So for those that are unawares, Harmony Gold (the "creators" of Robotech), sued FASA over BattleTech in the early '90s.  It was eventually settled, and everyone went on their merry way.

Warner Bros. announced several months ago that they will be making a live-action Robotech film.  In fact, they named a director (Andy Muschietti) last week.  Not so coincidentally, Harmony Gold is now suing Catalyst Game Labs, Piranha Games, and Harebrained Schemes over BattleTech again.  Pretty much for the same reason as the first time.  They allege that many of the mech designs were outright stolen from Robotech.

First document pertaining to the lawsuit can be found here.  The second document can be found here.

This could potentially get ugly.

It really is the '90s all over again.

It reads better if you -slightly- tweak the capitalization.

"The harebrained Defendants admit harebrained schemes"

That said... it does bring up just how difficult it can seem at times to create 100% original designs for mechs these days.  But once you get down to #28, it looks like Harmony Gold is flat out in the wrong.  33 and 34 may have more merit though, but I can also  see a judge saying the new designs are sufficiently distinct.

Can't look at the doc right now, but many of the original BT mech designs were indeed identical to those from Macross (the anime that was spliced into the first 1/3 of RT) because plastic model kits from Macross were being imported through several channels. I don't remember if it was a case of the BT creators being unaware of the cartoon when they came across the models and figuring nobody would care about the IP, or someone selling them the rights who didn't actually have them to sell. But for a while it seemed BT had dropped those designs and that was that. Did they start using them again, or designs closely based on them?

I liked the Robotech cartoon (part 1, anyway), but I can't say I really care if there is ever a live-action movie as it most likely will suck as most cartoon-to-live-action adaptations do. I'd be curious to know why they chose Andy aka Andrés Muschietti as he has hardly any credits I could locate. Harmony Gold probably smells money in the form of a quick settlement.

Quote from: Arminius;977859Did they start using them again, or designs closely based on them?

Depends on who you ask.  

Quote from: Dumarest;977865Harmony Gold probably smells money in the form of a quick settlement.

Given the amounts raised by KS and the other games sold by Catalyst, I think Harmony Gold is in for a disappointing offer.  

I wonder how much this is about Harmony Gold showing it hasn't abandoned its IP by going after someone they -claim- is infringing on it.  I forget the term, but there's a concept that if you don't pursue challenges to your IP then your IP isn't really yours.  Now, when WB goes out and makes a bunch of toys and posters and such for the movie, Harmony Gold can rightly point out that they take their IP seriously and WB damn well better pay up!

Or not.

Quote from: san dee jota;977869I forget the term, but there's a concept that if you don't pursue challenges to your IP then your IP isn't really yours.

You probably mean laches or abandonment, depending on the situation. Part of why companies like Disney pretty much have to send a C&D to a nursery school using their characters or names unless they want to give up ownership by setting a precedent. The other option is to license it for $1 or other nominal amount so you have a contract proving you still assert ownership but giving the licensee a break.

Quote from: san dee jota;977869Now, when WB goes out and makes a bunch of toys and posters and such for the movie, Harmony Gold can rightly point out that they take their IP seriously and WB damn well better pay up!

That's the money whose stink I was thinking they may have smelt.

Quote from: Celestial;977784The second document can be found here.

This is glorious! It's like seeing two lawyers argue about who would win in a fight between the Enterprise and a Star Destroyer.

Quote from: san dee jota;977825It reads better if you -slightly- tweak the capitalization.

"The harebrained Defendants admit harebrained schemes"

That said... it does bring up just how difficult it can seem at times to create 100% original designs for mechs these days.  But once you get down to #28, it looks like Harmony Gold is flat out in the wrong.  33 and 34 may have more merit though, but I can also  see a judge saying the new designs are sufficiently distinct.

Most of them are pretty clear, in that they are redesigns (probably in a line of redesigns) of the Unseen mechs.

Pg 18-19  compares a Raven(?) to a Glaug, an Atlas to an Armored Valkyrie, and a Hunchback to an Archer. These are AFAIK original FASA designs.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;977961Most of them are pretty clear, in that they are redesigns (probably in a line of redesigns) of the Unseen mechs.

Pg 18-19  compares a Raven(?) to a Glaug, an Atlas to an Armored Valkyrie, and a Hunchback to an Archer. These are AFAIK original FASA designs.

You see this, and I see this, but will a judge see this?  I'm not saying judges are inherently stupid or indifferent to a case regarding robot games, but to a real extent Harmony Gold just has to convince the court these are derivatives of their designs.  And like I said earlier, 100% original mech designs are pretty hard to create anymore without somebody already having done so.  If Harmony Gold teamed up with Palladium Books ("why yes your honor, Palladium -does- have a license to use our designs and derivatives based on them"), it -could- get very scary for the Battletech publishers.

Harmony Gold needs to give up. Robotech is dead. The live-action film is unlikely to get finished, and if it does it will flop; Macross is superior in all ways, and that includes both the size and scope of its fandom (and audience). If Harebrained Schemes had a clue, they'll call up Bandai or Sunrise to see if they could get an assist on their behalf.

The person running this website is a racist who publicly advocates genocidal practices.

I am deleting my content.

I recommend you do the same.

Bradford, back around 2004-2005 it seemed there was a lot of legal ferment over the Macross-Robotech rights; as a Macross purist and partisan I did the best I could to follow along and I thought that Harmony Gold was overstepping in trying to keep new Macross toys/cartoons out of the US. The parties were a little different--I think HG and Tatsunoko were on one side while Studio Nue/Big West were eventually backed by Bandai. Bandai's presence seemed like it should be a huge difference-maker but for some reason HG "won", or at least got the deal they needed to keep doing what they do.

Upshot is that either HG had a better case than I thought or Bandai doesn't see Macross as something worth fighting for. In Japan, they do Macross, but here they seem content to do Gundam and let HG do RT.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;978191You're thinking of trademarks, which have no bearing in this case.

Failure to enforce, protect, and defend IP doesn't just apply to trademarks.

Quote from: Bradford C. Walker;978170Harmony Gold needs to give up. Robotech is dead. The live-action film is unlikely to get finished, and if it does it will flop; Macross is superior in all ways, and that includes both the size and scope of its fandom (and audience). If Harebrained Schemes had a clue, they'll call up Bandai or Sunrise to see if they could get an assist on their behalf.

I'm confident Hollywood will find a way to make a live-action Robotech that sucks so badly that it kills the franchise for a generation.

Haven't seen Macross, though , what is superior about it?