Seriously, no one is concerned there's just ONE kind of axe?! I mean why that and not Just ONE kind of sword? Seriously?

Quote from: Rincewind1;510656Actually the idea of giving Dex bonus as damage isn't that bad, actually - I'd say that it's something to give to the Fighters in general.

"You are a brute, or a fencer?"

Even perhaps combining the 2 at some level.

I find it difficult to describe exactly why this bugs me, but its one of those things that I hated about 4E.
Basically in D&D how well you place your attack is represented by the attack roll. So its weird when a character rolls and hits just barely, then claims they get a + to damage because they're so amazingly accurate from their high Dex.

(I sort of like systems where Dex gives bonus to hit, then how well you hit adds to damage, although for D&D I think its too much extra subtraction, what with the d20).

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;510671I find it difficult to describe exactly why this bugs me, but its one of those things that I hated about 4E.
Basically in D&D how well you place your attack is represented by the attack roll. So its weird when a character rolls and hits just barely, then claims they get a + to damage because they're so amazingly accurate from their high Dex.

(I sort of like systems where Dex gives bonus to hit, then how well you hit adds to damage, although for D&D I think its too much extra subtraction, what with the d20).

Well, I'd say that a bonus to hit from high STR isn't that sensible neither . I like it though. It's just the wild idea I had, BSJ - what if we use Dex for all the Attack Bonus stuff (like quite a lot of system do), and STR Bonus for damage?

Or combine the two, or allow the player to choose one. The idea that Fighter can have Attack Bonus from Intelligence or Dex or STR in 4e I actually liked - it's such nonsense as "Razor Wit" from the bard that were painful.

Quote from: B.T.;510639Yes, but not so different that I feel that there need to be three different kinds of axes.

Quote from: NightfallSeriously, no one is concerned there's just ONE kind of axe?! I mean why that and not Just ONE kind of sword? Seriously?

Geez, we use 13 different axes.

Quote from: LordVreeg;510675Geez, we use 13 different axes.

Good grief, what system is that for?

LordV,

Yes but that's YOU. Apparently I'm supposed to accept that there's only ONE axe all the time.

Quote from: Rincewind1;510678Good grief, what system is that for?

mine, silly.
I like options and differential in my system.

And since you were mentioning it, it allows for a formula that does what you asked for with ST and Dex (called coordination here, but still...)

Quote from: Nightfall;510679LordV,

Yes but that's YOU. Apparently I'm supposed to accept that there's only ONE axe all the time.

Lol.

Not me, man.
I like my choices.

Quote from: LordVreeg;510697mine, silly.
I like options and differential in my system.

And since you were mentioning it, it allows for a formula that does what you asked for with ST and Dex (called coordination here, but still...)

Too much crunch for me, I'm afraid. But good for you on the latter .

Quote from: Rincewind1;510699Too much crunch for me, I'm afraid. But good for you on the latter .

that IS the hard part always.  Always.

Quote from: Rincewind1;510674Well, I'd say that a bonus to hit from high STR isn't that sensible neither . I like it though. It's just the wild idea I had, BSJ - what if we use Dex for all the Attack Bonus stuff (like quite a lot of system do), and STR Bonus for damage?

Or combine the two, or allow the player to choose one. The idea that Fighter can have Attack Bonus from Intelligence or Dex or STR in 4e I actually liked - it's such nonsense as "Razor Wit" from the bard that were painful.

Well on the Str bonus to hit, D&D is almost the only system where armour makes you harder to hit -  so I don't mind Str-based attack bonuses in D&D since it represents Str helping with armour penetration. 3E did make it more silly by inflating the original bonus a  (a normal 18 was only +1 to hit in 2E, IIRC, and even an 18/00 was only +3).  Dex still makes sense to hit in 3E, at least to me - aiming at weak spots instead of trying to cut through the armour.  

In other games where armour absorbs damage or uses a separate bypass roll, I usually like Dex though other stats are OK, whatever floats your boat.

Quote from: Nightfall;510657Seriously, no one is concerned there's just ONE kind of axe?! I mean why that and not Just ONE kind of sword? Seriously?

There are two axes: an axe and a battleaxe.  For swords, there are longswords, greatswords, and scimitars.  What other options do you want?

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;510653Well, mostly OK.
"Heavy" is one of those things that looks good on paper, but adds slightly less than half a hit point of damage per die, on average.

What would you suggest changing it to?

Sorry this is going to be boring...
 
With Heavy I guess I'd be inclined to use more dice (like going from d8 to 2d4), or just a + to the roll.
 
I know you can get 1s on the reroll, but this is going to happen fairly rarely, so I'm just going to cheat and just use the values for if 1s on the reroll weren't possible.
 
i.e. d8, always reroll 1s would be a range of 2-8, average 5;
same range and average as rolling 2d4. The distribution does differ (v-curve vs. linear) but shouldn't matter unless you have some specific reason to prefer one over the other.
 
The scythe, at roll 2d4, reroll 1s gets twice as much benefit from Heavy, a whole extra point of damage almost, but you end up rerolling a dice almost half the time (actually 7/16ths of the time). It has a range of 4-8 points, average 6. Comparatively rolling 2d4+1 would give you 3-9 damage, slightly more at maximum and less at minimum, but still average 6.
 
The greataxe that did 2d6, reroll 1s is 4-12 damage, average of just under 8 damage; using 3d4 would give you 3-12 and average 7.5, but maybe just 2d6 without the heavy property is big and bad enough already. Even without heavy its already slightly better than the greatsword (d12 being average 6.5, rather than 7).

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;510753Sorry this is going to be boring...
 
With Heavy I guess I'd be inclined to use more dice (like going from d8 to 2d4), or just a + to the roll.
 
I know you can get 1s on the reroll, but this is going to happen fairly rarely, so I'm just going to cheat and just use the values for if 1s on the reroll weren't possible.
 
i.e. d8, always reroll 1s would be a range of 2-8, average 5;
same range and average as rolling 2d4. The distribution does differ (v-curve vs. linear) but shouldn't matter unless you have some specific reason to prefer one over the other.
 
The scythe, at roll 2d4, reroll 1s gets twice as much benefit from Heavy, a whole extra point of damage almost, but you end up rerolling a dice almost half the time (actually 7/16ths of the time). It has a range of 4-8 points, average 6. Comparatively rolling 2d4+1 would give you 3-9 damage, slightly more at maximum and less at minimum, but still average 6.
 
The greataxe that did 2d6, reroll 1s is 4-12 damage, average of just under 8 damage; using 3d4 would give you 3-12 and average 7.5, but maybe just 2d6 without the heavy property is big and bad enough already. Even without heavy its already slightly better than the greatsword (d12 being average 6.5, rather than 7).

we do need to talk more.  while I take this to extremes, this is thge way my mind works.

Quote from: B.T.;510749There are two axes: an axe and a battleaxe.  For swords, there are longswords, greatswords, and scimitars.  What other options do you want?

What would you suggest changing it to?

Really?

curved
Short Sabre
Manople
Sabre
Scimitar
Falchion
Great Shamsheer
Whizzle (2 blade sword)
Grand Shamsheer


straight
Short Sword
Patar
Gladius
Broadsword
Bastard Sword
Great Sword/Claymore
Two Handed Sword
FlameBurg

dress swords
Sword Cane
Foil
Epee
Rapier


but that's just me....