and Assassination

Ian Absentia

#25
May 21, 2008, 03:48:44 PM
Quote from: J ArcaneSo what you're saying is I've been spending my whole life denouncing all kinds of things without even realizing it?!
Ignorance and inaction are denunciation. It's voting without your feet. Jumping niether up nor down, but tentatively in the middle. A cat in a box that is both dead and not-dead.

But don't worry.  From everything I've heard about them, the Japanese are so ludicrously fantastic and obscene, they can't possibly exist for real.

!i!

Serious Paul

#26
May 21, 2008, 04:01:20 PM
Quote from: KoltarTo be truthful Anime-fans are considered that "new Geek-group" or subculture.

If by new you mean a few decades old, then yeah.

QuoteMost people don't even notice it...and won't notice the show you refer to.

Yup.

J Arcane

#27
May 21, 2008, 04:02:33 PM
Quote from: Ian AbsentiaIgnorance and inaction are denunciation. It's voting without your feet. Jumping niether up nor down, but tentatively in the middle. A cat in a box that is both dead and not-dead.

But don't worry.  From everything I've heard about them, the Japanese are so ludicrously fantastic and obscene, they can't possibly exist for real.

!i!
See, now I can't tell if you're buying into his circular argument, or whether you're continuing with the sarcasm.  

To the former I would note that "denunciation" carries with it far strongger connotations that simply not watching something.

To the latter, I heard they have sex with octopi to enhance their fertility.  A friend of a friend once told my second cousin's step-aunt he saw an octopus dildo on display at a store.
Bedroom Wall Press - Games that make you feel like a kid again.

Arcana Rising - An Urban Fantasy Roleplaying Game, powered by Hulks and Horrors.
Hulks and Horrors - A Sci-Fi Roleplaying game of Exploration and Dungeon Adventure
Heaven\'s Shadow - A Roleplaying Game of Faith and Assassination

Ian Absentia

#28
May 21, 2008, 04:11:53 PM
Quote from: J ArcaneSee, now I can't tell if you're buying into his circular argument, or whether you're continuing with the sarcasm.
Scary, isn't it?
QuoteTo the latter, I heard they have sex with octopi to enhance their fertility.  A friend of a friend once told my second cousin's step-aunt he saw an octopus dildo on display at a store.
Now, see?  That's totally hot.

!i!

riprock

#29
May 21, 2008, 06:58:06 PM
Of course, I wouldn't expect anyone to download torrents.

If, however, you've already spent 24 minutes arguing about it, you might as well double down the time wasted:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sqSXPvS3Jw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zf_12cQeiEw&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvpnYvL6z9M&feature=related
"By their way of thinking, gold and experience goes[sic] much further when divided by one. Such shortsighted individuals are quick to stab their fellow players in the back if they think it puts them ahead. They see the game solely as a contest between themselves and their fellow players.  How sad.  Clearly the game is a contest between the players and the GM.  Any contest against your fellow party members is secondary." Hackmaster Player\'s Handbook
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