Quote from: Haffrung;770194Wands have 10 charges, and they fully renew after a long rest.

Do the need to be Attuned? Do all spells cost 1 charge?

Quote from: Marleycat;769444Oh no...

Guess it's time to cross the Alps. Next stop, Rome and glory!

I like the little line in Basic about how only the most wealthy or eccentric nobility and scholars can afford to buy magic items from the adventurers. Just another way to diminish the expendable nature and commonality of magic items.

All they really need to do is make magic items expensive. If a +1 sword cost a million gold, then, well, adventurers and random lizard cultists wouldn't have them. Problem solved.

The problem D&D keeps running into is wanting magic items to be all over the place AND then detach them from any sensible economy.

Quote from: Will;770355All they really need to do is make magic items expensive. If a +1 sword cost a million gold, then, well, adventurers and random lizard cultists wouldn't have them. Problem solved.

The problem D&D keeps running into is wanting magic items to be all over the place AND then detach them from any sensible economy.

A much better thing to do is to expand attunement much like FantasyCraft and tie it to both level and reputation. Reputation is affected by lifestyle and contacts etc. and hard cap it. At a certain point you cannot have more then a defined number of items case closed. So you can't just have a bunch of items you can easily swap out because even if you aren't attuned to a particular item it STILL counts against your hard cap for total magic items.

Now you have the rationale of why there aren't magic item Walmart's around and why the magic item economy is more like a private auction network or black market set up.

It seems a little fiddly to me...

Here's a fun attunement idea: magic items are jealous/intolerant of one another. You carry two magic items, and one of them is going to murder the other one.

Quote from: Will;770367It seems a little fiddly to me...

Here's a fun attunement idea: magic items are jealous/intolerant of one another. You carry two magic items, and one of them is going to murder the other one.

It's the same concept as saying you can have 3 attuned items and a limited number of non attuned items and/or consumable magic items because or conflicting auras, spell count or whatever. Set the numbers wherever you feel comfortable.

Quote from: Will;770355All they really need to do is make magic items expensive. If a +1 sword cost a million gold, then, well, adventurers and random lizard cultists wouldn't have them. Problem solved.

The problem D&D keeps running into is wanting magic items to be all over the place AND then detach them from any sensible economy.

In the old "grand campaign" form, in which commerce is among players weighing costs, prices naturally find their level. A gizmo sold is no longer available for use. A wizard spending weeks making stuff is a wizard not going out and getting experience. If your ambition is to gain a level per year, a hundred thousand xp is almost 2000 xp per week. If the ref is reducing awards for level -- e.g., a 12th-level figure operating on the 8th dungeon level gets only 2/3 -- then xp get increasingly hard to come by.

In a smaller scale game, my current players were frustrated by getting piles of gold with nothing much they wanted to buy available (at least near the Keep on the Borderlands). Cutting back on the supply of gold (but not xp, so a multiple) while increasing the supply of magic -- especially that to be wrested from the forces of Chaos --is what I'll try if we get back to that.

Quote from: Will;770367It seems a little fiddly to me...

Here's a fun attunement idea: magic items are jealous/intolerant of one another. You carry two magic items, and one of them is going to murder the other one.

There is a fun little story in Dragon about a batch of magic items collaborating during a duel and then conspiring against the user because it was in their own best interest to lose rather then take more damage. (They were really high tech items, but they were used in a fantasy style duel.)

Or a bemusing moment in d20 Gamma World since every bit of equipment is sentient.

Sammas found a box of grenades... It went kinda like this...

"Hey! You. Yes you! Pick me up and pull my pin and throw me. You know you want to..."
"Dont listen to him! Hes a dud. Throw me instead!"
"You? hah! I'll explode much brighter than you you firecracker!"
"psst. Look buddy. I'm really a fragmentation grenade. They just mis-stamped me..."

And the blaster that, well... blasted another gun so a PC couldn't replace it... The PC never found out. He just thought he had been really good at disabling that enemy.

Creates a great backdrop for the barbarian who disdains magic items. Because his tribe had many stories of the shambling remnants of people ridden by their magic items.

Quote from: Will;770367It seems a little fiddly to me...

Here's a fun attunement idea: magic items are jealous/intolerant of one another. You carry two magic items, and one of them is going to murder the other one.

  13th Age actually uses something like that, although it uses a slot/chakra system so that you can have more than one. Still limited to one a slot (two rings, and as many wondrous items as you can find--"wondrous items are not proud"), and if you have too many, the magic items wind up in the driver's seat.

Quote from: Haffrung;770194Wands have 10 charges, and they fully renew after a long rest.

Erm, I just got to read a copy of the Starter Set one of my gaming group brought over. Unless I am missing something, according to Appendix A, page 53.

The Wand of Magic Missiles has 7 Charges and regains 1d6+1 changes at dawn.

Needs no Attunement or spell casting ability, Can cast Magic Missile at level 1, 2 or 3 by expending 1,2 or 3 charges as a Action.

Both the staffs have 10 charges and regain 1d6+4 charges at dawn.
Both need Attunement and you must have the staff's spells on your class list to cast them.
Spider Staff can cast Spider Climb (1 charge) or Web (2 charges, Save DC 15) and deals an additional d6 poison damage when used to attack.
Staff of Defense can cast Mage Armour (1 charge) or Shield (2 charges) and increases your AC by +1 when wielded.



The staffs seem quite nice items. The Wand of Magic Missiles seems a touch overpowered.

Quote from: jadrax;771017Erm, I just got to read a copy of the Starter Set one of my gaming group brought over. Unless I am missing something, according to Appendix A, page 53.

The Wand of Magic Missiles has 7 Charges and regains 1d6+1 changes at dawn.

Needs no Attunement or spell casting ability, Can cast Magic Missile at level 1, 2 or 3 by expending 1,2 or 3 charges as a Action.

Both the staffs have 10 charges and regain 1d6+4 charges at dawn.
Both need Attunement and you must have the staff's spells on your class list to cast them.
Spider Staff can cast Spider Climb (1 charge) or Web (2 charges, Save DC 15) and deals an additional d6 poison damage when used to attack.
Staff of Defense can cast Mage Armour (1 charge) or Shield (2 charges) and increases your AC by +1 when wielded.



The staffs seem quite nice items. The Wand of Magic Missiles seems a touch overpowered.

Meh, you can do 5d4+5 1-2x/day overpowered? Not. And staves need attunement sounds right to me. Either staff is useful by the way.

The magic item atunement rules are not so different from The Fantasy Trip's 'rule of five'. So, it has enough old school street cred that I can stomach the functional purpose of the rule. But I can't stomach the meta rules that rationalize it (all the meditative mumbo jumbo).

The only other item gripe that makes some sense to me is that wands look a little over powered. There is a solution to this: don't hand them out like party favors. All games that possess magic items or machine guns include versions that impart big advantages in combat and that everyone wants. Hand them out if you get off on that sort of thing, and don't if you don't. Pretty simple, really.

Quote from: Larsdangly;771242The magic item atunement rules are not so different from The Fantasy Trip's 'rule of five'. So, it has enough old school street cred that I can stomach the functional purpose of the rule. But I can't stomach the meta rules that rationalize it (all the meditative mumbo jumbo).

I'd have to reread the article but I remember that put me off a little as well. Limiting it to three items seems a little arbitrary but I do like the increased emphasis on giving items a history.

One thing I would like to see in the DMG is a set of guidelines for mundane items becoming enchanted over time through the deeds they are used for in adventures, so the lad who took up his father's sword can keep using it instead of tossing it in a ditch when he finds a Flametongue, for instance.